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Old 06-13-2019, 03:34 PM
 
5,424 posts, read 3,440,673 times
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Assisted Living dwellings are way out of price range for the vast majority of people. Most Assisted Living dwellings are quite expensive.

I'm surprised to see people assuming that they would automatically have an option to live in Assisted Living dwellings. The cost is prohibitive to most people.

And most people never live in an Assisted Living dwelling anyway.

Some have home aides assist them at times in their own home or apartment or their own condo instead.

Some without the ability to pay for expensive costs of Assisted Living dwellings go on Medicaid, and enter nursing home type dwellings or have home aides at times.

Most Assisted Living dwellings - which have a range of living choices and levels from apartments to more nursing care offered all on one campus - which are almost all quite expensive are quite different from nursing home type facilities which generally do not have apartments.

Senior apartments are another category.

Continuing care retirement communities (CCRCs), or multi-level care facilities, provide residents with a lifetime continuum of care are also a category - and generally out of price range for most people.

Last edited by matisse12; 06-13-2019 at 04:29 PM..
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:46 PM
 
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As was mentioned by Matisse12, this is not an option for most people. Most retirement communities don't supply food. Some areas have programs to keep people in their own homes or apartments by providing meals and transportation to a facility. Many community centers have reduced cost meals for seniors. And there's always peanut butter, bread and microwave dinners. Assisted living facilites which include dining are far more expensive. If you want to live in one, you have the option to try the food first before you move in. As for nursing homes, there are good and bad. Years ago I volunteered for a number of years to entertain at a number of nursing homes. They ranged from well run, well kept facilities with enthusiastic and articulate aged residents to places filled with overmedicated drooling zombies.

Last edited by bobspez; 06-13-2019 at 03:56 PM..
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Old 06-13-2019, 03:53 PM
 
Location: SLC
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Understood. We are interested because we expect to be able to afford them. And, lacking children and other relatives in the United States, we will likely need to if we live long enough.
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Old 06-13-2019, 04:02 PM
 
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I plan to stay in our home for life. We hire people to do all the yard work and maintenace. We chose not to live in a 55+ retirement communtity because we like being in a working/middle class neighborhood with all ages and ethnicities. People are nice and it is a live and let live environment without pretension or rules more than what the law requires. If it ever comes to the point where we no longer have a choice I guess we will deal with it then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kavm View Post
Understood. We are interested because we expect to be able to afford them. And, lacking children and other relatives in the United States, we will likely need to if we live long enough.
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Old 06-13-2019, 04:10 PM
 
Location: SoCal
13,190 posts, read 6,301,958 times
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I might be thinking of hiring a cook, last I’ve heard it’s $50 an hour to make meals for us and store in freezer like we do now. We stay away from some salty food. Other than that I’m happy to eat peanut butter and sandwich. That was my favorite food to eat when I was younger and poor. That’s vegetarian isn’t it.
But that’s a long way off, not now. I do what I can now. With the garden supplying endless amount of fresh vegetables and fruit, we eat very well now. Better than some restaurants because the ingredients are very fresh. Farm to table kind of restaurant.
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Old 06-14-2019, 04:10 AM
 
13,872 posts, read 7,381,208 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matisse12 View Post
Assisted Living dwellings are way out of price range for the vast majority of people. Most Assisted Living dwellings are quite expensive.

I'm surprised to see people assuming that they would automatically have an option to live in Assisted Living dwellings. The cost is prohibitive to most people.

And most people never live in an Assisted Living dwelling anyway.

Some have home aides assist them at times in their own home or apartment or their own condo instead.

Some without the ability to pay for expensive costs of Assisted Living dwellings go on Medicaid, and enter nursing home type dwellings or have home aides at times.

Most Assisted Living dwellings - which have a range of living choices and levels from apartments to more nursing care offered all on one campus - which are almost all quite expensive are quite different from nursing home type facilities which generally do not have apartments.

Senior apartments are another category.

Continuing care retirement communities (CCRCs), or multi-level care facilities, provide residents with a lifetime continuum of care are also a category - and generally out of price range for most people.
It’s not out of reach for the vast majority. It’s out of reach for the bottom 50%.

Median income for individuals 65+ is $23,000. The median cost of assisted living is $48,000. 50th percentile household net worth for age 75-79 is $250,000 including home equity. The usual finances of middle class people in assisted living is they’re using home equity from the sale of their house plus their income to pay the bill. The for-profit eldercare industry bleeds that cash reserve to zero and then kicks them out if they run out of money.

The median stay in assisted living is only 21 months. The transition between independent living at home and either a nursing home or memory care. There aren’t many people who spend 5 years in assisted living. The median person can fund it. When they age out of assisted living and land in a nursing home, that quickly eats up the last of the money and they land on Medicaid.

