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Old 09-28-2017, 01:33 AM
 
71,535 posts, read 71,712,424 times
Reputation: 49120

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i found that forum to be over populated with those who think they know it all and got it all figured out . they are very closed mined as a group and i gave up posting there quite a while ago . i have zero interest in that site
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Old 09-28-2017, 03:03 AM
 
Location: RVA
2,165 posts, read 1,265,978 times
Reputation: 4456
It’s just so unrealistic because very few can duplicate his success by copying what he did, because for one, he has filled that “niche” with a clever name and he CAN write well enough to earn from his blog. I stopped visiting both MMM & FS sites after a few visits because it became quickly obvious that the intent of the site was to lure you back as much as possible. More visits are more hits which earns them more money from sponsers. I learned nothing compared to what when I’ve found on C-D! I was really turned off by FS when he stated that the sweet spot of income is $250k/yr in SanFran and he made his money on Wall Street and SanFran & Hawaii real estate. He buys “successful” blog sites. Really? How is that remotely applicable to the average person?

Sure, it is another example of “thinking outside the box”, but as someone who knows many that thought outside that box and are totally broke, that advice is as sound as the old as the joke “How do you retire with a million dollars?” First, you start with 2 million then you invest in something you really know nothing about but think you do.....

Sheer numbers dictate that the chances of success at their levels (and I don’t doubt that they are wealthy and successful) or even close, are very low. How many MMM similar blogs/ sites are there? A few dozen, maybe?

Sure, thats what I want to chance my life on, a 36/100,000,000 chance of success that requires daily upkeep and a je ne sais quoi skill set. Its like “how hard can it be to a successful author?” I mean, JK Rowling made billions, and she had little business sense when she started. First, write a captivating series of books, that will be made in to blockbuster movies, then....

Financial success can occur slow and steady, or circumstance can hand you the right skill set to make it faster and sooner. My college roomate and I are good friends, and he is a multimillionaire. He was always incredibly competitive and a born leader. Then add intelligence and technical skills and business accumen on top of that and he makes starting and running a successful software business look like a Betty Crocker recipe for success. He’s done that twice and each time sold the company for millions. Then add his college GF, a virtual twin that became his wife, and just as successful and he makes it look like everyone else is a putz! And they are still great people to know with great grown kids now on top of that.

I admit, I had no idea that blogging could pay that well. Are those numbers substantiated?

Last edited by Perryinva; 09-28-2017 at 03:27 AM..
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Old 09-28-2017, 04:41 AM
 
6,353 posts, read 5,158,773 times
Reputation: 8527
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjseliga View Post
It's not like it is rocket science or brain surgery!

1. Graduate from college with little to no debt at the age of 22.
2. Immediately after graduating, get a high paying job ($125k-150k+) with a very generous 401k plan, that you love doing, or at the very least enjoy.
3. Live way below your means, taking the money you save to invest accordingly.
4. (Bonus) Marry someone with a like mindset that makes the same as you.
5. Retire when you're 30!
Retire on what?

If you make $150K per year for 8 years, before taxes, you've made $1.2 million. That's about $900K after taxes, and it costs something (MMM says $25K a year) to live, so you're down to $700K.

When you "retire" at 30, if you invest $700K at a 4% real rate of return, which is way above the bond market rate of return so it's not in any sense guaranteed, you're making $28K a year. That is more than $25K so you've got it made...unless you have to pay for health insurance, deductibles, and copays (don't we all?); need a car; need a roof on the house that I didn't budget for in the previous paragraph; someone in the family needs financial help; you have kids (most people eventually do); shall I continue?

Go to work. If you can quit and set up a business, as I did, it's still work, even if it's also fun. You'd need many millions to retire at 30.
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Old 09-28-2017, 04:46 AM
 
2,512 posts, read 1,332,170 times
Reputation: 4607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Densi52 View Post
Where did you find that info about his income? I know JD Roth made a bundle when he sold his blog, How to Get Rich Slowly. He's now blogging again -- very uninteresting -- as Money Boss.

