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Old 12-13-2018, 08:29 AM
 
1,137 posts, read 570,860 times
Reputation: 4370

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The last few posts also point out why taking SS at a later age than 62 (i.e. FRA for example), is financially a better option for people without huge savings. I am very sentient and concerned about what happens to my wife when I finally book my big vacation at "Hades Acres & Last Resort".

One of the reasons I had worked to FRA is so that our income ensured that DW wouldn't have to file before her FRA too, so when the time comes, she will be eligible for my SS+DRCs. That doesn't mitigate the fact that she should expect ~31% drop in SS, but we have time to make that even more financially tenable between now and when the "travel voucher" arrives for my well-earned vacation.

I am happy to see that there are so many people on here reading the forum before they pull the plug on their working lives. At least they have access to a broad base of info here, some of which might actually apply to their own unique situation.
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Old 12-13-2018, 08:34 AM
 
71,700 posts, read 71,801,099 times
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people hate to hear it , but an under funded retirement can gain the equivelant of saving as much as 800k by working until 70 .

yeah , i know the story , not everyone can or will work that long , but that does not change the fact that for an underfunded retirement working longer can be the silver bullet .

anyone who thinks working longer or finding a job at 62 is tough try it at 80
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Old 12-13-2018, 08:38 AM
 
Location: SoCal
13,252 posts, read 6,345,210 times
Reputation: 9873
I’m not sure how much to believe this story. My brothers used to work for McDonnell Douglas, not even 20 years, but their pensions were fold into their current companies.

Last edited by NewbieHere; 12-13-2018 at 09:34 AM..
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Old 12-13-2018, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Nescopeck, Penna. (birthplace)
12,351 posts, read 7,515,215 times
Reputation: 15955
McDonnell-Douglas' fate was sealed on Friday, May 27, 1979 -- the day when an American Airlines DC-10 lost a recently re-fitted engine and crashed upon takeoff at Chicago, killing over 200, A mechanic who authorized the faulty re-fit later committed suicide. During the rest of that year, several competitors to American emphasized that they did not fly DC-10's -- rough game!

This is not the only instance of failure to see a bigger picture and plan long term which I could cite. When AT&T broke up, it's highly-regarded Bell Labs subsidiary went to Lucent Technologies: unfortunately, so did a lot of not-as-easily-seen liabilities, and a few years later, Lucent "tanked"; it was acquired. for the proverbial song, by Alcatel.

And I have no idea how to explain these things to people with an inadequate education.
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Old 12-13-2018, 08:46 AM
 
Location: SoCal
13,252 posts, read 6,345,210 times
Reputation: 9873
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2nd trick op View Post
McDonnell-Douglas' fate was sealed on Friday, May 27, 1979 -- the day when an American Airlines DC-10 lost an engine and crashed upon takeoff at Chicago, killing over 200, A mechanic who authorized the faulty re-fit late committed suicide. During the rest of that year, several competitors to American emphasized that they did not fly DC-10's -- rough game!

This is not the only instance of failure to see a bigger picture and plan long term which I could cite. When AT&T broke up, it's highly-regarded Bell Labs subsidiary went to Lucent Technologies: unfortunately, so did a lot of not-as-easily-seen liabilities, and a few years later, Lucent "tanked"; it was acquired. for the proverbial song, by Alcatel.

And I have no idea how to explain these things to people with an inadequate education.
According to a lady who worked at HQ for McDonnell Douglas, I met her through volunteer work, McDonnell was thinking of purchasing Boeing or Hughes. I interviewed there in 1986-1987, they made me an offer, but at the time taken into account of benefits, itís best for me to stay put.
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Old 12-13-2018, 08:56 AM
 
Location: NYC
2,917 posts, read 1,591,544 times
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My parents were barely educated, their grasp on economics & finances were minimal - my father, a Depression kid, just worked 2 jobs simultaneously his entire life as his "plan", one was a "good job" - it had a pension. That was his Ace in the Hole as he always told me growing up. I can imagine he would be in a similar position as the fellow in the news story if his company shut down after 29 years & he had to hustle with a series of low paying jobs while raising kids & paying bills & for his healthcare.

My mother hasn't the slightest grasp of anything relating to financial issues. It simply was never a part of her universe nor can she comprehend what stocks, mutual funds, markets, etc... are. She was a homemaker with barely an education. Thank god dad talked her into getting a low-end state job in middle age where she gets a small pension & health insurance after 10 years. Dad was street smart, mom hasn't a clue.

