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Old 06-17-2019, 10:14 AM
 
700 posts, read 537,876 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran66 View Post
For the vast majority of those 80+ today -- the quality of life REALLY starts to diminish at around age 80. I think I quoted this in another post on this thread: a doctor recently said that modern medicine won't prolong our lives but it will prolong our dying.

My PCP, who is a geriatrician, is 65 and recently retired, said that just taking into consideration the patients he has seen in just the past 10 years, life is not worth living after 80 for the vast majority of seniors. Major health issues start at around age 70 for most seniors. And that has been my personal experience. I'm living in my third 55+ retirement community, in the past 10 years, and from what I've seen, there is NO WAY I want to see my 80th or 81st birthday. I am not of those super agers, who are still pretty rare despite what we see and read in the media.
Great post! I totally agree. After 80, all bets are off. I'm not one of those people who wants to prolong life at any cost. Or as the doctor you quoted said regarding modern medicine: prolong dying. Not for me.
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Old 06-17-2019, 10:55 AM
 
1,048 posts, read 512,583 times
Reputation: 1800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran66 View Post
My research has shown that, despite what the media hypes, most men are dead before age 80 (93%) -- 93% of males in The US born 80 years ago TODAY (June 17) are already dead. 87% of females born 85 years ago today are already dead. (Stats are from CMS.) So the main reason they aren't in nursing homes is probably because they aren't alive anymore. Yes, we are living longer. And those of us are who 65-70 TODAY -- the majority of us MAY live to be 90 (I think it may be more those who are 65 today).

For the vast majority of those 80+ today -- the quality of life REALLY starts to diminish at around age 80. I think I quoted this in another post on this thread: a doctor recently said that modern medicine won't prolong our lives but it will prolong our dying.

My PCP, who is a geriatrician, is 65 and recently retired, said that just taking into consideration the patients he has seen in just the past 10 years, life is not worth living after 80 for the vast majority of seniors. Major health issues start at around age 70 for most seniors. And that has been my personal experience. I'm living in my third 55+ retirement community, in the past 10 years, and from what I've seen, there is NO WAY I want to see my 80th or 81st birthday. I am not of those super agers, who are still pretty rare despite what we see and read in the media.
I agree completely.

Itís funny to me when Iím in the personal finance forum and read all the concerns about outliving money. Everyone thinks they need to fund to 95. Thatís nuts. Trust me, most of you wonít know what an IRA even IS after about 85. The investment industry has done a great job convincing us we will live heartily forever.
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Old 06-17-2019, 11:03 AM
 
1,048 posts, read 512,583 times
Reputation: 1800
Quote:
Originally Posted by xz2y View Post
Yes, in my view, LTC is a huge, mostly for-profit industry that provides questionable care in many cases. Read reviews and also look at the various "quality" indexes. Some of it is opaque and buried, but if you dig around, you can find out about violations in these places, and there are many in most of these LTC places. Do a lot of homework.
If we had legal suicide, thereíd be no need for LTC insurance.
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Old 06-17-2019, 11:12 AM
 
Location: SoCal
13,189 posts, read 6,301,958 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xz2y View Post
Best to have a living will, so there is no question about your wishes at the end. There are lots of standard forms online that can be printed, or check with your ins co. I got one from a local health ins co, filled out the forms and had it scanned into my medical record. It does require witnesses for the signatures.
Iíve heard even if you have a living will, doctors can still ignore it.
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Old 06-17-2019, 11:58 AM
 
Location: North State (California)
39,307 posts, read 2,966,634 times
Reputation: 12848
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewbieHere View Post
I’ve heard even if you have a living will, doctors can still ignore it.
This is true, an Aunt of mine had a DNR on file & a large DNR posted above her hospital bed. yet when she suffered a heart attack in the hospital, they revived her. However, she went on to live some happy years with her second husband.


On the original topic, I am not afraid to die, but I also do not want to live with any kind, of dementia, so if I were to get that diagnosis, I'm gone ( without pa ) People have the right to end thier lives, I do not know why it has to be helped along. If you wnat to do it alone, it can be done.
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Old 06-17-2019, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Central NY
4,651 posts, read 3,235,973 times
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If anything I've seen on a medical TV show and the DNR is disregarded, I think it is mainly due to the "doctor's" beliefs. There is one show where one doctor in particular is always challenging what the patient wants.
I think this is a disservice to the medical profession. I'm not saying doctors are always right, but I'm pretty sure the TV doctors are not. I think those TV doctors should wear a superman cape. It so distorts reality.

But this is my opinion only.

