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Old 08-21-2019, 08:48 AM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
8,216 posts, read 5,019,612 times
Reputation: 30077

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRoadkill View Post
In the technical world it's more like "Ramesh / Ganesh / Prakashkumar can do Charley's job for 50% cheaper"

The US may dislike immigrants from the south, but big tech companies love immigrants from Asia.
I'm sorry, but you don't know what you're talking about. Now you're just being racist.

"Big tech companies" hire many Americans. Do they bring over workers on H-1B visas? Sure, because this country still can't supply all the tech workers needed.

Read the other C-D forums. There are countless Americans weighing job offers from those "big tech companies" and trying to decide whether or not to relocate.
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Old 08-21-2019, 09:37 AM
 
242 posts, read 75,776 times
Reputation: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat View Post
I'm sorry, but you don't know what you're talking about. Now you're just being racist.

"Big tech companies" hire many Americans. Do they bring over workers on H-1B visas? Sure, because this country still can't supply all the tech workers needed.

Read the other C-D forums. There are countless Americans weighing job offers from those "big tech companies" and trying to decide whether or not to relocate.
No racist at all, I just happen to be an engineer who has seen work staff reductions of "American citizen" engineers only to be replaced by H-1B engineers. I have seen that happen first hand at several companies, and I have been a part of executive manpower discussions where human resource costs were discussed and the dollar per hour metrics ruled. The assumption is that all engineers are the same and if H-1B engineers are cheaper, then why not use their services. Same is true of using contractors vs. hiring direct.


I am not sure where the falsehood of "there aren't enough high tech workers to fill all the demands" is coming from but its just the same as "they are taking the jobs Americans won't do". Ask yourself, if there are more high tech jobs than American applicants, why are there so many new graduates that can't find work? It's not because they are lazy or unwilling to move to the work. (Also why would a company open a office in an area that does not have the technical resources to support their demands?)


This way of thinking is wrong for both Americans and the H-1B engineers that are being taken advantage of. I can't see any difference in this high tech practice and migrant farm/factory workers.


Big business' worships at the alter of the almighty dollar and this unbridled capitalism is slowly strangling the world.


Just my $0.02
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:12 AM
 
14,392 posts, read 7,694,729 times
Reputation: 26273
Quote:
Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat View Post
I'm sorry, but you don't know what you're talking about. Now you're just being racist.

"Big tech companies" hire many Americans. Do they bring over workers on H-1B visas? Sure, because this country still can't supply all the tech workers needed.

Read the other C-D forums. There are countless Americans weighing job offers from those "big tech companies" and trying to decide whether or not to relocate.

It's really not being racist. I'm 61. If I apply for a vanilla tech job where I don't disclose my age or any work experience more than 15 years ago, HR is going to Google me, get my age, and toss my application in the trash. There is a big impact on group health insurance rates. My impact on the employer-paid insurance rate for their employee pool would be more than my compensation. Unless I'm an exact match for skill set and subject matter expertise, I'm not going to get a job interview. They'd much rather hire the 30-year-old. In 2019, there are at least 50% odds that 30-year-old is Asian. They're not H-1B. They likely have a green card and are on the citizenship track. They'll work for much less money. Other than having to accommodate the yearly multi-week trip back home to India, everything is a win. They'd rather hire the 30-year-old US-born citizen who is an "A" player but that is a small pool in what I do for a living. The strong Americans tend to go into other disciplines that pay better than engineering. It used to be that everybody wanted to go to med school. Then it morphed into wanting to be in finance.
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:39 AM
 
7,610 posts, read 8,813,206 times
Reputation: 9837
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoffD View Post
It's really not being racist. I'm 61. If I apply for a vanilla tech job where I don't disclose my age or any work experience more than 15 years ago, HR is going to Google me, get my age, and toss my application in the trash.
They might. Or the company may want to hire you on contract, which allows them to transfer those costs out of a different bucket as well as not have to cover your health insurance. Companies have certain metrics in regards to hiring, headcount, diversity, along with financial/accounting strategies. Multinational companies with headquarters outside the U.S. may be partial to hiring where their main corporate centers are located (HR/IT/Finance etc). Ultimately though when a job need exists, the manager wants to find the best/most qualified person who they believe will play well with the others.

I've known and worked with a few folks over 60 who were on contract. I've taken contracts myself over age 50. A lot of tech companies (perhaps not just tech) look to replace the most expensive staff, which also often happens to be those over age 50. It's been that way at just about every tech company I've worked for, over a span of 20+ years.
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:47 AM
 
571 posts, read 120,242 times
Reputation: 654
Quote:
Originally Posted by lottamoxie View Post
I've known and worked with a few folks over 60 who were on contract. I've taken contracts myself over age 50. A lot of tech companies (perhaps not just tech) look to replace the most expensive staff, which also often happens to be those over age 50. It's been that way at just about every tech company I've worked for, over a span of 20+ years.
It's sure easy to run into IRS issues though. Companies that want FTE equivalents under contract have something of a problem.

