What neighborhood in Richmond?? (Triangle, Windsor: to rent, condos, crime)

[The Admiral]

Hi. I'm a single straight man, late 30's, moving to Richmond from Philadelphia. Trying to pick a neighborhood that will be fun but also safe. Money really isn't an issue. I've read about the Fan, Carytown, and also about some of the old homes in Church Hill. I realize Richmond isn't a big crowded northeast city, but to the extent possible I'd like to be able to walk to a part of town that has some density - nice restaurants, shopping etc. Is there anything like this in Richmond? Where is the most FUN and upscale part of town, or are the two mutually exclusive?

[ny_guy]

I've been going through almost this exact analysis (I'm moving down soon from NY; although I'm married with a kid, I'm in my mid-30s and have similar criteria for neighborhoods) so I might be able to help. We looked at homes in the Fan, Museum District and Church Hill (as well as some suburban neighborhoods that we ended up deciding not to choose), and we're actually in contract on a house in the Museum District now.

They were all very nice, but our impression of Church Hill was that it is a bit block-by-block - some blocks were extremely nice, some were not as nice. We weren't there at night, but just from a quick drive-around, we didn't feel unsafe even in the areas that looked a little less nice. The homes in Church Hill are older (mid-1800s) and reminded me more of the homes in Center City Philly. So although I have read that there is some crime in Church Hill, it didn't really seem like a huge issue from what I saw firsthand - although I probably wouldn't want my wife walking around there alone at night until we were much more familiar with the area because of what I've read. The houses that we were able to find there seemed a bit smaller (except for one mansion that's currently on the market), so that may be a factor too.

The Fan/Museum District, on the other hand, seemed a little more consistent throughout - I wouldn't have thought twice about walking around there at night, or sending my wife out to walk around. The whole area seems nice and doesn't really feel block-by-block in terms of walking by dodgy areas, etc, although I think Broad and Grace might have a few issues (nothing major - I ran around there at night; also, those are easily avoided by staying south of Monument when walking around at night). There were also people out (even in January) and it was all fairly well-lit. Finally, it felt a bit more filled-in in terms of places to go out - in Church Hill, for example, there are some amazing restaurants and other places, but they seemed to be a bit spread out from each other - not like the density of shops and restaurants, etc, in Carytown/the Fan.

The one counterpoint I'd make to what I said above is that it seems like the new really really hot places (the place you'd see in national magazines) seem to be popping up more around Church Hill than the Fan/Carytown, so if you'd want to be walking distance to the bleeding edge of what's going on in Richmond, Church Hill may be more your speed. I think there are also new condos around there, so if you're interested in newer finishes, Church Hill may hold some appeal.

Finally, although this isn't an immediate issue for you, the elementary schools in the Fan/MD/Near West End are far, far better than anything in Church Hill (from my research - people may disagree). I only mention that in case you're shopping for a house where you may eventually want children. Both areas seem to have plenty of single people, though.

The most upscale areas of town are probably the suburban-feeling Windsor Farms / River Road areas and the Monument Ave corridor through the Fan - in all those places, houses are likely over $1mm. Other than Monument, those areas aren't walkable and are more right-leaning than the central neighborhoods, so it really depends on what you're trying to find. I think people probably agree that all the areas you've mentioned have upscale parts, though.

Hope that's helpful!

[The Admiral]

That was VERY helpful, NY guy. BTW I also lived in NYC once so I know it well. Your views confirmed my initial impressions, that my best bet may be the Fan, and it sounds like the Monument Ave area has the nicest homes. I love the idea of a renovated 19th century home in Church Hill, but it sounds like gentrification has a little ways to go there and since I'm not familiar enough with the area, I think I'll stick to the Fan/Cary Town/Monument.

May I ask you some further questions? Which of those areas seem to have the most "density" to restaurants, shops etc from a walking around standpoint? I only breezed past that area once, otherwise, I've only experienced it via google maps "street view". But it seems that there are many more residential blocks than anything resembling a town center. Where is the center of gravity there - any particular blocks in Cary Town etc?

