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Old 09-14-2017, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Somewhere in America
12,304 posts, read 10,830,378 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Willistonite View Post
Not going to a nursing home in Florida...that is my plan...
Mine, too!


It's not surprising that several elderly folks died without air conditioning. This happens in heat all summer long all over the country and world. Once you hit 75, your nervous systems begin to drastically change and you're no longer able to regulate your internal thermostat like you once were.

Doctor: Nursing home deaths show the serious risks of being old in Florida - CNN
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Old 09-14-2017, 10:51 PM
 
10,832 posts, read 8,112,177 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
Because I'm not so sure that even if I shell out for an LTCi policy that it will ultimately protect me! Who can wait until they are 75 to pay the rates? So you start in your 50's and hope your rates don't get doubled more than once or twice.

Then you hope that there are no loopholes in the policy once you try to start collecting. These can be complicated policies, ones that laypeople have much less experience with than your typical auto or homeowner's policies. If I could easily afford a policy I'd feel better taking such chances - but to lay out so much money and still have "things" happen would be pretty bad.
Since this thread is about nursing home care, it's worth mentioning that statistically very few people (under 5%) spend more than 1-3 years in nursing homes.
If someone can afford to self-pay for a couple of years, then I don't see that they're taking a big risk by planning to self-insure and then later spend down.

I'm probably biased by the quality of the nursing homes in my area; they're a mixture of private pay and medicaid, none are substandard to the extent described in the OP.
That said, if LTCi premium costs were anywhere in line with auto and homeowner insurance, I'd be first in line to buy it.
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Old 09-14-2017, 11:12 PM
 
Location: Was Midvalley Oregon; Now Eastside Seattle area
4,271 posts, read 1,955,318 times
Reputation: 3273
IRRC, a spend down within 5 years of LTC, could result in reclamation from any heirs.
If there is a spend down, the facility/medicare will claim SS except for $50/mn for personal expenses.

In our situation, with LTCi, I fully expect to subsidize Medicare and expect further increases in insurance costs which has more than doubled in 15yr (?). I just don't want spouse and heirs to be hamper with choosing a facility. JMO, I think the facility will give me better care . Really.
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Old 09-14-2017, 11:19 PM
 
10,832 posts, read 8,112,177 times
Reputation: 17082
Quote:
Originally Posted by leastprime View Post
IRRC, a spend down within 5 years of LTC, could result in reclamation from any heirs.
If there is a spend down, the facility/medicare will claim SS except for $50/mn for personal expenses.

In our situation, with LTCi, I fully expect to subsidize Medicare
Your plan is a no-go. Medicare doesn't pay LTC expenses.
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Old 09-14-2017, 11:48 PM
 
412 posts, read 165,398 times
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I would not do this unless I had to. These Medicaid nursing homes are not a good way to live.
I have seen too many that were horrible. I will take my chances at home with a nurse or live using my own money for as long as I can.
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Old 09-15-2017, 12:20 AM
 
51 posts, read 24,913 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastprime View Post

In our situation, with LTCi, I fully expect to subsidize Medicare and expect further increases in insurance costs which has more than doubled in 15yr (?). I just don't want spouse and heirs to be hamper with choosing a facility. JMO, I think the facility will give me better care . Really.
Medicare will only pay for 90 days of skilled nursing in a nursing home (in one year's time). To qualify, you need some type of specialized care such as respiratory therapy, physical therapy, etc. They do not pay just for you to be a resident in a nursing home.
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Old 09-15-2017, 01:44 AM
 
103 posts, read 49,697 times
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My mother had the best LTC policy she could afford. It had a six month wait before it would pay anything. She went into assisted living as private pay. After six months she fell and broke her hip. Medicare and her supplement paid for the first month in the nursing home.

She was declining rapidly so we choose to bring in hospice. At that point Medicare stopped paying. She died four weeks later and the LTC policy paid for 28 days. It was only enough to cover half the cost of those days.

While she was in the nursing facility we had to continue to pay for her assisted living apartment and they demanded a thirty day notice so we had to pay for the month after she died. She had a LTC policy and savings but she still would have run out of money if she had lived longer. No one should feel secure unless you have an endless supply of funds.
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Old 09-15-2017, 02:18 AM
 
72,349 posts, read 72,289,871 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biscuitmom View Post
Since this thread is about nursing home care, it's worth mentioning that statistically very few people (under 5%) spend more than 1-3 years in nursing homes.
If someone can afford to self-pay for a couple of years, then I don't see that they're taking a big risk by planning to self-insure and then later spend down.