I am too old for Mr Moustache's site but I still read his posts every so often.
How much Mr. Money Mustache spends each year - Business Insider

I'm not sure I believe it is that high, but I'm sure he is making a nice income off of it
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Old 09-28-2017, 04:47 AM
 
2,443 posts, read 2,070,942 times
Reputation: 5690
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
i found that forum to be over populated with those who think they know it all and got it all figured out . they are very closed mined as a group and i gave up posting there quite a while ago . i have zero interest in that site
Interesting post.
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Old 09-28-2017, 05:27 AM
 
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
22,558 posts, read 39,944,045 times
Reputation: 23693
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Siegel View Post
Retire on what?

If you make $150K per year for 8 years, before taxes, you've made $1.2 million. That's about $900K after taxes, and it costs something (MMM says $25K a year) to live, so you're down to $700K.
...
Go to work. If you can quit and set up a business, as I did, it's still work, even if it's also fun. You'd need many millions to retire at 30.
many millions?

Done right... (as MMM did with a minor portion of his portfolio...) investment Real Estate (RE) NETS 7-10% All of mine has since I was age 19... + appreciation~17% is my life-long average (17% Appreciation + 13% income return)

so... make a million (EZ for double income professionals),
Drop $500k into a cash flowing RE investment (some will argue THAT is not following the GOD ordained... 'C-D 'retirement rules''. we were GONE... overseas for 10 yrs of our 40 yrs Investment RE ownership, the sky never fell (Yet...)
Be more 'rational' ? with the remaining $500k).

Live happily-ever-after (or at least until you get totally exhausted from others telling you how IMPOSSIBLE it is to retire frugally..) THEN you can SELL your PAID OFF investment RE 'on-contract' and still reap 5-7%.

Yes, the naysayers are swarming again. CARRY a NOTE May it NEVER be!!! (I have (4) retired RE investor friends who sold in their 70'- 90's and are still enjoying the $10k+ / month CASH income. Their sky has not fallen either! (yet...) Yes... it CAN happen, but prudent 'early-retired' investors have not been sitting on their thumbs for 50 yrs in 'retirement', so they have LOTS of options / other investments / cushion. Carrying a 70% RE note on strong cash flowing property could be a good thing if you are so certain the buyer will default
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Old 09-28-2017, 07:31 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,579 posts, read 17,561,360 times
Reputation: 27650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Perryinva View Post
It’s just so unrealistic because very few can duplicate his success by copying what he did, because for one, he has filled that “niche” with a clever name and he CAN write well enough to earn from his blog. I stopped visiting both MMM & FS sites after a few visits because it became quickly obvious that the intent of the site was to lure you back as much as possible. More visits are more hits which earns them more money from sponsers. I learned nothing compared to what when I’ve found on C-D! I was really turned off by FS when he stated that the sweet spot of income is $250k/yr in SanFran and he made his money on Wall Street and SanFran & Hawaii real estate. He buys “successful” blog sites. Really? How is that remotely applicable to the average person?

Sure, it is another example of “thinking outside the box”, but as someone who knows many that thought outside that box and are totally broke, that advice is as sound as the old as the joke “How do you retire with a million dollars?” First, you start with 2 million then you invest in something you really know nothing about but think you do.....

Sheer numbers dictate that the chances of success at their levels (and I don’t doubt that they are wealthy and successful) or even close, are very low. How many MMM similar blogs/ sites are there? A few dozen, maybe?

Sure, thats what I want to chance my life on, a 36/100,000,000 chance of success that requires daily upkeep and a je ne sais quoi skill set. Its like “how hard can it be to a successful author?” I mean, JK Rowling made billions, and she had little business sense when she started. First, write a captivating series of books, that will be made in to blockbuster movies, then....

Financial success can occur slow and steady, or circumstance can hand you the right skill set to make it faster and sooner. My college roomate and I are good friends, and he is a multimillionaire. He was always incredibly competitive and a born leader. Then add intelligence and technical skills and business accumen on top of that and he makes starting and running a successful software business look like a Betty Crocker recipe for success. He’s done that twice and each time sold the company for millions. Then add his college GF, a virtual twin that became his wife, and just as successful and he makes it look like everyone else is a putz! And they are still great people to know with great grown kids now on top of that.

