A little long-winded but I like this subject, in fact I find it fascinating. Random thoughts, facts, and observations:
Wolfgang Wolck at UB has studied the "northern cities shift". It starts where others noted, although I've heard it out in the countryside north and a little west of Albany. North of Syracuse, in and around Syracuse, and about halfway between there and Rochester is where I'd describe it as, well, "severe". I say that as a guy who grew up in Greece, but whose parents and extended family are from Buffalo and Ontario Cty. I have a rather severe accent, and, no, it hasn't left me after moving south, in fact it's probably getting more severe as I get older. The extended family in Ontario Cty, and into Fairport, Macedon, and whatnot have a pretty severe accent, in fact it's pretty funny, when I think about it. It's almost like the 'a''s are higher-pitched and people there hang on to them longer than other parts of the region. Some of this can be heard in Wayne Cty. as well.
Here's the "Guide to Buffalo English":
The Guide to Buffalo English
Most of Michigan has it, and parts of WI, OH, IN, IL, MO (along the river, and into the outskirts of St. Louis), MN, and IA have it, too. Some Northeastern OH folks (Elyria, Parma, etc.) have an almost identical accent to Rochester. The Buffalo accent sounds more central Midwestern to me, as in Chicago.
Shortly after moving to SC I was in an auto parts store one night, chatting with the guy behind the counter. Guy looks at me and says "You're from Rochester". Not "Are you from Rochester?", or, "Where are you from?", just "You're from Rochester". I was like a deer caught in headlights, as in "You gotta be kiddin' me"
Most people here assume I'm from Wisconsin or thereabouts. I still habitually say "Neeeyork", instead of "New York", which seems to be another common peculiarity to "Rochester English".
The early French influence is key to the blending of syllables, as well as certain pronunciations and there are other Euro languages which do this, too, like Polish and Italian. I'd imagine the "queue" sound some are hearing comes from this, but I'm no expert. It stands to reason why this would be, considering Upstate's history going back to the 1600's, and the diverse Euro ethnic groups in and around the cities. I can mimic accents and dialects pretty well, as well as pick up on little idiosyncracies in how people talk. People in my family, more so the Buffalonians, do that "queue" thing all the time, and they do it with k's, too, for some reason. My dad does it, and he went to Catholic schools in Buffalo, all the way through college.
The severity of the Rochester accent, and points east, also pertains to hanging on to vowels
, the hard K's and C's, and funny "r" sounds/hanging on to r's.
"When arrrrr you goin' to TAAHHhoze?"
"When arrrrrr we goin' to the (sometimes "da") House ah Guitaaarzzzzz???" ("of" is just not annunciated in some circles).
"What time is the AAAAAHmerks game? We parkin' at Nuh/Neh/TANyellz?"
"C'mAAAAAaahhhhhn, AAAAAaaaaahhhmerks! Freakin' scorrrre, already!!!"
"You get those/dose SAAAAAYbers tickets, yet?"
"Let's go to DAAAaaahn and BAAAaaahb's", or "DAahn and BAaahb's".
I find it funny that despite these vocalizations, Rochester people tend to talk fast. It's common to hear people from all over the region say "RAAchster". It's like some words are dragged out, and others are blended and stated shorter than in other regions. Long, short, long, short, almost like there's a pattern to it. People like to make fun of how people talk in the South, but, good grief, some might argue the dialects up that way are in a category all their own, and one at which folks could easily poke fun
A movie set in the Rochester area pretty much sums up the RAAAschster accent; it's called "Drivers Wanted".
Like anywhere, it's moreso amongst working class folks, and in Rochester that generally pertains to the west side, and somewhat out in farm country. My accent reflects this, and in some social settings around there it can raise some eyebrows, even questions like "Are you from the west side?", or statements like "You must be from the west side".