She has made what I think are unwise financial decisions since he died 25+ years ago but she can't understand it at all. I won't go into them but they are several. She simply has never been exposed to a world where you need to be more savvy than simply working hard at your job, go to church & keep a tidy house & then you'll be rewarded for doing the right thing in life (as she understood it coming of age). I could go on but the news story could easily be about my parents, or most of their friends of that era, who just manage to get by, some better than others, I understand their plight & I think anyone who judges them doesn't understand the path, & the world, they were a part of.
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Old 12-13-2018, 09:24 AM
 
1,098 posts, read 491,164 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by treeluvr View Post
I'm the opposite. I figured out a long time ago that the thing that scares me most is running out of money. Even though I am retired with sufficient and (mostly) stable income sources, I continue to save. I love saving money. To me, money in the bank is security. And, I guess security is happiness.
Me too, expect for the retired part.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hefe View Post
My parents were barely educated, their grasp on economics & finances were minimal - my father, a Depression kid, just worked 2 jobs simultaneously his entire life as his "plan", one was a "good job" - it had a pension. That was his Ace in the Hole as he always told me growing up. I can imagine he would be in a similar position as the fellow in the news story if his company shut down after 29 years & he had to hustle with a series of low paying jobs while raising kids & paying bills & for his healthcare.

My mother hasn't the slightest grasp of anything relating to financial issues. It simply was never a part of her universe nor can she comprehend what stocks, mutual funds, markets, etc... are. She was a homemaker with barely an education. Thank god dad talked her into getting a low-end state job in middle age where she gets a small pension & health insurance after 10 years. Dad was street smart, mom hasn't a clue.

She has made what I think are unwise financial decisions since he died 25+ years ago but she can't understand it at all. I won't go into them but they are several. She simply has never been exposed to a world where you need to be more savvy than simply working hard at your job, go to church & keep a tidy house & then you'll be rewarded for doing the right thing in life (as she understood it coming of age). I could go on but the news story could easily be about my parents, or most of their friends of that era, who just manage to get by, some better than others, I understand their plight & I think anyone who judges them doesn't understand the path, & the world, they were a part of.
This is a good insight. I grew up with a similar mentality (follow the rules, do everything right, stay out of trouble, things will work out). Not everyone realizes as early, or at all, that things are different now and you have to be much more shrewd in today's world. It's often not enough to be a compliant loyal trusting upstanding worker bee.
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Old 12-13-2018, 09:35 AM
 
6,294 posts, read 4,740,348 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hefe View Post
..... I understand their plight & I think anyone who judges them doesn't understand the path, & the world, they were a part of.
To my way of think the issue is not judging. Do we take away the rights of those who make mistakes where by full choice or ignorance?


The issue is just as relevant today as it was 50 years ago with the subject of the article. People can fail to participate or to contribute to 401k plans. They can do early withdrawals, pay the penalties and spend the money on anything they want. They can run their own businesses and fail to save for retirement or emergencies. They can borrow amounts they cannot afford to pay back.
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Old 12-13-2018, 10:08 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,763 posts, read 7,043,834 times
Reputation: 14300
Quote:
Originally Posted by matisse12 View Post
Here's the story which Hefe is talking about at his post #2 which appeared on CBS News on December 12, 2018 - which the OP posted.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/i-blame...-of-americans/

"At 80 years old, Coomer is still working as a part-time greeter five days a week at a Walmart in Oklahoma. Coomer is one of the nearly 10 million Americans over 65 who are still working.

In 1994, aerospace manufacturer McDonnell Douglas closed its plant in nearby Tulsa. Coomer, a machinist, had worked there for 29 years."

"All of a sudden, the loudspeaker come on and it said, 'Attention, McDonnell Douglas will close in 60 days.' And I mean, we stopped and looked at each other and thought, 'What in the world?' And to me, that was just like you had walked up and slapped me in the face," Coomer said."

He was 56 years old with an eighth-grade education and one year shy of a full pension. Financially, the Coomers have never recovered. Over the years, they burned through retirement savings and downsized their house and lifestyle, but still have a mortgage they can never pay off."

From the 2nd article the OP posted:

"Tom Coomer was a machinist at the aerospace manufacturer McDonnell Douglas for 29 years, but the plant closed one year before he was due to get his full pension. Now 80 years old, he works as a greeter five days a week at a Walmart in Oklahoma"
Does that mean they still get a partial pension, based on their years of service? As someone else mentioned, at 29 yrs with their companies they would have been long vested in each company's retirement systems.

There is always more to these stories than the publications would have the readers know.
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Old 12-13-2018, 10:09 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,763 posts, read 7,043,834 times
Reputation: 14300
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrkliny View Post
To my way of think the issue is not judging. Do we take away the rights of those who make mistakes where by full choice or ignorance?


The issue is just as relevant today as it was 50 years ago with the subject of the article. People can fail to participate or to contribute to 401k plans. They can do early withdrawals, pay the penalties and spend the money on anything they want. They can run their own businesses and fail to save for retirement or emergencies. They can borrow amounts they cannot afford to pay back.
And they can live with the consequences of their decisions.
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