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Old 08-31-2019, 09:05 AM
 
Location: The beautiful Rogue Valley, Oregon
7,419 posts, read 15,512,080 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nefret View Post
As a physician, he was going to follow what the family wanted regardless of any wishes that the patient had set down in writing, witnessed and notarized, in advance of end of life care.
Years ago, when my father died, his sister and I fought over his care. I had my father's medical power of attorney, he had signed various health care documents about his care, but because his very religious sister thought it was a "sin" not to do everything possible and objected, the hospital was ignoring the documents and my stated orders. I finally had to go in to the administrators office, put the documents on her desk and ask her if I needed to bring a lawyer in.

Also, if someone is in a hospital and wants no intervention, you need to have a POLST or MOLST (called different things in different states) signed by the doctor and posted in the room. The argument goes that the staff doesn't have time to look for an advanced directive in an emergency, so this document is, effectively, a medical DNR/no intubation order, signed by the most-hallowed DOCTOR and stands a better chance of being followed.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:05 AM
 
Location: Haiku
4,699 posts, read 2,744,044 times
Reputation: 6867
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coloradomom22 View Post
So we talk about not wanting to linger yet we fully support Medicare to pay for all of these advancements that essentially cause people to linger. It is a very slippery slope because some advancements truly extend lives that are very high quality. Who is to say when a procedure should not be allowed? Is it a certain age? Or just a certain procedure? Should we allow heart procedures but not new knees/hips at a certain age? My 81 year old aunt just had her hip replaced which gave her a new lease on life. My own father had his life extended for years because of a heart procedure and we are very grateful as we are so happy to have him here. It would have been tragic if his age would have caused him to be denied. There are no easy answers to any of these problems.
It is difficult. It is more difficult for those of us without close family to shepherd us through the stages. And it is more difficult for those of us who have a great aversion for becoming dependent upon others for every day living.

On a personal level, I have stopped going to doctors for routine stuff. No colonoscopies, no flu shots, no check-ups. If I break something, which I did a year ago, I get it repaired but otherwise avoid the system. It is my response to not getting sucked into the machine of managing elderly people excessively, keeping them propped up so they can linger a while longer. I am 68 now but will I still be saying this when I am 75 or 80 and falling apart? I would like to think so but it is a slippery slope so who knows?
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:13 AM
 
114 posts, read 32,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW-type-gal View Post
I suspect a lot of seniors won't be able to afford the $3,000-$6,500 a month plus charges for extras that a lot of these assisted living places require, much less an actual nursing home. The era of the extremely generous pension has closed for people still working (they are out there, just not as common as they were) and even with millions in savings it gets eaten up quickly.

My MIL had a long-term care policy that she relied on, but it wasn't very good and her out-of-pocket fees were pretty high.
I haven't and won't sign up for long term care insurance.

The way I see it is that if there comes a time when I need to go to a nursing home or other "assisted living," I'll be almost dead anyway, so it's not like my finances will be a big concern for me at that point.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:26 AM
 
14,475 posts, read 7,740,023 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surfer Guy View Post
I haven't and won't sign up for long term care insurance.

The way I see it is that if there comes a time when I need to go to a nursing home or other "assisted living," I'll be almost dead anyway, so it's not like my finances will be a big concern for me at that point.

Long term care insurance isn't for you. It's so your spouse doesn't get wiped out if you land in memory care or a nursing home. If you're solo, yep. It's not a great bet.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:28 AM
 
Location: SW Florida
211 posts, read 193,756 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShadow View Post
I think the author may have a different opinion when he's 74. I know many, many fairly healthy and still mentally vibrant folks well over 75. I look around at my neighbors and, other than some loss in driving skills, most of them are as mentally and physically active at 70+ as most of my 50+ friends. He's entitled to his opinions, and at least he isn't using them to advocate for public policy changes or rationing of care to those over 75. I completely understand his position, I just don't believe he will continue to feel this way when he is actually facing his own mortality. Or maybe he will just so he can prove his point. I personally think that elders have worthwhile contributions to make, often simply because they are elders. Caring for my own mom and MIL in their decline taught me so much about myself, and enriched my understanding of life and it's conclusion. It filled me with newfound compassion and patience for those with frailties and diminished abilities. It taught me how to cope with the loss of vigor and intellect with both humor and understanding. As my MIL use to say getting old isn't pretty, and it's definitely not for sissies. And given the choice to get old or not, I'll take the former. Your mileage may vary.
I agree and I wanted to rep you but wasn't able to do it. I see many folks in my community, helping out, doing activities, and making valuable contributions to our community. Much of the work to keep this place in order is done by resident volunteers.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:34 AM
 