People I know who grew up in the city, west and east sides have it even more severe than a lot of suburbanites. Personally, I can't help but have a good time around some of those friends because the accent is so funny, and the pronunciations are so specific to the area that it makes me laugh. Mostly they're from around Bay St. and points east and north from there (Parcells, Culver, etc.), and then over to Dutchtown and the old 10th Ward. Folks of Italian, Polish, and Ukranians descent seem to have it down pat.
Some folks I know who grew up in the city around Euro ethnic groups which were a different background from their own have taken on some of the vocalizations of those groups. The Italians win out, here, as they're the next largest ethnic group after Germans, and their vocalizations are strong. Folks who grew up in the city, and/or around Italians say "mingya" and other terms Italians with regularity (I still do this), and tend to sound like Italians with the inflection and whatnot. No doubt this is because of neighbors, fellow students, relatives, teachers, church associations, and other community influences. People in Rochester tend to be more dramatic than folks in other places, too
I've heard Italians from the two old major Italian neighborhoods (between Bay and Clifford/Waring Rd., and Dutchtown) who pretty much all sounded the same, and this has carried into Irondequoit, Greece, and Gates
, and other areas where there are pockets of Italians. These folks (Italians and folks who grew up around Italians/in the city) tend to have the accent/dialect in the most severe way, and they talk LOUD
Some of the Jewish folks I know in that area also have it, especially if they grew up in the city.
According to some experts, the "shift" is getting more pronounced, and spread out as time goes on. This is different from NYC. where fewer and fewer folks have the typical "NewYawk" dialect everyone knows. This is no doubt due to the fact it's truly international city, these days, and as people die off or move out the dialect has changed, or even disappeared amongst some younger folks.
Down in Columbia, and on down to the coast there's a definite French influence, as well. Like "shaaaarrrr-LAAAT", there's a street in Columbia called "Huger". The proper pronunciation is "HUGHHHH-geee", and it comes from the French influence in the region, before the Civil War. I'd argue that the accent/dialect down here is a mishmash of colonial English, French, West African, and, in some places, Spanish. What's kinda funny to me, though, is despite the fact people habitually say things with French pronunciations down here (like in Rochester), I've caught myself, even hesitated when pronouncing "Charlotte", the city. If I said "shaaaarrrr-LOT/LAAAT", down here, people would probably look at me as if I were crazy.
It's the same everywhere, it all depends on who was there first, in large numbers, and who came afterwards and became school teachers, etc. I'd imagine Catholic schools in the North (mostly) had something to do with the dialects up there, as large numbers of Catholics from Ireland, Germany, Poland, and Italy ended up there. Many sent their kids to Catholic school, only, in fact some in my extended family fall into that category. I'd imagine the early public school teachers were not as ethnically diverse as their counterparts in Catholic schools, at least for a couple of generations. You also have the large numbers of northern Europeans from Scandinavia and Holland who ended up in Upstate, in fact I think that's where a lot of the vocalizations come from. Most of those folks kept moving west, after they had a hand in building the canal (the first two canals), working on and around the canal for a while, preparing/selling land, and then moving into the Upper Midwest.
Why is this? The Erie Canal, Great Lakes shipping, and the railroads. The accent must have started in the Syracuse area, then moved through the Montezuma Swamp and points west
, all the way pretty much to the Dakotas (I've heard it in small towns out that way). I just got done reading about Great Lakes shipping, a fascinating book about lake shipwrecks, and now I see how the entire region was connected, back in the day.
The canal had what were called "canawlers" who were the barge workers, and folks who ran the docks along the canal. Then you had the lake boat crews, and associated folks, who intermingled with the canawlers in Buffalo (usually these were not in positive ways
). So, it stands to reason that with migration, the public and private schools, shipping/warehousing, and frequent associations with folks from across such a wide region that the accent spread far and wide.
I hope this wasn't too much for the Rochester forum, and I'm not trying to hijack the thread and whatnot. It's a subject I find fascinating, especially now that I don't live there anymore
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