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Old 12-01-2018, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Chicago area
14,385 posts, read 7,918,717 times
Reputation: 53483

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I've been so sick back in my 30's that I didn't care if I died. I also felt that way last May after I broke my arm and shattered my wrist. The pain was debilitating and relentless. The Oxycodone helped for awhile but it had it's own problems. I dreaded going to therapy 3x a week because it was torture. I'm over 6 months post op but still having problems. I'm glad I didn't die, but at the time, I just wanted the nightmare to end.
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Old 12-01-2018, 03:49 PM
 
Location: Honolulu
1,069 posts, read 1,469,384 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
Evidently I'm one of the few regulars here, who thinks that the world is mostly improving. Life today is safer, more commodious and more pleasant than probably at any prior time. I miss the equity bull-market of the 1980s and 1990s. I'd like to have been active during the heyday of my profession (aeronautical engineering)... 1930s through 1960s. And I'm disappointed that at least by my reckoning, the pace of innovation is attenuating.

But were I to have had children (which, for myriad reasons, I don't), I'd feel optimistic about their prospects, vs. my own, and would feel even more optimistic about the grandchildren's prospects.

None of this however is enough to actually recommend having children, or a long life for one's own self. I'm better off today, than I'd have been 50 or 100 or 200 or whatever years ago. But best off, is to outright never having been born. So, while I'm optimistic about humanity and human history overall, I'm skeptical of the ultimate, the "ontological" value of intelligent life.
I agree that in general life is getting better, but are you saying that it's better for everyone, yourself included, to have never been born. In other words nothing (not being born) outweighs all the good and bad one experiences from living?
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Old 12-01-2018, 05:12 PM
 
7,913 posts, read 5,034,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WannabeCPA View Post
I agree that in general life is getting better, but are you saying that it's better for everyone, yourself included, to have never been born. In other words nothing (not being born) outweighs all the good and bad one experiences from living?
It's a profound philosophical dilemma. It would be ridiculously presumptuous for me to speak for others, and yet, the implication of any philosophical assertion, is that we are indeed speaking on behalf of humanity overall, rather than uttering a narrowly personal opinion.

That said... we certainly can and should seek to improve our situation, and the situation of those around us. This is not impossible or futile. Real progress is entirely possible, and indeed, has been accumulating. Nevertheless, that nowise contradicts the assertion, that the unpleasantness and setbacks of life, outweigh the pleasures, elations, satisfactions and achievements.

The 100th anniversary of WW1 just passed, so I'll invoke that as analogy. Suppose that you're sitting in a muddy, wretched trench on the front-lines. Certainly, it is better to seek warmth, to eat as heartily as one can, to support one's comrades, to keep faith that peace will eventually come, and so forth. To just sink into the mud (literally) isn't mere dereliction of duty. It's foolish and only exacerbates the pangs and sufferings of one's situation. So, one does what one can, to maintain good cheer and good health. But even with the best of efforts, the case remains, that sitting in a trench is overall a nasty thing. Even if one enjoys the jokes muttered by one's fellows, even if one scribbles inspired poetry on paper-scraps and stuffs them into one's coat-pocket for posterity's enlightenment, even if one gleans new and fascinating insights into human nature and existence and so forth, well, even then, the trench-experience is best avoided. One endures it as best as one can. But that doesn't render it a good experience, an experience that one ought to have sought out, an experience for which one ought to be grateful.

Well, by my reckoning, life itself is a bit like sitting in that trench. It's laudable and wise, to write that poetry, to gaze at the clouds and to listen to the birds and to engage in whimsical banter with one's trench-mates. But we're still in the trench! And however well we endure, it would have been better, to have never been drafted into the war of life.
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Old 12-01-2018, 05:41 PM
 
Location: VT; previously MD & NJ
2,202 posts, read 1,342,982 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschrief View Post
Have you ever gotten to the point where you really don't care if you live or die?

Living is hard, dying isn't all that hard from what I've seen. I know, some diseases are painful but, say, if you are diagnosed with extensive heart disease, did you ever get to the point where you were resigned to it?

Please don't try to dissect this post. I'm just asking.
My mother reached this point. Her eyesight was nearly gone, she had had 2 major strokes, and my father was already gone. She decided she had enough (her words). We arranged for her to go to a hospice facility and she stopped eating and drinking. Took about a week. It was hard for me to watch her do this, but I had to respect her wishes. On some level, I did understand her feelings.
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Old 12-02-2018, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Dayton, OH
604 posts, read 272,944 times
Reputation: 2643
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewbieHere View Post
Why do you drag politics into this thread? That’s the sad part.
I "drag(ged) politics into this thread" because politics is all around us and profoundly effects our lives.

Even if you choose to bury your head in the sand and personally ignore the political noise, you are still affected by taxes, infrastructure, schools, healthcare, employment, the economy, social issues, and all the other things politicians seek to manipulate and control.

If you have figured out a way to live life without experiencing the influences of local, regional, national, and global politics, do tell.
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Old 12-02-2018, 09:26 AM
 
8,195 posts, read 11,908,623 times
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Originally Posted by Gerania View Post
Oh, step off.
All the people who repped my post disagree.
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Old 12-02-2018, 11:56 AM
 
Location: Verde Valley AZ
8,615 posts, read 9,678,443 times
Reputation: 10955
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
My mother reached this point. Her eyesight was nearly gone, she had had 2 major strokes, and my father was already gone. She decided she had enough (her words). We arranged for her to go to a hospice facility and she stopped eating and drinking. Took about a week. It was hard for me to watch her do this, but I had to respect her wishes. On some level, I did understand her feelings.

My mom too but it took her 11 days to pass. I felt so bad for her and was thankful she was 'out of it' most of the time. Couldn't talk, eat, drink...nothing. I understood her feelings but didn't want to let go. I think we are pre-programmed for acceptance when the time actually comes that we have "had enough". I've felt that way for a long time and dealing with as many terminal patients as I have in the past it became a 'normal' thing to hear from them.
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Old 12-02-2018, 12:11 PM
 
1,527 posts, read 633,723 times
Reputation: 5072
I have not yet reached that point, but I am relatively healthy and financially stable. If ever I reach a point where I cannot care for myself due to mental and/or physical debility, I think I would rather not continue living. I am very independent and have a great fear of not being self-sufficient. My experience has been that I cannot rely on others.
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Old 12-02-2018, 01:26 PM
 
245 posts, read 78,938 times
Reputation: 997
I'm not afraid of death at all. Everybody dies at some point. I just want to die quickly, not rotting away in some hell hole nursing home for a few years.
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Old 12-02-2018, 01:32 PM
 
Location: Central NY
4,666 posts, read 3,241,188 times
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My sister had Hospice for about 3 weeks or so. Don't really remember. It was a hard time. I knew she wasn't going to get any nourishment, but I believe she did. It was a tough time for me. Her daughter wanted to stay as un-involved in it as possible so had no one to talk to about it. But thinking about my sister now, she was in really bad shape and maybe the medical people knew death wasn't far off so they did a different program for her. She was very sick and it was killing me every time I went to see her. She refused to stay in bed, wanted to be on the floor so they put the heavy plastic mats all over. She rolled all over the place. She'd poop the diaper and it would come up over the waistband of her pants.

It truly was a relief when she passed away.
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