In terms of 'the US doesn't have enough engineers', I think that simply isn't true. It tends to be the sort of opinion that comes reading Forbes rather than seeing it in action.

Some companies can be a small-scale version of the mass immigration problem. Once a beachhead of people are hired, typically from South Asia, you can essentially count on most/all new hires to come from a similar area once the management wall is breached.
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:54 AM
 
7,610 posts, read 8,813,206 times
Reputation: 9837
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrawberrySoup View Post
It's sure easy to run into IRS issues though. Companies that want FTE equivalents under contract have something of a problem.

In terms of 'the US doesn't have enough engineers', I think that simply isn't true. It tends to be the sort of opinion that comes reading Forbes rather than seeing it in action.

Some companies can be a small-scale version of the mass immigration problem. Once a beachhead of people are hired, typically from South Asia, you can essentially count on most/all new hires to come from a similar area once the management wall is breached.
I made no mention of "enough engineers" in the US or elsewhere. You're addressing someone's points, but not any of the ones I made.
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Old 08-21-2019, 11:48 AM
 
1,149 posts, read 553,004 times
Reputation: 1972
Quote:
Originally Posted by fluffythewondercat View Post
I'm sorry, but you don't know what you're talking about. Now you're just being racist.

"Big tech companies" hire many Americans. Do they bring over workers on H-1B visas? Sure, because this country still can't supply all the tech workers needed.

Read the other C-D forums. There are countless Americans weighing job offers from those "big tech companies" and trying to decide whether or not to relocate.
They bring them over because they’re cheaper. Same reason they send work offshore. Anyone who has worked in tech knows the gig.
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Old 08-21-2019, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Denver, CO
1,726 posts, read 4,092,429 times
Reputation: 1310
Easy to just blame the colored folks, rather than own up to what one can do to secure and retain employment.
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Old 08-21-2019, 11:58 AM
 
1,149 posts, read 553,004 times
Reputation: 1972
Quote:
Originally Posted by lottamoxie View Post
They might. Or the company may want to hire you on contract, which allows them to transfer those costs out of a different bucket as well as not have to cover your health insurance. Companies have certain metrics in regards to hiring, headcount, diversity, along with financial/accounting strategies. Multinational companies with headquarters outside the U.S. may be partial to hiring where their main corporate centers are located (HR/IT/Finance etc). Ultimately though when a job need exists, the manager wants to find the best/most qualified person who they believe will play well with the others.

I've known and worked with a few folks over 60 who were on contract. I've taken contracts myself over age 50. A lot of tech companies (perhaps not just tech) look to replace the most expensive staff, which also often happens to be those over age 50. It's been that way at just about every tech company I've worked for, over a span of 20+ years.
This.

I finally left my Silicon Valley career when I was told that all my staff needed to be offshore, for budgetary reasons. I was the only U.S. born person in a group of 12. This was one of the most prestigious tech companies on the planet. Still is.
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Old 08-21-2019, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Dayton, OH
633 posts, read 288,037 times
Reputation: 2758
Quote:
Originally Posted by billl View Post
A good friend of mine has just turned 60, and has been looking for work in IT support for the past several years (a career he has been active in for 35 years). He finally gave up and has taken a job at Menards. He's going to get his CDL and training for driving forklifts. So there are some places that aren't afflicted with ageism and are still willing to hire those with greater life experience.
Hope your friend can manage on the drastically reduced pay which is certain to follow.

I am about to be laid off for the second time in three years due to medical offices closing.

In 2016, I was making almost $30/hr.

The job I'm in now pays $23/hr. It ends on September 30th.

Today, I just got a job offer for $14/hr. Note that 20 miles down the road, Amazon is paying their folks $15/hr. to pack boxes.

I am 58 years old and look 10 years younger. I have a master's degree in English (yeah, don't say it) and 12 years of medical administrative support experience. I have solid computer skills, and all the rest of the blah blah blah. So I am not without skills. Of course, residing in the bowels of the Earth that is Dayton, OH likely has something to do with my steady decline in income and general feelings of despair.

At this point, I am seriously considering taking 26 weeks of unemployment, forgetting about trying to maintain health insurance coverage, and calling it a day.

Last edited by OHNot4Me; 08-21-2019 at 01:49 PM..
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