I've been known to be wrong at times, too.
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Old 06-17-2019, 12:48 PM
 
1,942 posts, read 2,708,224 times
Reputation: 3366
Quote:
Originally Posted by evening sun View Post
This is true, an Aunt of mine had a DNR on file & a large DNR posted above her hospital bed. yet when she suffered a heart attack in the hospital, they revived her. However, she went on to live some happy years with her second husband.


On the original topic, I am not afraid to die, but I also do not want to live with any kind, of dementia, so if I were to get that diagnosis, I'm gone ( without pa ) People have the right to end thier lives, I do not know why it has to be helped along. If you wnat to do it alone, it can be done.
A big surprise to me was finding out, first from my doctor and later from my own research:

There is no state in The US that has a law that requires MDs to follow a DNI/DNR. I think every state should have a law making the following of a DNI/DNR mandatory.

Secondly, EMTs are forbidden to follow a DNI/DNR. They must ignore it. They have no discretion. They must try to save the patient, at all cost(s).

I think there was a story going around the Internet not long ago about a guy who had DNI/DNR tattooed on his chest. And the EMTs ignored it, and so did his doctor(s). I don't know if it was true or not -- but it sure made me feel secure in my DNI/DNR. Not.
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Old 06-17-2019, 12:58 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
18,081 posts, read 22,914,959 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran66 View Post
If you are afraid, why are you? If you aren't, why aren't you? And (just an example): if tomorrow you were diagnosed with, say, Stage 4 lung cancer, to what lengths would you go to stay alive?

Lastly, do you believe in Physician-Assisted Suicide?

My recent PCP -- a geriatrician who is 65 and who recently retired -- thinks that everyone 75+ should be allowed to avail themselves of P-A Suicide for any reason whatsoever, because he says that, for the majority of us, life starts to get very difficult between age 75 and 80.

My ex-BF, who I'm still in contact with, is 82 and an Ombudsman in another very populous state/county. A few years ago when he started to volunteer, he was astounded that the vast majority of people in assisted-living/nursing homes were (and are) younger than he was!

My research -- and experience (I am living in my third 55+ retirement community in the past 10 years) -- is that, yes, we are living a bit longer but we're not living better. As some physician said recently (sorry -- I can't remember who nor can I remember who said it): "Modern medicine won't prolong your life but it will prolong your dying."

So to start if off: No, I'm not afraid of death. Dying -- that's another story because dying tends to be unnecessarily painful in The US. Secondly, I am a big fan of P-A Suicide. Thirdly, I think anyone 75 and over should be able to check out (be allowed P-A Suicide) for any reason whatsoever.
I agree. I'm not afraid of death at all, I'm afraid of suffering. And I want the option to check out when I want. My life, my body, I should have that right.

I just thought of that old movie with Dustin Hoffman where he was an Indian and kept saying "It's a good day to die." As I recall, he kept saying that and then he wouldn't die because something kept happening lol. I'll have to google it. Might as well interject some humor.
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Old 06-17-2019, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
18,081 posts, read 22,914,959 times
Reputation: 35192
Oh, it was Little Big Man and it was the chief who kept trying to die...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLso0ZBqOi4
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Old 06-17-2019, 01:01 PM
 
8,005 posts, read 7,290,867 times
Reputation: 6382
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran66 View Post
My research has shown that, despite what the media hypes, most men are dead before age 80 (93%) -- 93% of males in The US born 80 years ago TODAY (June 17) are already dead. 87% of females born 85 years ago today are already dead. (Stats are from CMS.) So the main reason they aren't in nursing homes is probably because they aren't alive anymore. Yes, we are living longer. And those of us are who 65-70 TODAY -- the majority of us MAY live to be 90 (I think it may be more those who are 65 today).

For the vast majority of those 80+ today -- the quality of life REALLY starts to diminish at around age 80. I think I quoted this in another post on this thread: a doctor recently said that modern medicine won't prolong our lives but it will prolong our dying.

My PCP, who is a geriatrician, is 65 and recently retired, said that just taking into consideration the patients he has seen in just the past 10 years, life is not worth living after 80 for the vast majority of seniors. Major health issues start at around age 70 for most seniors. And that has been my personal experience. I'm living in my third 55+ retirement community, in the past 10 years, and from what I've seen, there is NO WAY I want to see my 80th or 81st birthday. I am not of those super agers, who are still pretty rare despite what we see and read in the media.
A lot of them are smokers. They won't have to worry about 75, let alone 80. A lot of people move into the retirement communities because they have health problems. You have pre-selected samples that tend to confirm your hypothesis.
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