U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 05-11-2012, 09:17 PM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,860,277 times
Reputation: 11687

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly View Post
I keep harping on means testing. People retort with "Social Security / Medicare are not welfare." They heck they are not! They are simply dressed up to fool people they are not welfare / redistribution. Assuming there is no way to roll back the so called "mixed economic" (socialist / capitalist / corporatist) system we have any time soon, everyone needs to get over it and accept that these systems are wealth redistribution. So, now that we accept that, how about that means testing.
Not accepted, so I will vote for candidates who are against it. I have a hunch those candidates will also get more in the way of campaign contributions. I realize we have a serious and critical issue regarding aging in this country. I just don't think seniors should be lumped together and the problem solved on the back of other seniors. So which candidates are advocating replacing SS with personal savings accounts?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-11-2012, 09:23 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
21,536 posts, read 43,992,643 times
Reputation: 15135
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
Not accepted, so I will vote for candidates who are against it. I have a hunch those candidates will also get more in the way of campaign contributions. I realize we have a serious and critical issue regarding aging in this country. I just don't thing seniors should be lumped together and the problem solved on the back of other seniors.
He who has the gold, makes the rules.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 09:53 PM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,860,277 times
Reputation: 11687
Hard to redistribute if folks move to another state or renounce American citizenship.

News Headlines

Quote:
Last year, almost 1,800 people followed Superman's lead, renouncing their U.S. citizenship or handing in their Green Cards. That's a record number since the Internal Revenue Service began publishing a list of those who renounced in 1998. It's also almost eight times more than the number of citizens who renounced in 2008, and more than the total for 2007, 2008 and 2009 combined.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 10:09 PM
 
11,181 posts, read 10,204,616 times
Reputation: 20600
1,800 people isn't even a pimple on a gnat. I'll take notice when there are a few more zeros behind that number. Until then, be gone with them. America doesn't need wimps like that, anyway.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 10:21 PM
 
29,774 posts, read 34,860,277 times
Reputation: 11687
Quote:
Originally Posted by HereOnMars View Post
1,800 people isn't even a pimple on a gnat. I'll take notice when there are a few more zeros behind that number. Until then, be gone with them. America doesn't need wimps like that, anyway.
Aren't there people who want there money? It isn't the raw number but the wealth going with them and the pattern of increased numbers. Remember those at the top have more of an impact because they have more. One of the co-founders of Facebook has given up his US citizenship and is moving to Singapore. So it is not just the number of people and the wealth they represent but also their corporate presence and in many cases the jobs they create. As we know from all the hoopla about them that one percent carries a heck of a punch especially if they are the upper part of that 1%.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 10:33 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
21,536 posts, read 43,992,643 times
Reputation: 15135
Moving to greener pastures so they can get in on the ground floor somewhere else. Facebook guy is pretty young.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 10:45 PM
 
9,678 posts, read 15,858,885 times
Reputation: 16023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Escort Rider View Post
Excellent post. It's good to hear stories from people who have seen things from the inside. However, I do have a little personal quibble which has nothing to do with the substance of your post, and that is calling the people who availed themselves of your services "clients". To me (and I admit this is old-fashioned), a client is someone who pays someone else for services. I am a client of my CPA, to whom I pay a fee once a year to prepare and file my state and federal income tax forms. If I were to go looking for a handout, I would not consider myself a "client" and would not be expected to be called one.

I admit that your usage has become more the norm than mine, but I still don't like it. We live in an age of euphemisms, of which "client" is but one example. I fight against euphemisms by trying not to use them. I still say "mentally retarded", as I just can't stand "developmentally disabled", for example. I mourn the passing of clear-speaking; euphemisms to me represent an effort to delude ourselves that there are no negatives in life.

Perhaps a better name would be receipients?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-11-2012, 11:52 PM
 
11,181 posts, read 10,204,616 times
Reputation: 20600
Quote:
Originally Posted by TuborgP View Post
Aren't there people who want there money? It isn't the raw number but the wealth going with them and the pattern of increased numbers. Remember those at the top have more of an impact because they have more. One of the co-founders of Facebook has given up his US citizenship and is moving to Singapore. So it is not just the number of people and the wealth they represent but also their corporate presence and in many cases the jobs they create. As we know from all the hoopla about them that one percent carries a heck of a punch especially if they are the upper part of that 1%.
I see your point, TuborgP and I don't disagree that it's the one or two percent at the top who create a number of jobs in this country. Not all, but many. Still, (and I know this will sound dumb) I can't understand why someone would give up their citizenship to a country that gave them the opportunity to build their wealth, in the first place. If they're leaving because Uncle Sam is asking them to dig a little deeper into their pocket to help the elderly, they aren't really people I'd want to know, personally.

There are four categories of people that I believe should be cared for, no questions asked; children, our veterans, the severely disabled and our elderly who are living in poverty. For the rest, if they can get up every day without assistance and go about their day without the help of anyone else, they should be working, to pay their way. And if they are trying to do that, I'd give them a hand up, not a hand out. Not a darned thing wrong with being wealthy, either. It's what they do with the wealth that's more important. Like Forrest Gump's mama said, "Only so much fortune a man really needs, and the rest is just for showing off."

Didn't mean to hijack the thread but it headed south a while back so I was just throwing my two cents in.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-12-2012, 12:30 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
14,018 posts, read 17,732,288 times
Reputation: 32304
Quote:
Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly View Post
I keep harping on means testing. People retort with "Social Security / Medicare are not welfare." They heck they are not! They are simply dressed up to fool people they are not welfare / redistribution.....
Let's analyze Social Security and see if your statement that it is "welfare/redistribution" stands up to rational scrutiny. In order to receive retirement benefits, we must have first paid in via our payroll taxes, and then there is a correlation between how much we have paid in and for how many years with the amount we receive. Rich and poor alike receive their earned retirement benefits. If I won the lottery tomorrow, it would not change the amount of my Soc. Sec. monthly check.

However, these benefits do constitute wealth redistribution to a small and mild extent. That is because the formulas used to compute our benefits give low-wage earners a higher percentage of their earnings as benefits as compared to high-wage earners. This is partially offset (but only partially) by the greater longevity of people who earn more, because they live longer and collect more benefits that way.

You you are both right and wrong to call Soc. Sec. welfare, but you are more wrong than right.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-12-2012, 06:54 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 72,489,649 times
Reputation: 27565
You're assuming these 1800 are wealthy. I've read that some retirees leave the US because they cannot afford to retire here. Some of those 1800 may fall into that second category you know.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Retirement
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top