So your house is your long term care policy for most middle class people.
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Old 06-14-2019, 07:06 AM
 
2,066 posts, read 699,344 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
It’s not out of reach for the vast majority. It’s out of reach for the bottom 50%.

Median income for individuals 65+ is $23,000. The median cost of assisted living is $48,000. 50th percentile household net worth for age 75-79 is $250,000 including home equity. The usual finances of middle class people in assisted living is they’re using home equity from the sale of their house plus their income to pay the bill. The for-profit eldercare industry bleeds that cash reserve to zero and then kicks them out if they run out of money.

The median stay in assisted living is only 21 months. The transition between independent living at home and either a nursing home or memory care. There aren’t many people who spend 5 years in assisted living. The median person can fund it. When they age out of assisted living and land in a nursing home, that quickly eats up the last of the money and they land on Medicaid.

So your house is your long term care policy for most middle class people.
Interesting analysis. Many of the Assisted Living places, though, have "buy-in" fees, which may or may not be refundable after you move out. The buy-in fees can be close to the equity in your house, meaning those funds aren't available to pay the monthly charges. So, if SS is your only income, you're out of luck. The average monthly SS check was $1,400 in 2018. (I couldn't find that broken down between couples and singles.) It also gets messy when one person in a married couple needs a nursing home while the other is healthy enough to stay in Assisted Living.

See the last post in this discussion, where someone provided the costs for a place in Georgia,

Georgia college invites elderly to retire on campus

Having said that- I'm planning on Assisted Living or a CCRC and my highest priority is being able to fund it. Fortunately I was able to accumulate enough that I don't have to live like a miser now. My current spending (including charitable donations and travel) is well above what Assisted Living would cost. And I have no plans to remarry unless the guy can fund his own LTC.
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Old 06-14-2019, 08:08 AM
 
Location: Loudon, TN
5,768 posts, read 4,822,990 times
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Here in east Tennessee, the typical AL facility is about $3200-4000 per month. The higher end price is for someone who needs significant assistance with their ADLs. There is no buy-in at these places, but there is usually a non-refundable "community fee" of around $2000-2500. So it's not cheap, but it's not super out of reach either for someone who has a home to sell. We had my MIL in a place near us, we got her VA A&A to help with the cost since her income without it was a small pension, and SS totalling only $2500/month. Veterans of WWII and the Korean conflict, as well as their widows, are eligible for VA A&A payments when they need assistance with their ADLs and have a financial need to pay for appropriate care.
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Old 06-14-2019, 08:30 AM
 
2,066 posts, read 699,344 times
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While I won't deny the profit motive, I do believe that you get what you pay for. I still remember a comment added to a newspaper web site article years ago by a woman whose mother was in a nursing home paid for by Medicaid. They weren't allowed to take her out for family visits, the food was barely-edible processed stuff (Mom had been raised on a farm and was used to real food made from fresh ingredients) and Mom was strapped into a wheel chair in the TV room all day, unable to even see outside because the windows were over her head. I swear if I ended up in a place like that I'd hoard my meds and take an overdose. Not every person in a Medicaid-paid nursing home bed has that dismal an existence, of course, but I'm afraid the picture will get worse for more people as the number of people counting on Medicaid to pay their LTC bills increases. I don't want to be one of them.

If you want an adequate number of competent staff, Wi-Fi, a library, exercise classes, dental care, etc., Assisted Living is not cheap.
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Old 06-14-2019, 09:04 AM
 
Location: Loudon, TN
5,768 posts, read 4,822,990 times
Reputation: 19387
Quote:
Originally Posted by athena53 View Post
While I won't deny the profit motive, I do believe that you get what you pay for. I still remember a comment added to a newspaper web site article years ago by a woman whose mother was in a nursing home paid for by Medicaid. They weren't allowed to take her out for family visits, the food was barely-edible processed stuff (Mom had been raised on a farm and was used to real food made from fresh ingredients) and Mom was strapped into a wheel chair in the TV room all day, unable to even see outside because the windows were over her head. I swear if I ended up in a place like that I'd hoard my meds and take an overdose. Not every person in a Medicaid-paid nursing home bed has that dismal an existence, of course, but I'm afraid the picture will get worse for more people as the number of people counting on Medicaid to pay their LTC bills increases. I don't want to be one of them.

If you want an adequate number of competent staff, Wi-Fi, a library, exercise classes, dental care, etc., Assisted Living is not cheap.
Okay, that right there would be a red flag. She is not a prisoner and unless they have a valid medical reason for not letting her out, I don't think this is even legal.

My mom spent a few months in a medicaid nursing home at the end of her life, and we literally had to be there for at least an hour or more everyday to correct the constant errors made by the staff, and to ensure that she was properly cared for. I purchased LTC insurance for myself at that point because I don't ever want to be in a place like that.
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