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Old 07-07-2019, 03:14 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryleeII View Post
Do you know if Texas has such a plan? How would I look it up? What would it be called -generically-total asset protection, partnership plan for LT care.... perhaps I just answered my own question! However, as usual, I always appreciate Mathjak's advice
texas has a dollar for a dollar partnership plan ... that means if they spend 100k on care 100k in assets is covered .. very few states do total asset like new york .

http://www.longtermcareinsuranceonly...rtnership.html
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Old 07-07-2019, 03:16 AM
 
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for those who think their plan will be a medicaid divorce , you better check your state laws .

it isn't easy to get what is called a medicaid divorce in many states which is usually what is done when a major health event happens .

two very powerful laws here in ny have been upheld and according to our estate attorney who is one of the biggest in ny there are very very few medicaid divorces .

all court actions are now pretty much based on right of refusal .

our two laws that pretty much killed off medicaid divorce are :

(1) Section 5-311 of the General Obligation Law which provides that except as provided in Section 236 of the Domestic Relations Law, a husband and wife cannot contract to relieve either his or her liability to support the other in such a manner that he or she will become incapable of self support, and therefore likely to become a public charge; and

(2) Family Court Act Section 415 which provides that the spouse or parent of a recipient of public assistance or care, or of a person liable to become in need thereof, or a patient in an institution in the department of mental hygiene if of sufficient ability, is responsible for the support of such a person. The Court has the discretion to require any such person to contribute a fair and reasonable sum for such support (child up to 21 years of age).

also if it is eventually determined that a divorce is to be pursued, the divorce needs to satisfy all of the requirements of the Domestic Relations Law, such as establishing one of the requisite grounds for a divorce. This may be difficult to accomplish because of the illness or disability of one spouse
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Old 07-07-2019, 05:58 AM
 
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
2,433 posts, read 3,659,178 times
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Lots of good information and lots of well-intentioned bad information. Highlights from the good information
  • See an Elder Care Attorney
  • Laws vary State-by-State

There are Look-Back-Periods, so asset transfers can be negated. Even years after the transfer! Transfer of family farms or small family businesses to the younger generation can fall into this H-hole.
States might not force the sale of a home but they may force a lien on the property equal to the cost of care provided, not to exceed half the market value of the home. Again, laws vary State by State. In these states a forced sale if both spouses require Medicaid might occur after their deaths.
The healthy Spouse can retain one vehicle but potentially not two or more, rules are State by State.
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Old 07-07-2019, 06:43 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
for those who think their plan will be a medicaid divorce , you better check your state laws .

it isn't easy to get what is called a medicaid divorce in many states which is usually what is done when a major health event happens .
Wow. Just wow. My late husband and I used to talk about how what was a religious ceremony to us became a way for the state to hold people responsible for each other's debts. (And they do- a hospital once tried to attach my wages to pay my first husband's medical bills after we'd separated. My lawyer held them off and they got paid from his share of the equity in our house after the divorce.) He and I had spoken about getting a civil divorce while he was still healthy, and still considering ourselves married in the eyes of the church but not in the eyes of the state but we would have been on mushy legal ground since our state recognized common-law marriage and we would have been representing ourselves as husband and wife.

A bit ironic that my own denomination recognizes divorce and it's the state enforcing "till death do you part".
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Old 07-07-2019, 08:04 AM
 
Location: Southern Most New Jersey
1,099 posts, read 817,338 times
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I would still look at the option of a medical divorce. Even if it means moving to a state where this is possible. Goal is not to qualify for Medicaid but to preserve at least some assets for surviving spose. Link below to a Forbes (August 21, 2014) article on the subject.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/feeonly.../#4975eaf074b8

---

As for Eldercare lawyers. Be careful, we had a lawyer who went this route a number of years back. When actually needed we had a very difficult time with him. Asking around I heard many others had a hard time with him. Crazy fees and he did nothing. Find a lawyer who has a good reputation end of life and thru estate closure.
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Old 07-07-2019, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Grove City, Ohio
10,128 posts, read 12,376,133 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
for those who think their plan will be a medicaid divorce , you better check your state laws .

it isn't easy to get what is called a medicaid divorce in many states which is usually what is done when a major health event happens.
For me that is not an option. Before God and a church full of friends and family we gave an oath to stay together in sickness and in health and richer or poorer til death do us part and I mean to keep that oath. Not all your options in life should be governed by money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightengale212 View Post
You have mentioned in other posts that you are a Veteran, so you would likely be entitled to long term care at a state run Veterans Home.
Yes, I served with the First Infantry Division in Vietnam for one year from 1968 to 1969 as a combat medic. During my tour most of our time, 75% of it anyway, was spent in the jungles of Dong Nai and Běnh Phước/Běnh Dương provinces and out of a total of 58 provinces in South Vietnam those three provinces got 65% of all the agent orange sprayed in the country. I use the term "jungle" loosely because most of everything that should have been green was dead but what 20 year old at the time could figure that out.

