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Old 07-05-2019, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
56,010 posts, read 54,523,130 times
Reputation: 66358

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
I've done a lot of work around this. I have a God-complex around this person - I helped raise them and had to protect them from all kinds of things (and wasn't able to) - but I was able to make a positive impact enough times - and helped to "save their life" numerous times . . . so somehow I internalized that.

In the younger years I took over responsibility and then "felt responsible." I am trying to undo that now.
Trust me, I understand. You know why?

Because after my marriage ended, because after I cut off my alcoholic friend and then learned she drank herself to death, I found that this was the easy stuff that had prepared me for the worst to come:

My only child who had been the straightest-edge, sober kid you ever met because she feared she would be an alcoholic like her father, decided in her last year of college that she could have a drink and within a matter of a few short years turned out to be Daddy's girl after all.

I always suspected he might be bipolar, but he was never diagnosed. I am now sure of it, because my daughter WAS diagnosed, but only after she tried to kill herself with Xanax and tequila and was vomiting blood in a stupor when her roommate came home and hauled her ass to the hospital.

Everything else before prepared me to handle it, and it still isn't easy to know your kid is in a psych hospital and will never be normal.

Fortunately, she has been able to maintain her sobriety with one relapse in between, and has gone on to earn a Master's and is working on her Ph.D. But, she is mentally ill and she is an alcoholic and nothing will ever change that.

But, learning from the previous two experiences how to detach was probably the most valuable lesson I ever learned for when I needed it most.

Moving forward is your only choice.

Moving to NYC is one way to move forward.
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Old 07-05-2019, 12:59 PM
 
1,530 posts, read 1,437,287 times
Reputation: 11178
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
Just because there are opposing issues, doesn't invalidate them.

There is no "guise" - i really struggle with knowing the "right" thing to do, because I realize I never have all of the info to make a good decision.

One of my spiritual mentors has a video on "Helping an Addict," and they say: "If you see someone bleeding in the street, you help them" (as in humans should help whomever is suffering before them) - the fact that the person has shown up in distress has been very shocking and I don't know many people who could or would turn someone away in those severe conditions.

It's painful to think about - and that is the dilemma.

Just be glad you don't have this particular problem.
Unless your "spiritual mentor" or any other religious busybody can be relied on to offer significant and very long-term assistance to you should you allow them and your relative to blackmail you into taking on responsibilities that are not yours and for which you are not equipped, then the "right" thing to do is the thing that preserves your safety, sanity, and health.


Say "no" forcefully and consistently. Do not admit the person to your home, regardless of the circumstances in which they appear. Buy one of those video doorbells or other security device that lets you see who is at the door without getting out of your chair. If your relative shows up, just don't get out of the chair and engage them in a conversation that will certainly be designed to manipulate you or intimidate you in some way. If you cannot summon the power to turn them away, then your safe alternative for self preservation is simply not to engage in the conversation in the first place.


Don't let other people tell you what you "should" do or what you "owe" to someone else. They'll tell you whatever they think will earn them imaginary rewards from their imaginary friend. They are not concerned with your wellbeing in the least, only what they believe to be their own status in relation to whatever religious fairtytale they embrace. Regardless of the package it's wrapped in, unless the person giving you advice can absolutely be relied upon to stand by you and participate (including financially) in whatever "help" they are telling you you must provide to someone else, their advice is not worth following. They're just handing it out to make themselves look good or earn points with whatever imaginary invisible power they are trying to impress.


In the end, helping someone who will not help himself/herself and consciously manipulates you or employs emotional blackmail or intimidation will not end well for you or the person you help. You are in no position to be providing the kind of help your relative appears to want and would endanger your own health and future security to do so. Just keep saying "no" and refusing to take delivery of their emotional blackmail.
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:01 PM
 
Location: VT; previously MD & NJ
2,186 posts, read 1,341,203 times
Reputation: 6302
So who else in this person's family or circle of friends can she go to for help. You could make suggestions to her.

It's ok to say: I love you but I am too old to give any help. You need to find someone else.
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:08 PM
 
Location: planet earth
4,813 posts, read 1,832,844 times
Reputation: 10700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
Trust me, I understand. You know why?

Because after my marriage ended, because after I cut off my alcoholic friend and then learned she drank herself to death, I found that this was the easy stuff that had prepared me for the worst to come:

My only child who had been the straightest-edge, sober kid you ever met because she feared she would be an alcoholic like her father, decided in her last year of college that she could have a drink and within a matter of a few short years turned out to be Daddy's girl after all.

I always suspected he might be bipolar, but he was never diagnosed. I am now sure of it, because my daughter WAS diagnosed, but only after she tried to kill herself with Xanax and tequila and was vomiting blood in a stupor when her roommate came home and hauled her ass to the hospital.

Everything else before prepared me to handle it, and it still isn't easy to know your kid is in a psych hospital and will never be normal.

