U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-03-2019, 03:04 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,855 posts, read 17,773,117 times
Reputation: 27900

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by ABQ2015 View Post
Yes, but are they strict? My city has a problem with stray animals and vicious dog breeds but things have improved greatly since passing a more stringent animal control ordiance several years ago. Pets must be microchipped and neutered (except for those with permits in place), limit of 6 pets per residence (4 dogs max), pets cannot be chained for more than an hour per day, very imited sales of dogs and cats, etc. Just a quick look at the Roanoke ordinances and the website just mentions rabies shots are required and limits are 3 dogs and 6 cats per residence.
Statewide? No idea. I lived in rural southwest VA for my first job after college. There were basically no animal restrictions, but this was in the county. A city, and an affluent city especially, may have different regulations.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-03-2019, 03:43 PM
 
Location: SoCal
13,595 posts, read 6,483,219 times
Reputation: 10164
For some reasons, I don’t see RVs in my hood. Maybe they can’t park there longer than so many days.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2019, 05:25 PM
 
Location: Tennessee/Michigan
28,240 posts, read 47,725,576 times
Reputation: 19759
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
I live in a working class town. Other than family ties, better climate, and better outdoor recreation, the leafy suburban areas I've lived in previously had a much higher quality of life.
Where do you live in Tennessee because I'm thinking about leaving Cookeville too a better place in Tennessee.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2019, 05:45 PM
 
14,128 posts, read 7,546,700 times
Reputation: 25873
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Working class folks are less likely to show pride in their property. They're much more willing to sit in the house, munch Cheetos, and watch the boob tube, rather than doing anything useful.
Not in my life experience.

My census tract is massively socioeconomically mixed. At the town line to the east next to a high poverty rate city, itís pure working class. Multi family homes from the 1930s. Small 1950s starter homes. A high concentration of first and second generation ethnic Portuguese-Azores. Generally, the lawns are immaculate. Everything has a fresh coat of paint. Thereís no trash visible.

The western half of the census tract is a mix of white collar professionals, more prosperous middle class where the retirees likely didnít go to college, and truly affluent 1%ers with harborfront, oceanfront, or historic district homes. Itís older housing stock so 2/3 of the homes are small by 21st century standards.

I grew up here. I had lots of childhood friends who got government cheese. I had lots of friends who had doctor/lawyer parents. I think thatís really healthy rather than living in a completely socioeconomically segregated place.

When I did my retirement math at age 50, I concluded that I couldnít afford to live in the kind of white collar professional enclaves Iíd lived in as an adult. I opted to move back to my socioeconomically mixed home town. Itís affordable compared to the metro Boston places I had been living and not so remote that I canít get to Boston in an hour on a Saturday or off hours midweek. I grew up with the diversity so Iím comfortable with it.

Iíd have a tough time living in a place that is completely working class. There arenít many neutral topics that wouldnít trigger some class envy. Sports crosses the socioeconomic boundaries. Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, and Bruins talk are safe. Beyond that, there isnít much common ground. My worldview is totally different.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2019, 06:03 PM
 
7,132 posts, read 7,038,213 times
Reputation: 5930
Quote:
Originally Posted by Questions and Comments View Post
My wife and I are always driving around trying to find the perfect town for retirement in a few years.

We decided that it would be nice to have a larger home and at least a quarter acre of land with grass and trees, instead of the cramped townhouse we are living in today because it is the only place we can afford in our white-collar dominated high cost of living community. We live in Bethesda MD.

Because we live in a suburban city that has excellent demographics (Rich people), we get many of the benefits. We get: Well laid out neighborhoods, lots of trees and professional landscaping, great schools, wonderful libraries, parks, low crime and tons of shopping and restaurants.

But in retirement, we could get twice the home at nearly half the price if we moved to a "working class" community outside the Washington Metro Area. For example, Roanoke VA is a nice enough town but has fewer nice restaurants, poorer schools, less landscaping, rougher looking neighborhoods, less shopping, poorer libraries, more poverty, and social problems. There are some nice neighborhoods but the community does not offer as much as our current hometown of Bethesda MD.

When I have traveled to working-class communities, like Roanoke, I am so happy to see such nice folks and their lack of ego and friendly personality.

