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So what have you done in your life that isn’t average?
Career, income, marital stability, success of kids, retirement, degree achievement and university from (masters). Those are the basics oh yeah housing previously and current. We are pretty happy people but that is hard to quantify and rate. Most of the others are easier to quantify and thus lend themselves to data analysis and comparing. Heck married 48 years, same wife while not average I don’t know that divorce isn’t a turn on for some.
If you would have asked me at 45 if I would be able to retire at 58 I would have said that I doubted it but here I am.
Ok, was that because you reached your age 45 goals or have now accepted a lower income reality? We all define retirement differently realizing our aspirations may not reflect our eventual reality. We didn’t achieve all of our goals but have done awfully dog gone well. Did achieve current projections plus. Future TBD. however aspirations are just that and we have future aspirations hopefully to be achieved.
depends on the expenses you can control . as i mentioned we tend to sweat the small stuff , the starbuck syndrome as i will call it , while letting the bulk of the dollars get overspent on housing and transportation .
the other problem is cost cutting has a bottom too . after which there is nothing left to cut and expenses keep rising .. so growing income and investing are also going to be very key
Depends upon percentage of discretionary expenses vs. non-discretionary expenses.
Owning two homes has been a large part of our net worth -- particularly when the tax laws were more favorable and mortgage interest expense and property taxes were deductible and income was at a higher tax bracket.
Discretionary expenses are consuming a larger part of the budget -- cell phone and electronic upgrades, entertainment, travel, personal grooming services, pets and pet services, dining out. It's the totality of these discretionary expenses that can make the difference.
When recruiting for sales people, we looked for people who liked to live large because they were the most motivated to grow their income.
I think it's more about personal equilibrium point -- some people are not content if they are not living large; some people are content with a modest life style and there is no sense of deprivation. Everyone needs to determine their personal equilibrium point for their retirement goals.
My mother is in the memory care building of a CCRC. My stepmother is in independent living in a CCRC. I’ve looked at a number of them in very affluent places. There are a few that you could classify as “limousine”. Lots of Marriott, not many Ritz Carlton. Most people can’t afford the Ritz. All are far nicer than where people with no money get warehoused so it’s all relative.
Yeah CCRC’s can be very different. We are affiliated with one while still considering a few others. They are all very nice. Would be curious what people would consider them as it is all relative. None take Medicaid in their nursing care, which helps keep cost down. One of the things of note is that tier five nursing facilities are most often found in CCRC’s that don’t take Medicaid and may have limited or no beds for those not having been in their CCRC structure.
Let me remind people the context of my thoughts. We have two pensions with death benefits and two SS with higher income work histories. We have had a predictable path to retirement income with a built in floor. We also did investing and have that as a fall back. Our fixed income far exceeds our spending at this point. Was not always the case as we waited for income streams to kick in.
I fully realize our path has been and is a blessing. Our concept of retirement finances are a result of this. We had and continue to have predictable income floors barring a societal disruption. As previously noted we are prepared for a 25% reduction in pension and SS.
We always knew that barring a major change we would have above average retirements and had benefit schedules that told us that. The question was the ROI on our investments along with salary increases. Now it is COLA, ROI and contribution rate.
One question could be are we spending enough? That is not a question many retirees our age are asking. We realize that and don’t profess to be average retirees as that would be disingenuous.
There are many others like us in the forum however few talk about it anymore as the forum has acquired average/frugal mania.
I have a different perspective than you because I went from a we to a me when my 49 year old husband passed suddenly in 2001 when I was 44 and am currently 62.5.
Like you I live in a high tax high COL area which is in a coastal community within a 1/2 drive from where Geoff lives. When my husband died which will be 18 years ago this coming November my salary at that time was +/- $8,000 dollars shy of what my projected age 70 Social Security benefit will be. Initially, the only way I was able to stay in my home was that the mortgage had been paid off 3 years before my husband died. And what allowed me to be able to continue to remain in my home all these years along with saving for retirement and having the extra $$ to take a nice annual vacation, buy a new fridge, etc. is that my salary grew steadily over the years and currently > 2 x what it was when my husband passed.