I'm probably biased by the quality of the nursing homes in my area; they're a mixture of private pay and medicaid, none are substandard to the extent described in the OP.
That said, if LTCi premium costs were anywhere in line with auto and homeowner insurance, I'd be first in line to buy it.
statistics were very very wrong .

the statistics were flawed for a number of reasons , which is why insurers got burned when they set premium prices . it took many years for insurers to get premiums to match usage .

statistic's were based on a generation ago that did not live as long for starters . but the biggest flaw was the fact that those who need long term care are not all in a snf . many like my dad were in private homes and cared for by retired caretakers .

so basically all these people fall off the grid . no one ever knew my dad was being cared for 24/7 for 5 years to put him in a statistic .

insurers found this was the case all over and early policies were priced based on much lower usage.

family took on the burden a lot more too . which usually ended in splitting up families as lives were ruined socially and financially .

so don't believe the old statistics for a second .

as the insurers found out ,those with insurance use it .
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Old 09-15-2017, 02:21 AM
 
72,349 posts, read 72,289,871 times
Reputation: 49867
Quote:
Originally Posted by leastprime View Post
IRRC, a spend down within 5 years of LTC, could result in reclamation from any heirs.
If there is a spend down, the facility/medicare will claim SS except for $50/mn for personal expenses.

In our situation, with LTCi, I fully expect to subsidize Medicare and expect further increases in insurance costs which has more than doubled in 15yr (?). I just don't want spouse and heirs to be hamper with choosing a facility. JMO, I think the facility will give me better care . Really.
medicare pays for a very limited time under certain conditions . nor do they pay for assisted living .
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Old 09-15-2017, 05:03 AM
 
10,604 posts, read 14,273,087 times
Reputation: 17208
Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63 View Post
Because I'm not so sure that even if I shell out for an LTCi policy that it will ultimately protect me! Who can wait until they are 75 to pay the rates? So you start in your 50's and hope your rates don't get doubled more than once or twice.

Then you hope that there are no loopholes in the policy once you try to start collecting. These can be complicated policies, ones that laypeople have much less experience with than your typical auto or homeowner's policies. If I could easily afford a policy I'd feel better taking such chances - but to lay out so much money and still have "things" happen would be pretty bad. Frankly, I've had 3 female relatives spend years in nursing homes - private pay to begin with and then on Medicaid after their money finally ran out - maybe they just got lucky with the facilities they were in?
Yes they're complicated for sure. Lots of choices like do you want it to kick in right away and pay more or are you able to hold off. I just got a few quotes reviewing mine and I found them all reasonable for my needs. Somewhere capping at $350 per month. That happens to be my HOA fee.

There ARE pre existing "exclusions" or "surcharges" so you want to get the policy before you have those conditions. There are many threads here discussing the particulars.

A better alternative may be to buy into a life care CCRC which has a decades long track record which offers Independent, Assisted, Memory Care and Skilled Nursing - all four stages. It's it's own LTC insurance plan, essentially.

Because even IF you have insurance or CASH you can't always get placement in the better SNF, which happened to my own mother. She had a ton of money enough to last her life at HOME paying for 24 hour RN care but her lawyer wouldn't permit that (!) and there were no openings in the better SNF in our area.

The problem is people don't even think about their senior years until it's too late to save enough equity in their existing homes or savings to buy INTO the CCRC and pay the monthly "rent" which varies by geographic location, CCRC and size of the home or "condo" you buy into.

They range from about $2200 up, and the better ones I'm familiar with in FL where I work as a private contractor average around $4000 per month for a couple in a two bedroom. And I've noticed many are faith based (even if they don't have any requirements for affiliation and act non-denominational)...or started out that way decades ago.

They also have a few different options not just the standard "equity payment and subsequent rent" type of thing.

Weird to me that people who retire at 65 or 70 are still buying big houses, getting MORTGAGES (and car loans for $35K SUVS)...and dismiss the very thought of choosing a CCRC because they think everyone is 85 and vegetating in there. LOL It's simply a community and no different than the HOA they're moving to...and they even renovate your apartment or villa to your specifications...and better because a meal is included and LOTS more amenities! I know a lady who moved with her husband to Independent 20 years ago and is still not even close to going to the Assisted or other options. I know her because she's the first one I see bopping around first thing at 7AM hair and makeup done, dressed and BUSY going out to her car to start her day LOL. She's GOT to be 75 because you had to be 55 to move in there.

And God forbid she breaks a hip, gets macular degeneration or cancer - she simply moves to another building on the campus for no additional charges (or can pay their in-house agency for HHA aides in her Independent home if she doesn't want to move right away).

https://www.actsretirement.org/

Last edited by runswithscissors; 09-15-2017 at 05:29 AM..
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