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Old 08-17-2019, 09:18 AM
 
1,787 posts, read 649,657 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johngolf View Post
Though this question has been asked many different ways, I am going to try and limit the responses to those over 62 and fully (or nearly) retired.

The questions are for those doing it.

How much in Total Assets do you think the average person needs to have to retire reasonable comfortable?

How much Monthly Income do you think the average person needs to have to retire reasonable comfortable?

While I am 59 and semi-retired (ie, still working on occasional contracts to keep professional credentials, but not financially needing to work), I can tell you what I calculated for myself:


Total assets needed: $1.8M


Monthly income needed:$4,200 (expected to go up by about 4% every year, ie, to double every 20 years)


People differ tremendously in what they need, but this is what I need.I am a single woman without children who likes to travel and spend extended time in different places.


Long term care is a wild card, but I have arrangements in place with a nursing home in Asia should I ever need it, for 10% of what it would cost in the US, and well within my annuity income until the age 120 (assuming again doubling of the cost of this nursing home care every 20 years).
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Old 08-17-2019, 09:20 AM
 
14,287 posts, read 7,630,536 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
I wonder if in lump sum entry CCRCís how much of that amount comes from a deceased spouses insurance payout?

More likely, it's funded through the sale of their primary residence. The vast majority of life insurance policies are term insurance where the policy is long gone by the time a couple hit retirement age.
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Old 08-17-2019, 09:28 AM
 
2,374 posts, read 830,217 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
For most people, if the worst case happens without Medicaid planning, the spouse is left with the house, ~$125k, and their own retirement income stream intact. In 2019, there's largely no such thing as "stay-at-home-mom". You have your own Social Security check, your own 401(k) accounts, and your own pension for some. Your narrative tends to be Edith Bunker in a 1970s sitcom where Archie gets sick. The late-Boomer women with enough internet skills to be on a retirement forum who have to plan this now largely went to college and had careers. I can't think of anyone in my late-Boomer High School graduating class who didn't log close to 35 work years. Mommy track has largely been for really affluent people where eating $500K in long term care isn't going to wipe them out.

First- I believe there's a limit to the retirement stream for the at-home spouse- $2000-$3,000/month in most states.

Second- while my situation fits your description perfectly- college education, worked FT my entire adult life, have my own investments, SS and a couple of small pensions and am doing just fine financially as a widow- I believe I'm in the minority. Many women do take a few years out of the workforce to raise kids and many choose teaching, which doesn't pay what it used to, so their schedules coincide with the kids'. And, in general, I believe that women still tend to go into lower-paying fields. My female HS classmates largely went into teaching, social work and other "helping" professions. Noble work but not lucrative.

My own DS and DDIL have a marriage in which she's a stay-at-home Mom. She's darn good at it and it's hard work with a 5-year old, a 2-year old and a newborn. It's much more common out here in flyover country where you can support a family on one income. Even in the affluent NNJ town where I lived till 2003, I was the only mother I knew of in my son's class who had a demanding FT job. Most were stay-at-homes or worked PT at places like Williams-Sonoma to get the employee discount.

At any rate- I'm unlikely to marry again unless the guy can fund his own LTC- otherwise I'm on the hook for all of it.
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Old 08-17-2019, 10:14 AM
 
1,137 posts, read 547,837 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by athena53 View Post
First- I believe there's a limit to the retirement stream for the at-home spouse- $2000-$3,000/month in most states.

Second- while my situation fits your description perfectly- college education, worked FT my entire adult life, have my own investments, SS and a couple of small pensions and am doing just fine financially as a widow- I believe I'm in the minority. Many women do take a few years out of the workforce to raise kids and many choose teaching, which doesn't pay what it used to, so their schedules coincide with the kids'. And, in general, I believe that women still tend to go into lower-paying fields. My female HS classmates largely went into teaching, social work and other "helping" professions. Noble work but not lucrative.

My own DS and DDIL have a marriage in which she's a stay-at-home Mom. She's darn good at it and it's hard work with a 5-year old, a 2-year old and a newborn. It's much more common out here in flyover country where you can support a family on one income. Even in the affluent NNJ town where I lived till 2003, I was the only mother I knew of in my son's class who had a demanding FT job. Most were stay-at-homes or worked PT at places like Williams-Sonoma to get the employee discount.

At any rate- I'm unlikely to marry again unless the guy can fund his own LTC- otherwise I'm on the hook for all of it.
Yeah, I agree. As far as I know, there are only 2 women from about 35 or so of my high school class that fit that description. Most are working, but certainly not making it on their own. Even the college educated ones. Contrast that to the men, who are doctors, lawyers, engineers and sales executives.

