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Old 10-01-2019, 07:50 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
24,637 posts, read 18,332,889 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giesela View Post
Um. Till what age? I think the statistics about never marrying are pretty low. Your comment doesn't really have much meaning without an age. What you are saying is that educated, going to college types put off marrying till later.
I'm 33. I'm well past the age of first marriages, even on the coasts. I love my girlfriend, but I don't think marriage would work for various reasons. At this point, I really don't think I'll find a good marriage candidate locally.
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Old 10-01-2019, 03:59 PM
 
7,294 posts, read 4,016,226 times
Reputation: 15012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lieneke View Post
Many people make a lot of strange assumptions about people who choose to be single. What I think is more weird is single men who try to move in with women who own a home. These Peter Pan types live month to month, spend every penny as soon as it is earned, and genuinely expect that someone else should put a roof over their heads and a meal on the table. They are the merry grasshoppers in the Ant and the Grasshopper.

Being single or married is a choice, but people who are married tend to judge those who choose to be single as having something wrong with them - as though being independent and self-sufficient is a weakness. It's a hangover from the 19C to view single life as inferior to married life, but times are changing - slowly.
The irony about looking at single life as "those poor lonely creatures" or "there must be something wrong with them" is that, I read a study some years ago that had the four groups of people judge themselves in terms of happiness. The study found the order of happiness, starting with the MOST happy:

1. Single women
2. Married men
3. Single men
4. Married women

So the single women group were found to be the happiest, married men the next to happiest, and married women was the unhappiest group.

I think some married women find it strange for other women to be single because they think they would be afraid or miserable, if they were single. And then some are jealous or envious of it. Some people view single women as independent, AND think that that's a bad thing.

It may be a matter of different strokes for different folks. I personally think most men aren't very happy if they aren't married or have a partner. Just going from my personal observations.
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Old 10-01-2019, 05:25 PM
 
8,341 posts, read 5,255,448 times
Reputation: 14172
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giesela View Post
Um. Till what age? I think the statistics about never marrying are pretty low. Your comment doesn't really have much meaning without an age. What you are saying is that educated, going to college types put off marrying till later.
It's been my observation that better-educated people marry later in life, but are more likely to marry than their less-educated counterparts, and are less likely to divorce.

To return this to the topic of retirement, I note that most retirement-planning advice for people of means (that is, those for whom some semblance of early-retirement is attainable), assumes a married couple - and generally a married couple with children. Singles without kids aren't the normal target of retirement-advice. Issues of inheritance, inheritance taxes and so forth... of final-directives, wills, power-of-attorney and so forth, are almost invariably aimed at married couples.

Indeed, one of the causes of the much-mentioned "inequality" in modern life, is that successful people tend to marry their peers. The two-income household can afford to save money, and as the extra savings exponentiate, they build higher net-worth. Singles meanwhile struggle to pay the bills. For the OP, the challenge would be to find a "peer" who is marriage-material, in the locale where he presently finds himself.
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Old 10-02-2019, 07:24 AM
 
3,424 posts, read 3,150,881 times
Reputation: 5042
Quote:
Singles meanwhile struggle to pay the bills.
That's a stretch generalization. Maybe in the hinterlands for singles who work a minimum wage job, but for singles in my peer group, we are doing just fine.
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Old 10-02-2019, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Miami, The Magic City
3,040 posts, read 2,134,346 times
Reputation: 2084
Never had an issue being single and after my mid 20's didn't even think about it myself or what others might think. I also seem to be happier and have more freedom to do what I want when I want than many of my married friends. Ditto in terms of traveling by myself and eating out at a restaurant by myself--not an issue.
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Old 10-02-2019, 07:44 AM
 
1,703 posts, read 378,609 times
Reputation: 2111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
I'm lifelong legally single. I just closed on a property Friday. I've met various people at restaurants, bars, etc.., since then. I've gotten the impression from them that being a single male property owner is "weird."

I don't see myself marrying. This "condition" will likely persist. It's unlikely that I'll marry or have kids within the next couple of years.

As you aged and remained or become single, how did you handle it? Logistically and socially? Do you feel discriminated against because you choose to remain legally single?
It seems that you think being single is a "problem" that needs to be solved or dealt with.
Lifelong single at 30 ? Really ?

Come back here when you're 70.
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Old 10-02-2019, 10:14 AM
 
8,341 posts, read 5,255,448 times
Reputation: 14172
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMSRetired View Post
It seems that you think being single is a "problem" that needs to be solved or dealt with.
Lifelong single at 30 ? Really ?

Come back here when you're 70.
People seem to forget that the conception of decency, morality, good sense and the very nature of reality itself, are contingent on our environment, our peer-group and the local social expectations.

Imagine living in some primitive tribe, where it is the custom to chisel children's teeth into sawtooth triangular shapes (there actually are such tribes). What we in modern America would consider to be a healthy person with healthy teeth, would in such culture be a freak, a disgrace and a blight on the village's sense of propriety. In some cultures, it was considered bizarre and downright immoral not to sacrifice humans to propitiate the gods, so that for example a bad harvest would be regarded as the result of insufficient blood-sacrifice, of lax behavior by the priest-sacrificers.

In some cultures, poverty is a problem. In others, poverty is venerated and wealth is a problem.

In some parts of America, even today it is normal to be married in one's early 20s; or if not married, to at least have a child or two. And by 70, it is common to become a great-grandparent.