Also: I tend to prefer renovated older shells, or new construction. I avoid those listings that where the realtor shills "bring your own architect, this place hasn't been touched in years isn't that great??". No. It's not great for a guy like me works long hours and doesn't have a wife to help with these things. I want a turn-key, upscale property (doesn't have to be new construction; an old shell with a gut-reno interior is ideal). Is there a part of town that is likely to have that? Monument ave perhaps?

[ny_guy]

I hear you on the renovations. My wife and I both work long hours and were trying to avoid that too.

I know there's at least one turnkey property in the Fan right now that sounds a lot like what you want - it was a little smaller than we wanted for ourselves (we entertain large groups from out of town a fair amount; neither of us lives near family), but it was fairly large overall, it was great space (certainly plenty for one guy and even a small family, I'd say) and it was immaculately renovated. I forget the address but it was on Floyd. We saw it with Monte Todd of Long & Foster - we worked with him and really liked him.

I also think there's some new construction; I think I saw a listing or two hit Trulia while we were looking, but they weren't going to work for us so I didn't write them down. I'm pretty sure there's something on Cary east of Boulevard that's new construction (Cary is more residential there), and I think there were a few new places on Floyd (possibly near VCU, although I haven't seen the listing in a while).

From what I understand, I don't think Monument Ave is necessarily more likely to have renovated places than anywhere else - I think it's more expensive because the lots tend to be bigger and each of the homes seems to be grander, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of them haven't been touched in some time. I'm not sure there's anything even available there right now - there's one listing at 2704 Monument that seems to pop up on some sites but not others - I'm not sure whether it's actually available.

My impression of the centers of gravity for shopping/dining is as follows: Cary Street west of Boulevard to the highway; Main Street east of Boulevard to VCU; Robinson Street running North-South, and the "Devil's Triangle" around Park and Patterson west of Boulevard. Also Strawberry Street near Fox Elementary has a few places (Strawberry St Cafe, grocery, etc).

Finally, we heard over and over that inventory increases a lot in the springtime, so it might be better to rent and wait until then unless you find something you love. That happened to us: we found something that we were pretty sure we wouldn't find again, so we made a move now (much earlier than expected, actually) rather than waiting.

Last thing: Monument Ave is difficult to cross at certain blocks, so if you're looking on Monument (or on Grace or Broad), make sure you're near one of the crosswalk intersections (using Google Street View) if you want to walk to Carytown etc.

[ny_guy]

I hear you on the renovations. My wife and I both work long hours and were trying to avoid that too.

I know there's at least one turnkey property in the Fan right now that sounds a lot like what you want - it was a little smaller than we wanted for ourselves (we entertain large groups from out of town a fair amount), but it was fairly large overall, it was great space (certainly plenty for one guy and even a small family, I'd say) and it was immaculately renovated. I forget the address but we saw it with Monte Todd of Long & Foster - we worked with him and really liked him.

I also think there's some new construction; I think I saw a listing or two hit Trulia while we were looking, but they weren't going to work for us so I didn't write them down. I'm pretty sure there's something on Cary east of Boulevard that's new construction (Cary is more residential there), and I think there were a few new places on Floyd (possibly near VCU).

From what I understand, I don't think Monument Ave is necessarily more likely to have renovated places than anywhere else - I think it's more expensive because the lots tend to be bigger and each of the homes seems to be grander, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of them haven't been touched in some time. I'm not sure there's anything even available there right now.

My impression of the centers of gravity for shopping/dining is as follows: Cary Street west of Boulevard to the highway; Main Street east of Boulevard to VCU; Robinson Street running North-South, and the "Devil's Triangle" around Park and Patterson west of Boulevard. Also Strawberry Street near Fox Elementary has a few places (Strawberry St Cafe, grocery, etc).

Finally, we heard over and over that inventory increases a lot in the springtime, so it might be better to rent and wait until then unless you find something you love. That happened to us; we found something that we were pretty sure we wouldn't find again, so we made a move now (much earlier than expected, actually) rather than waiting.

Last thing: Monument Ave is difficult to cross at certain blocks, so if you're looking on Monument (or on Grace or Broad), make sure you're near one of the crosswalk intersections (using Google Street View) if you want to walk to Carytown etc.