Although Geoff has posted that his SS benefit combined with his GF's is in the $85,000 range, he also notes that he has structured his retirement financial needs on only his portion of that combined benefit being $45,000/year which living on that amount he admits that will involve significant lifestyle changes. And no doubt the reason why he did that is because he knows that the potential is always there that he will go from a we to a me either before or during retirement.
I have no doubt that you and your husband can likely survive in your high COL area on both your combined Social Security benefits, but will that be possible for the survivor to remain in that high COL when one spouse passes and 1/2 that Social Security benefit passes with them ?? For sure I know for me who will be entering retirement with no mortgage and no other major debt and having an age 70 Social Security benefit a few thousand dollars less than Geoff's, no way could I just survive on my age 70 SS benefit living where I live. And even with adding my FERS pension to that which amount will be 75% of my age 70 SS benefit, I could modestly survive on those two income streams for the short haul but highly doubt for the long haul especially when you consider the income those two streams will produce is what I earning from my working income 15 years ago and my COL has significantly risen during those years.
From personal experience going from a we to a me drastically changed how I looked at and planned for retirement. After the grief dust settled I was certainly going to as best as I could enjoy my life again and spend money on those enjoyable things that were important to me, but to waste money on things that had no lasting value to me could not be part of the plan if I wanted to have a minimally financially worry free retirement for the long haul. And with that being my goal, instead of wasting money I max contributed to my TSP/401K so I would not have to ever consider if I could alone survive on my age 70 Social Security benefit, and if I could it would involve relocating and that would not make a very happy retirement for me.
It’s more that since I broke age 50, I discovered that high tech where I’ve spent my career is very ageist. I’ve had to make a “Geoff never works again” contingency plan for the last decade. I chose housing where I’d always have a roof over my head if I couldn’t find work. My age 70 max Social Security check is comfortable if I somehow run out of money. My lifestyle burns double that but I know I can unload the costly lifestyle things like ski condo and sailboat if necessary. My plan is to work a few more years and not have the change in lifestyle. It’s not the end of the world if that doesn’t happen since I planned for that possibility a decade ago.
Ok, was that because you reached your age 45 goals or have now accepted a lower income reality? We all define retirement differently realizing our aspirations may not reflect our eventual reality. We didn’t achieve all of our goals but have done awfully dog gone well. Did achieve current projections plus. Future TBD. however aspirations are just that and we have future aspirations hopefully to be achieved.
A few things.....
At 45 retirement was still a vague concept for me. It wasn't my main goal. I still had a 5 year old daughter and retirement wasn't really on my mind so I would have said I doubted it.
Second, my financial goals have never been set super high. I have no desire to travel to Europe. Always buy new cars or buy a new or vacation home. None of that interests me. I'm not making any statement about anyone else but my interests (outside of one) have either made me money or are inexpensive. I like to dabble in photography. Local music. Attend auctions (to buy things to sell mostly) and then lastly, playing around with the car I'm building. It's the only expensive side thing BUT I pay for it as I go. Sell something, put it into the car. I try to not use "house" money.
Third, my wife is good with money. My daughter starts college this fall but it's all covered outside of our retirement income. That's where she has put money for 18 years. I couldn't forsee that 13 years ago.
Lastly, and well.........it plays a part. Around 7 years ago my wife while out walking was hit by a car. Nothing major but she did break her wrist. This isn't how we planned it but the insurance from that paid our house off early. Now it was only 40 some thousand, not a huge amount but it allowed us to save more.
Let me remind people the context of my thoughts. We have two pensions with death benefits and two SS with higher income work histories. We have had a predictable path to retirement income with a built in floor. We also did investing and have that as a fall back. Our fixed income far exceeds our spending at this point. Was not always the case as we waited for income streams to kick in.
I fully realize our path has been and is a blessing. Our concept of retirement finances are a result of this. We had and continue to have predictable income floors barring a societal disruption. As previously noted we are prepared for a 25% reduction in pension and SS.