However independent we are, whatever the heights of our individual fortitude, ultimately we exist in a milieu, in a community, and are judged by that community. Even if we grow our own food, derive our own electricity from windmills and solar cells, can our own vegetables and sew our own underwear, we depend on social acceptance and the propriety (or scorn) levied upon us by the prevailing opinion of those who surround us. This also why the country is sorting itself into mutually antagonistic political camps. People move to where they are culturally comfortable, even if the place is costly or the climate is harsh.

Ultimately we are not really ourselves. We are the aggregate of the beliefs and institutions around us.
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Old 10-02-2019, 11:45 AM
 
1,703 posts, read 378,609 times
Reputation: 2111
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
People seem to forget that the conception of decency, morality, good sense and the very nature of reality itself, are contingent on our environment, our peer-group and the local social expectations.

Imagine living in some primitive tribe, where it is the custom to chisel children's teeth into sawtooth triangular shapes (there actually are such tribes). What we in modern America would consider to be a healthy person with healthy teeth, would in such culture be a freak, a disgrace and a blight on the village's sense of propriety. In some cultures, it was considered bizarre and downright immoral not to sacrifice humans to propitiate the gods, so that for example a bad harvest would be regarded as the result of insufficient blood-sacrifice, of lax behavior by the priest-sacrificers.

In some cultures, poverty is a problem. In others, poverty is venerated and wealth is a problem.

In some parts of America, even today it is normal to be married in one's early 20s; or if not married, to at least have a child or two. And by 70, it is common to become a great-grandparent.

However independent we are, whatever the heights of our individual fortitude, ultimately we exist in a milieu, in a community, and are judged by that community. Even if we grow our own food, derive our own electricity from windmills and solar cells, can our own vegetables and sew our own underwear, we depend on social acceptance and the propriety (or scorn) levied upon us by the prevailing opinion of those who surround us. This also why the country is sorting itself into mutually antagonistic political camps. People move to where they are culturally comfortable, even if the place is costly or the climate is harsh.

Ultimately we are not really ourselves. We are the aggregate of the beliefs and institutions around us.
Then dare to be different. Be happy with yourself and who you are, not who "society" thinks you should be.
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Old Yesterday, 12:04 AM
 
7,294 posts, read 4,016,226 times
Reputation: 15012
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
People seem to forget that the conception of decency, morality, good sense and the very nature of reality itself, are contingent on our environment, our peer-group and the local social expectations.

Imagine living in some primitive tribe, where it is the custom to chisel children's teeth into sawtooth triangular shapes (there actually are such tribes). What we in modern America would consider to be a healthy person with healthy teeth, would in such culture be a freak, a disgrace and a blight on the village's sense of propriety. In some cultures, it was considered bizarre and downright immoral not to sacrifice humans to propitiate the gods, so that for example a bad harvest would be regarded as the result of insufficient blood-sacrifice, of lax behavior by the priest-sacrificers.

In some cultures, poverty is a problem. In others, poverty is venerated and wealth is a problem.

In some parts of America, even today it is normal to be married in one's early 20s; or if not married, to at least have a child or two. And by 70, it is common to become a great-grandparent.

However independent we are, whatever the heights of our individual fortitude, ultimately we exist in a milieu, in a community, and are judged by that community. Even if we grow our own food, derive our own electricity from windmills and solar cells, can our own vegetables and sew our own underwear, we depend on social acceptance and the propriety (or scorn) levied upon us by the prevailing opinion of those who surround us. This also why the country is sorting itself into mutually antagonistic political camps. People move to where they are culturally comfortable, even if the place is costly or the climate is harsh.

Ultimately we are not really ourselves. We are the aggregate of the beliefs and institutions around us.
You seem to suggest that it's the norm to be married in one's early 20s, or at least have one or two children by then. So if a person doesn't do that, they are judged by the community as abnormal.

It is no longer the norm to be married or have kids in one's early twenties. That changed quite a few years back.

The average marrying age is now close to 30. This means that quite a few DO marry earlier, and quite a few DO marry later. And some are unmarried partners with children.

As for how many Americans marry or not, I found this: In 1960, 72% of adults were married. In 2006, 55.7% of adults (over 18) were married. In 2017, 54.8% of adults (over 18) were married.

In 1960, only one in 10 adults (age 25+) had never been married. In 2012, one in five adults in that age range had never been married. https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2014...never-married/

America isn't as rigid and structured as to what's expected & accepted in societal relationships as it once was. There are all sorts of unions, and those with no unions, and a growing group of gay people who no longer feel pressured to marry the opposite gender, people living together long term but not marrying, and a growing number of never-marrieds. NOW it's more unusual to run across people who have been married to the same person for decades than to run across divorced or never-married people.
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Old Yesterday, 06:23 PM
 
8,341 posts, read 5,255,448 times
Reputation: 14172
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpollen View Post
...It is no longer the norm to be married or have kids in one's early twenties. That changed quite a few years back.

The average marrying age is now close to 30. ...

America isn't as rigid and structured as to what's expected & accepted in societal relationships as it once was...
I was referring specifically to the OP's locale, and by implication to my own locale, which isn't much different from his. Where I live, there are fewer college graduates, than high-school dropouts. The locals resemble the characters in the movie "Deliverance", except that in the movie, the characters had more musical talent. This isn't even the America of 1960. It's the America of 1760.
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