I admit, I had no idea that blogging could pay that well. Are those numbers substantiated?
Exactly.

Financial Samurai has a list of "how much should you have in your 401k by age..?"

https://www.financialsamurai.com/how...ifferent-ages/

For age 30, the low end is $100,000. The high end is $350,000. Again, I don't run in affluent circles and live in BFE Tennessee, so I don't know many affluent people, but even the $100,000 seems pretty damn high. When the median income in my area is in the mid $30k range, that's barely enough to subsist for one person. A frugal person can save something, but they sure aren't going to be maxing out the 401k from 22.

Maybe things are better for kids today, but I graduated in 2010. I started out making $29,000/year. That was all I could get. There is no way I could max out the 401k on that. While I acknowledge that was a bad salary, aside from nurses and other health workers, most of my friends weren't doing much better. I was having to commute 500 miles a week to even get that salary.

This is another impractical piece of advice he gives.

Spoiler
"A straightforward way to maximum savings is to make your 401k maximum contribution automatic, and save every other paycheck for the rest of your working life. Once you maximize your 401k and save over 50% of your after-tax income for at least 10 years in a row, you will be financially free to do whatever you want"


A) This assumes you even have access to a 401k plan and company benefits. Many low end workers do not.
B) Let's say you make around the US median salary of $50,000. That's only $32,000 remaining, and that has to pay for all other taxes and living expenses. It's hard to make it on $32,000 pre-tax in most areas.
C) Let's say you have the $32,000 pre-tax income, then you save half of what is left after that after tax. What do you have left to go on monthly? $1,000? Less?

Some of the comments are absolutely asinine. Someone making "OK money" at $275,000/yr? Another comment from a guy earning $80,000/month asking what he should do? And at age 23? I'm guessing this person is a pro-athlete?

There was a comment from a guy making $32,000 a year. FS recommends driving Uber or TaskRabbit. While that may be good for some beer money, a guy making $32,000 needs a better job.

Another zinger.

Spoiler
Check out: Income Profiles OF Financially Free People. Are you working 80 hours a week to try and get ahead? Have you started your own website to leverage a platform that could rich out to millions to brand yourself and sell your products and services?

If not, don’t worry. You’ve got so much upside. Once I started Financial Samurai in 2009, a whole new avenue of making money came to me, even though making more money was not my main gaol for starting this site.


Many "moonlight" operations don't pay that well. While "working 80 hours a week" will likely get you more income, someone that low is just going to move from lower to working class to working/lower middle class. Given the scale of the figures, it doesn't move the needle that much.

The advice is impractical for all but the top % of earners, and the comments section are nothing but people congratulating each other.

The info is mostly useless.
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Old 09-28-2017, 07:33 AM
 
6,447 posts, read 3,456,304 times
Reputation: 10242
Totally off topic, but when I saw the title of this thread this is what came to mind:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Zj36m0heWs
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:24 AM
 
118 posts, read 96,302 times
Reputation: 157
While his story is pretty interesting and blog posts are informative. He is the benefactor of his age, getting into computer science at his time while that industry was going through transformation opened up many more opportunities that people already established in careers or were too young to obtain. Secondly on his age, during his college years was right before the hyperinflation of college costs (https://www.usnews.com/education/bes...l-universities).

A lot of people question his use of the word "retired" well I find he is doing what he wants to do. My dad retired as a bricklayer, he still lays brick or rehabs brick work on homes, businesses, and charities on his own or with another retired buddy of his. He does this because he enjoys it, gets him out of the house, talk with people he would've never talked to before and earns a little extra to spoil him and my mom or his grandkids on.

In regard to their forum, it does seem like a lot of patting on the back, but also is a support and guidance system for those struggling or questioning if things are working.
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:30 AM
 
13,894 posts, read 7,400,560 times
Reputation: 25379
Quote:
Originally Posted by cobra86 View Post
A lot of people question his use of the word "retired" well I find he is doing what he wants to do.
Yep. It's "alternate career", not retired. For me, "retired" means I live off savings, passive income, and my Social Security check.
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