We always knew that barring a major change we would have above average retirements and had benefit schedules that told us that. The question was the ROI on our investments along with salary increases. Now it is COLA, ROI and contribution rate.
One question could be are we spending enough? That is not a question many retirees our age are asking. We realize that and don’t profess to be average retirees as that would be disingenuous.
There are many others like us in the forum however few talk about it anymore as the forum has acquired average/frugal mania.
I don't know the demographics of this forum so it's hard to know how helpful one's personal retirement plans are to the majority. I do think some people are incredibly lucky (as we have been) but attribute their personal net worth to their incredible financial planning and investing prowess. We consider ourselves lucky since we have never been unemployed, had significant health care expenses, divorce, loss of spouse, disabled children, or other financial setback. Children financially independent. We also worked for employers with generous retirement plans (defined benefit and defined contribution) and received a modest inheritance. Investingwise, we had lucky timing in the housing market. So, I don't know how helpful knowing our situation would be to anyone as our life situation may not be applicable to many.
Last edited by Maddie104; 07-19-2019 at 08:05 AM..
I don't know the demographics of this forum so it's hard to know how helpful one's personal retirement plans are to the majority. I do think some people are incredibly lucky (as we have been) but attribute their personal net worth to their incredible financial planning and investing prowess. We consider ourselves lucky since we have never been unemployed, had significant health care expenses, divorce, loss of spouse, disabled children, or other financial setback. Children financially independent. We also worked for employers with generous retirement plans (defined benefit and defined contribution) and received a modest inheritance. Investingwise, we had lucky timing in the housing market. So, I don't know how helpful knowing our situation would be to anyone as our life situation may not be applicable to many.
It is helpful to each other and folks like us as there are still retirement decisions to be made with multiple variables to consider. There was a time where folks like us actively discussed and shared our thoughts with each other. Those not like us other said congratulations, asked questions or said nothing. Just like over the years I never participated in frugality threads or living single. However much of that has changed in this forum and now there are in the minds of some terms of service about what you should or shouldn't share as they consider it back patting. Of course for some reason now we have folks who feel compelled to read and comment on threads that are not reflective of them and to chastise folks who share what they don't want to hear about because it doesn't reflect them.
Your situation is like ours and there are many others like us who probably lived where we did and had jobs like we did. Probably the norm around the water cooler at work. I learned a lot from those who retired before me and those planning to retire around the same time.
Things do go as planned for many, not all but life is good and blessed for many. Yes not all and the best made plans can go haywire but just because ours didn't should be a beacon of hope for younger folks with similar opportunities to stay the course, be positive and don't self destruct if possible. Poop does happen but it doesn't mean we have to do so on our own.
I know many with similar opportunities who have done well and others who blew it. I have friends in both conditions.
So what are the many decisions you made to stay as poop free as possible? Isn't that worthy of conversation and sharing? No one around here knows our income but there are others of lesser means who feel comfortable to shout theirs out and make sure the forum knows. The affluent? Not so much! Wow, just wow.
WE had much luck with timing in the housing market also. How do you replicate that luck in transplanting if a person does so. How do you help your kids and others to make it more of a plan and less luck.
You have a lot to contribute in what to look for in a job to help you secure a good retirement and is it worth the trade offs. Less compensation now for higher benefits later etc etc.
Isn't one of the points of dwelling on having access to a CCRC the idea of living in a limousine way (more luxury or possibly better environment) in one's old age if one needs nursing care, rather than in an average or less than average nursing home? I'm asking - I do not know. Just asking from what I have read here - seems to soothe the fears of needing nursing care and being in a nursing care dwelling not to one's liking.
Also the convenience of having different levels of living and different levels of care available at the CCRC making it easy to move between levels.
I'm not clear on differences between many Assisted Living dwelling developments and CCRC's. (I'm asking - I do not know)
In my area, a 5-star CCRC is nothing but an apartment complex, albeit nice apartment complex. It’s very close to a lot of restaurants. I prefer my garden.
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