Fortunately, she has been able to maintain her sobriety with one relapse in between, and has gone on to earn a Master's and is working on her Ph.D. But, she is mentally ill and she is an alcoholic and nothing will ever change that.

But, learning from the previous two experiences how to detach was probably the most valuable lesson I ever learned for when I needed it most.

Moving forward is your only choice.

Moving to NYC is one way to move forward.
I LOVE NYC!!! Glad your daughter got it together!

I don't really understand how that all taught you how to detach, but glad it did!
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:09 PM
 
Location: planet earth
4,813 posts, read 1,832,844 times
Reputation: 10700
Quote:
Originally Posted by ansible90 View Post
So who else in this person's family or circle of friends can she go to for help. You could make suggestions to her.

It's ok to say: I love you but I am too old to give any help. You need to find someone else.
What's weird is how everyone else has been unavailable - a new sucker has been targeted recently - but spoke to the person and don't think it will last long.
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:12 PM
 
Location: planet earth
4,813 posts, read 1,832,844 times
Reputation: 10700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaofan View Post
Unless your "spiritual mentor" or any other religious busybody can be relied on to offer significant and very long-term assistance to you should you allow them and your relative to blackmail you into taking on responsibilities that are not yours and for which you are not equipped, then the "right" thing to do is the thing that preserves your safety, sanity, and health.


Say "no" forcefully and consistently. Do not admit the person to your home, regardless of the circumstances in which they appear. Buy one of those video doorbells or other security device that lets you see who is at the door without getting out of your chair. If your relative shows up, just don't get out of the chair and engage them in a conversation that will certainly be designed to manipulate you or intimidate you in some way. If you cannot summon the power to turn them away, then your safe alternative for self preservation is simply not to engage in the conversation in the first place.


Don't let other people tell you what you "should" do or what you "owe" to someone else. They'll tell you whatever they think will earn them imaginary rewards from their imaginary friend. They are not concerned with your wellbeing in the least, only what they believe to be their own status in relation to whatever religious fairtytale they embrace. Regardless of the package it's wrapped in, unless the person giving you advice can absolutely be relied upon to stand by you and participate (including financially) in whatever "help" they are telling you you must provide to someone else, their advice is not worth following. They're just handing it out to make themselves look good or earn points with whatever imaginary invisible power they are trying to impress.


In the end, helping someone who will not help himself/herself and consciously manipulates you or employs emotional blackmail or intimidation will not end well for you or the person you help. You are in no position to be providing the kind of help your relative appears to want and would endanger your own health and future security to do so. Just keep saying "no" and refusing to take delivery of their emotional blackmail.
Reading your post, I realize my problem is my refusal to believe that this person is such a manipulator (even though I have plenty of evidence). I so want to see the good in the person - I have some serious denial issues or optimism or something - not sure what it is, but it's deep!
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:22 PM
 
Location: on the wind
7,092 posts, read 2,911,245 times
Reputation: 24009
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
What's weird is how everyone else has been unavailable - a new sucker has been targeted recently - but spoke to the person and don't think it will last long.
Don't think that's weird at all. Maybe "everyone else" learned not to enable, facilitate, deny, rationalize or whatever term seems to fit best.
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:32 PM
 
261 posts, read 69,726 times
Reputation: 632
Out of my 3 sons one is a drug addict but I have learned through the years not to enable. Sometimes I don’t answer his calls if I am not feeling strong. You can do it if you decide you have been used enough. No one can make a addict change.
 
Old 07-05-2019, 01:39 PM
 
11,929 posts, read 20,379,765 times
Reputation: 19328
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
Thank you. The parents have always been WAY in the background . . . unavailable, basically.
I donít know if anyone suggested this, but you can attend a version of narc-anon for the families of addicted. It will help you because you will have a guideline to follow, and people who have been there, done that, and can help you create the boundaries you need.

Iíve dealt with a mentally ill person in my life, and it was awful and ugly. And until I set boundaries, she ruled the roost, and when I set boundaries, she found some else who wanted to ďsaveĒ her.

Good riddance.

And Iím going to be honest. Some people need to feel needed. Itís their addiction. If you should decide to help her, you need to know why. And be real about the outcome.

You canít fix her. My mentally ill person ó trust me, she had millions of reasons why it wasnít her. She refused to get help, itís not her, it's everybody else.

Addicts are the same. This is clearly not working, but if you give her a safe place to land, in her mind it is working. And she will use you up, and toss you out.

Lastly, although you feel a sense of responsibility, this is absolutely NOT your problem. She has parents. ďNoĒ is a complete sentence.

I wish you a sense of relief whatever you decide.
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Solly says ó Be nice!
 
Old 07-05-2019, 02:56 PM
 
475 posts, read 110,045 times
Reputation: 1064
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobodysbusiness View Post
What's weird is how everyone else has been unavailable - a new sucker has been targeted recently - but spoke to the person and don't think it will last long.
Oh no it doesn't sound weird at all. They refuse to be manipulated.
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