Because of the agent orange I came down with Type 2 diabetes about 6 years ago and it is interesting to note that there are four of us that kept communicating over the years and every one of us has Type 2 diabetes.

After an assessment the VA awarded me a 50% service connected disability for what I receive $964.36 tax free every month which constitutes nearly 20% of our retirement income. I would gladly trade the money for the diabetes but sometimes life deals you cards you have to play with. I do take care of myself, diet and exercise, because I don't want the added disability that comes with not taking care.

I go to the VA for most of my medical care and I must say I have always received excellent care. I've never had to wait for an appointment, everyone has always been kind, courteous and professional. Because my VA card identifies my disability as service connected all my drugs are free... in the last year I didn't spend more than $50 on drugs and I do take some pills.

If something happened to me I would be eligible for a VA nursing home and the ones I have seen aren't bad. In the course of my job I have visited hundreds of nursing homes over the years and there are certainly good ones and bad ones but I would have to rate the VA nursing homes I've seen in the top 20%.

Not sure what would happen with our retirement income if I did have to go into a VA facility.

If my wife had to go into a nursing facility would medicaid take the VA disability check or would that remain mine? If they took half our all our income I would find it really tough to live on $2,500 every month but I think I would do OK on $3,000. Tight but OK.
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Old 07-07-2019, 10:42 AM
 
71,468 posts, read 71,652,652 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by athena53 View Post
Wow. Just wow. My late husband and I used to talk about how what was a religious ceremony to us became a way for the state to hold people responsible for each other's debts. (And they do- a hospital once tried to attach my wages to pay my first husband's medical bills after we'd separated. My lawyer held them off and they got paid from his share of the equity in our house after the divorce.) He and I had spoken about getting a civil divorce while he was still healthy, and still considering ourselves married in the eyes of the church but not in the eyes of the state but we would have been on mushy legal ground since our state recognized common-law marriage and we would have been representing ourselves as husband and wife.

A bit ironic that my own denomination recognizes divorce and it's the state enforcing "till death do you part".
Till death do you part is a goal more than a vow
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Old 07-07-2019, 11:02 AM
 
Location: Ypsilanti, MI
2,433 posts, read 3,659,178 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBoy3 View Post
I would still look at the option of a medical divorce. Even if it means moving to a state where this is possible. Goal is not to qualify for Medicaid but to preserve at least some assets for surviving spose.
My Mother had their Attorney do Asset Preservation for her back in '91 when my Dad was permanently incapacitated by a massive stroke and needed Skilled Nursing care. At that time it was a 3-year look back period so the Attorney divided their assets so that my Dad's accounts were sufficiently funded for 3-years of Nursing Home costs. Everything else went to my Mom. Dad died after approximately 34 months in the Home so he remained Private Pay the whole time, but the plan to protect assets for my Mother was in place had he lived longer.
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Old 07-07-2019, 12:00 PM
 
71,468 posts, read 71,652,652 times
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All these laws to protect assets if Medicaid is needed were all left in place to be used .....they could have easily disallowed them all ..

But just like your fair share of taxes is the lowest amount you can get them down to using the tax laws the same is true when it comes to Medicaid ..

States don’t want a load of impoverished spouses ... some states are even respecting the right of refusal by a spouse and ordering Medicaid to negotiate a settlement that does not upset the stay at home spouses living standard ...right now ny , ct and Florida are doing just that.

This why states are utilizing partnership plans protecting assets while utilizing a special version of Medicaid created solely for that purpose

Last edited by mathjak107; 07-07-2019 at 12:19 PM..
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Old 07-07-2019, 12:39 PM
 
1,823 posts, read 780,633 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
I will put myself in the nursing home scenario but before I do let me say I am well aware of long term care insurance but some can not purchase it for any price due to pre-existing conditions. Let's assume I am one of those that can not purchase long term care insurance and haven't been able to for the last 10 years.

Home is paid for.

Car is relatively new and paid for.

Couple is certainly not rich. There's a total of between $80,000 and $100,000 in IRA's and savings accounts and that is it.

Husband and wife both receive social security which constitutes 75% of their total income.

Let's assume I develop severe memory problems and can no longer live at home and it is off to a nursing home where I will live at a cost of $70,000/year for the rest of my life.

What happens to the spouse and assets?
This may answer all your questions https://www.payingforseniorcare.com/...sing-home.html
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