178 posts, read 109,597 times
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One of the bigger issues in my opinion is that we are also spread out. Sure, elderly could probably get along just fine with some assistance as you said. The problem is that that really requires family and a support network to be around and close by. Most things will go well and things will be uneventful. When the sh*t hits the fan though itís critical that someone non predatory is in the mix.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:38 AM
 
Location: Loudon, TN
6,007 posts, read 4,984,787 times
Reputation: 20437
Many forms of LTC insurance also pay for assistance in your home for the ADL's such as a helper to help you with bathing or dressing, etc, if that becomes an issue. I personally purchased LTC insurance after seeing a friend in her 30's become progressively disabled due to early onset Parkinson's disease. I realized that even after something like a car accident one could become sufficiently disabled to be unable to care for one's self at home alone. We, her friends and husband, took care of her at home in a rotating schedule for about a year until everyone became so exhausted from the routine that she needed to go to a group home since her husband needed to travel 2-3 weeks a month for a living, and we all had our own young families and elderly parents to care for. Her husband ended up divorcing her so that she would eventually become eligible for state assistance after the look back period. His salary and her SSDI was not enough to pay for her LTC needs at the group home and his own expenses. It was a pretty awful situation. She went on to live with the worsening effects of PD for another 25 years.
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Old 08-31-2019, 10:00 AM
 
2,501 posts, read 884,221 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meekawal View Post
They knew the 2nd day he was in the hospital that he wasn't going to make it yet, continued day after day with these tests, etc. In my opinion, they were using him for money since we had good health insurance. (Medicaid and Medicare also picks up costs for people that can't afford it and, in my opinion, hospitals use that as well.) I've seen a lot of my senior friends getting surgeries that should not have been done at their age.
I know and sometimes it's the patient driving it, too. I know of 3 people over age 75 who had bone marrow or stem cell transplants. None survived more than a year after that. Having read plenty on the Acute Myeloid Leukemia FB page before DH died, I know that it was a "Hail Mary" that might work but if you developed graft-vs.-host disease (basically a rejection of the donated material) it typically led to a ton of suffering and usually death, even in young people.

I'm 66 and darned healthy but I hope that if I get a scary diagnosis I'll have the guts to say "Game Over" rather than submit to treatments that have a 5% chance of success and a 100% chance of making my last days on earth miserable.
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Old 08-31-2019, 10:08 AM
 
Location: too far from the sea
20,209 posts, read 19,214,182 times
Reputation: 34453
Quote:
Originally Posted by Surfer Guy View Post
I haven't and won't sign up for long term care insurance.

The way I see it is that if there comes a time when I need to go to a nursing home or other "assisted living," I'll be almost dead anyway, so it's not like my finances will be a big concern for me at that point.
Several of my late relatives went to assisted living. It's not like a nursing home. They could still have their car and they could come and go as they pleased. One aunt and uncle went to assisted living because they lived far away from family and also the wife said she was sick of cooking. I think they stayed there for a year but didn't like it because it didn't have a yard--you were cooped up in your apartment. So they bought a condo near their daughter and paid people to come in and help when needed. Both lived to be about 100.

Other relatives went to assisted living after their spouse died and they just couldn't live alone anymore. They usually had a cute apartment, decent meals, and someone to come around and make sure they took their medicine. Some needed help bathing, etc.

Assisted living facilities are cropping up all over the place where I live. As if there weren't already enough! Sometimes I think I wouldn't mind living in one because it's scary when you're sick and can't take care of yourself and have to depend upon your neighbors. Biggest benefit would be the meals! I also like the idea of having people around to socialize with and some of the planned activities sound like fun.

Now, a nursing home is a totally different thing. Give me hospice if it comes to that!
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Old 08-31-2019, 10:26 AM
 
14,475 posts, read 7,740,023 times
Reputation: 26529
Quote:
Originally Posted by in_newengland View Post
Assisted living facilities are cropping up all over the place where I live. As if there weren't already enough! Sometimes I think I wouldn't mind living in one because it's scary when you're sick and can't take care of yourself and have to depend upon your neighbors. Biggest benefit would be the meals! I also like the idea of having people around to socialize with and some of the planned activities sound like fun.

From personal experience, if you're sick, the assisted living place will eject you to the emergency room in an ambulance. They're not capable of much beyond med management for residents too dotty to take their Rx when they're supposed to. Any services you need are pay-per-service. If you are incontinent, you pay big bucks so they can order the adult diapers and wipe your butt. If you need assistance showering, you pay for that. Ditto with assistance dressing.
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