BUT THE HOME WE COULD GET AT HALF THE PRICE and the money we could save for travel and hobbies.
Do you agree with the working class people where you are planning to move to? Do you have similar education? Agree with the majority of the population on their political beliefs? What about religion? Is the community very conservative and do you agree with that? Are they welcoming to newcomers? You mentioned ďrougher neighborhoods.Ē Is the crime rate low enough to make you feel safe? Lots of considerations...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2019, 06:57 PM
 
8,025 posts, read 5,100,457 times
Reputation: 13743
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunGrins View Post
...Smaller towns are somewhat "closed" and it is sometimes hard to be a "local". The smaller the community the tighter the relationships are -- often familial.
Precisely. Smaller towns tend to be insular and skeptical of newcomers, even if said newcomers are of the "right" ethnicity. And much of the socializing revolves around extended family. No, this isn't a jab at "Deliverance"-style in-breeding. Rather, I note that such conservative communities tend to have larger families, and bonds of business, recreation and neighborliness tend to be between persons who are related.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SunGrins View Post
I perhaps never experienced a purely "white collar" town -- I guess this means affluent communities. ...University towns might be good but I would not choose a town with a major public university with football or other sporting events dominating weekends. ...
To me, the archetypal "white collar town" is Ann Arbor, MI.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Working class folks are less likely to show pride in their property. They're much more willing to sit in the house, munch Cheetos, and watch the boob tube, rather than doing anything useful.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hefe View Post
Well now, maybe that's a regional thing where you're at. Most working class folks where I've lived, 7 states in 3 time zones, seemed to me place a great deal of store in how they appear as far as the house & their clothes... strivers who want to at least appear upwardly mobile even if that isn't entirely the case. Granted I have never lived in the deep south if that's what you're referring to.
The "working class" is not monolithic. Its lower range, either through privation or fatalism, does tend to ignore the appearances of material tidiness. But its upper end, or as Paul Fussell called them "high Proles", takes considerable pride in their lawns, their houses, their trucks and boats and so forth. They're the ones outside, washing the truck weekly (or taking it to the carwash). They're the ones with the Harley Davidson grill (not to mention the Harley Davidson itself).

Indeed, one tension between the Prole class and those, ahem, "above" it, is the former's insistence on appearances being just-so. As we move up the American class-structure, the appurtenances in question change from cars to houses. We've reached the realm of the HOA - which demands that the McMansions and so forth be just-so. One has to range quite a bit "up" in class-structure before material-goods cease to matter. Whether the house has proper front-porch and window treatments, or not; whether the vehicle is a suitably impressive truck, or not... for these things to graduate into irrelevance, is possible only in a kind of modern aristocracy, which is beyond being beholden to self-identification through consumption.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2019, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,855 posts, read 17,773,117 times
Reputation: 27900
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
Not in my life experience.

My census tract is massively socioeconomically mixed. At the town line to the east next to a high poverty rate city, it’s pure working class. Multi family homes from the 1930s. Small 1950s starter homes. A high concentration of first and second generation ethnic Portuguese-Azores. Generally, the lawns are immaculate. Everything has a fresh coat of paint. There’s no trash visible.

The western half of the census tract is a mix of white collar professionals, more prosperous middle class where the retirees likely didn’t go to college, and truly affluent 1%ers with harborfront, oceanfront, or historic district homes. It’s older housing stock so 2/3 of the homes are small by 21st century standards.

I grew up here. I had lots of childhood friends who got government cheese. I had lots of friends who had doctor/lawyer parents. I think that’s really healthy rather than living in a completely socioeconomically segregated place.

When I did my retirement math at age 50, I concluded that I couldn’t afford to live in the kind of white collar professional enclaves I’d lived in as an adult. I opted to move back to my socioeconomically mixed home town. It’s affordable compared to the metro Boston places I had been living and not so remote that I can’t get to Boston in an hour on a Saturday or off hours midweek. I grew up with the diversity so I’m comfortable with it.

I’d have a tough time living in a place that is completely working class. There aren’t many neutral topics that wouldn’t trigger some class envy. Sports crosses the socioeconomic boundaries. Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, and Bruins talk are safe. Beyond that, there isn’t much common ground. My worldview is totally different.
Remember that I'm not from "little Portugal," or some similar community where the newcomers want to integrate and reach for that brass ring to climb the ladder, or at least better themselves within their own local community. Few people here give a crap.

I'm pure Appalachian white trash who is at least four generations deep in this country on all sides of the family that I've been able to get reportable data on. Most of my peers are similar. Our families are deeply dug in here.

Kingsport has a similar real estate makeup, but guess what? Cars on blocks. Fridges on the porch. Kudzu regularly grows up the sides of houses. People in cheap white wife beaters smoking a Marlboro red on the porch with five of the neighbors are a town staple. Visible bags of trash are a town staple. No one cares about maintenance and being presentable.

Both towns may be "working class," but have completely different values and mores guiding the decision making among the local residents. It's immigrant New England vs. stagnant white trash Appalachia.