Even when I went off to work on Wall St in the early 80s, surrounded by MIT, Ivy, etc grads, the men outnumbered the women by about a ratio of 10 to 1. I remember being told to wear suits instead of dresses so people would know I wasn’t a secretary.
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Old 08-17-2019, 10:46 AM
 
29,995 posts, read 35,090,257 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
More likely, it's funded through the sale of their primary residence. The vast majority of life insurance policies are term insurance where the policy is long gone by the time a couple hit retirement age.
I asked the question from our personal experience interacting with a few higher cost CCRCs we are considering. The staff mentioned insurance in addition to home equity as a source of the buy in. Not sure the percentage of each. The most recent two are monthly pay as you go with pensions playing a roll. They each said the industry is changing as people donít want to surrender their cash pile regardless of if it is home equity, insurance or investments. I am curious about how the industry is evolving.
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Old 08-17-2019, 12:05 PM
 
Location: SoCal
13,841 posts, read 6,596,086 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
More likely, it's funded through the sale of their primary residence. The vast majority of life insurance policies are term insurance where the policy is long gone by the time a couple hit retirement age.
I still have it. Itís cheaper for both of us than LTC premium. Why do I have it. You never know. Accident do happen.
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Old 08-17-2019, 12:30 PM
 
14,287 posts, read 7,630,536 times
Reputation: 26135
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
I asked the question from our personal experience interacting with a few higher cost CCRCs we are considering. The staff mentioned insurance in addition to home equity as a source of the buy in. Not sure the percentage of each. The most recent two are monthly pay as you go with pensions playing a roll. They each said the industry is changing as people donít want to surrender their cash pile regardless of if it is home equity, insurance or investments. I am curious about how the industry is evolving.

My mom is monthly pay in memory care at a CCRC. At some point, she'll go across the driveway to monthly pay skilled nursing. This place does Medicaid conversions so if she does run out of money, she's not booted out into the street. Worst case, I'd have to private pay 24x7 CNA coverage in memory care until a room opens up in the SNF. Most of the CCRC independent/assisted people transition through the rehab wing of the SNF rather than the regular SNF wings. They get their 'N' years of $9,000/month in memory care so they're happy to assume the risk that my mother ends up being a Medicaid conversion.
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Old 08-17-2019, 12:38 PM
 
72,798 posts, read 72,652,425 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by athena53 View Post
First- I believe there's a limit to the retirement stream for the at-home spouse- $2000-$3,000/month in most states.

Second- while my situation fits your description perfectly- college education, worked FT my entire adult life, have my own investments, SS and a couple of small pensions and am doing just fine financially as a widow- I believe I'm in the minority. Many women do take a few years out of the workforce to raise kids and many choose teaching, which doesn't pay what it used to, so their schedules coincide with the kids'. And, in general, I believe that women still tend to go into lower-paying fields. My female HS classmates largely went into teaching, social work and other "helping" professions. Noble work but not lucrative.

My own DS and DDIL have a marriage in which she's a stay-at-home Mom. She's darn good at it and it's hard work with a 5-year old, a 2-year old and a newborn. It's much more common out here in flyover country where you can support a family on one income. Even in the affluent NNJ town where I lived till 2003, I was the only mother I knew of in my son's class who had a demanding FT job. Most were stay-at-homes or worked PT at places like Williams-Sonoma to get the employee discount.

At any rate- I'm unlikely to marry again unless the guy can fund his own LTC- otherwise I'm on the hook for all of it.
there are ways of increasing the stay at home spouses income through the purchase of annuities which has different medicaid rules
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Old 08-17-2019, 01:44 PM
 
29,995 posts, read 35,090,257 times
Reputation: 11902
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
My mom is monthly pay in memory care at a CCRC. At some point, she'll go across the driveway to monthly pay skilled nursing. This place does Medicaid conversions so if she does run out of money, she's not booted out into the street. Worst case, I'd have to private pay 24x7 CNA coverage in memory care until a room opens up in the SNF. Most of the CCRC independent/assisted people transition through the rehab wing of the SNF rather than the regular SNF wings. They get their 'N' years of $9,000/month in memory care so they're happy to assume the risk that my mother ends up being a Medicaid conversion.
Yup, if you can afford to cover x number of years yourself they will take the risk in some cases. The one we affiliated with will kick you out. They will not accept Medicaid.
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Old 08-17-2019, 01:46 PM
 
29,995 posts, read 35,090,257 times
Reputation: 11902
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewbieHere View Post
I still have it. It’s cheaper for both of us than LTC premium. Why do I have it. You never know. Accident do happen.
There currently is tremendous controversy about the financial soundness of General Electrics long term care insurance business. Gave us pause. We are not with GE but a number of companies could face challenges.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/16/amid...re-policy.html
Quote:
For anyone holding a long-term-care insurance policy, new allegations of financial trouble at one insurer may make you wonder what would happen to your policy if your underwriter went belly up.

While insurance companies have been bolstering their reserves to cover future claims and raising premiums to counteract inaccurate pricing when the policies were first sold, experts say policyholders shouldn’t worry.

“Insurance carriers are heavily regulated by the states to make sure they are financially solvent and can pay claims,” said Scott White, Virginia’s insurance commissioner and chair of a national task force on long-term-care insurance.
We have one of the inaccurately priced policies.
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