I want to move to a Cary, NC or Franklin, TN. I'd fit in better there. Legally single, it's hard to afford that without massive piles of money.\\
Quote:
Originally Posted by John1960 View Post
Where do you live in Tennessee because I'm thinking about leaving Cookeville too a better place in Tennessee.
Right now, I live in Kingsport. I used to live in JC. I sold my condo and moved to Kingsport to reduce my commute and upgrade my housing per dollar spent. Sure, the building and apartment are fine. Kingsport sucks as a city to live in.

Bring $400k-$500k housing budget to JC and enough income to otherwise live and it will be much better than Cookeville. Don't go to Kingsport.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2019, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,855 posts, read 17,773,117 times
Reputation: 27900
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
The "working class" is not monolithic. Its lower range, either through privation or fatalism, does tend to ignore the appearances of material tidiness. But its upper end, or as Paul Fussell called them "high Proles", takes considerable pride in their lawns, their houses, their trucks and boats and so forth. They're the ones outside, washing the truck weekly (or taking it to the carwash). They're the ones with the Harley Davidson grill (not to mention the Harley Davidson itself).
And some of this debate is individualized. One working class person may be tidy, another may not be. On the whole, a bunch of working class people living in a rural community with no restrictions are much less likely to be tidy than a community of white collar professionals in an HOA.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 07:15 AM
 
Location: North Carolina
2,959 posts, read 2,051,010 times
Reputation: 5959
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
You could have written this about me, one of my fraternity brothers classified me as a "progressive redneck" about 40 years ago, and I think it still holds. Pistol in my pocket, but Birkenstocks on my feet. Radio in the quite old and somewhat disheveled looking Cougar is always on NPR. Strongly libertarian, very much pro-choice about everything, so long as force and/or fraud are off the table - free non-felon adults are sovereign beings and should run their own affairs as they wish with no interference. My point in regards to the OP is that at least some working class/farm areas, not dense enough to be called a town really, can not be characterized as the New York Times would like to characterize them - as a bunch of Bible thumping, redneck boobs with very limited intellectual horizons.
I very much understand what you're talking about in the bolded part and seen this firsthand with towns in my area that have been in the national media for one reason or another. I feel like the stereotypes and those slurs that you mention are some of the last socially acceptable prejudices remaining.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
Not in my life experience.

My census tract is massively socioeconomically mixed. At the town line to the east next to a high poverty rate city, it’s pure working class. Multi family homes from the 1930s. Small 1950s starter homes. A high concentration of first and second generation ethnic Portuguese-Azores. Generally, the lawns are immaculate. Everything has a fresh coat of paint. There’s no trash visible.

The western half of the census tract is a mix of white collar professionals, more prosperous middle class where the retirees likely didn’t go to college, and truly affluent 1%ers with harborfront, oceanfront, or historic district homes. It’s older housing stock so 2/3 of the homes are small by 21st century standards.

I grew up here. I had lots of childhood friends who got government cheese. I had lots of friends who had doctor/lawyer parents. I think that’s really healthy rather than living in a completely socioeconomically segregated place.

When I did my retirement math at age 50, I concluded that I couldn’t afford to live in the kind of white collar professional enclaves I’d lived in as an adult. I opted to move back to my socioeconomically mixed home town. It’s affordable compared to the metro Boston places I had been living and not so remote that I can’t get to Boston in an hour on a Saturday or off hours midweek. I grew up with the diversity so I’m comfortable with it.

I’d have a tough time living in a place that is completely working class. There aren’t many neutral topics that wouldn’t trigger some class envy. Sports crosses the socioeconomic boundaries. Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, and Bruins talk are safe. Beyond that, there isn’t much common ground. My worldview is totally different.
I prefer a more socioeconomically diverse area as well. It's more about whether the people respect themselves and their neighbors. I agree with you that not having stratified enclaves is a healthier way to grow up and see the world and when I do go to an "exclusive" area, there's just always something that seems off about the place and the way people who live their view the world.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old Yesterday, 08:11 AM
 
14,128 posts, read 7,546,700 times
Reputation: 25873
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jowel View Post
I prefer a more socioeconomically diverse area as well. It's more about whether the people respect themselves and their neighbors. I agree with you that not having stratified enclaves is a healthier way to grow up and see the world and when I do go to an "exclusive" area, there's just always something that seems off about the place and the way people who live their view the world.

You still get prejudice/class envy/resentment in a diverse place. My census tract has two distinct neighborhoods. There's a very obvious socioeconomic class difference. Some people have mutual respect. Others don't.



I'd be 100% a fish out of water in a totally working class town. My friends are largely like me. I can talk physics and engineering with my physics prof friend at the local university. I can talk about trips to Europe because my friends have all been there. I can talk about skiing and sailing because my friends all do at least one of those. As I wrote up-thread, if I don't know someone's socioeconomic status, I talk about Mookie not hitting .300 this year and the lousy pitching or how they're going to replace Gronk now that he's retired. It's really limiting.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top