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The snow wasn't too bad (the immense amount of salt on Rochester streets was bad), the cold wasn't too bad (the cost of heating was bad) -- but the biggest drawback to me for Rochester winters was an almost complete lack of sun from November through sometime in April.
The constant grey/black skies really got to me!
True, luckily the summer is almost just the opposite. In the month of May we got only .25 inches of rain (granted that was a record low, not the norm), and this week they are predicting sunny and mid 80s all week long! The winters do wear on even the toughest, but the other 3 seasons cannot be beat.
Last edited by rochacha; 07-30-2007 at 10:44 PM..
Reason: changed 3 months to 3 seasons
As for Dee62...its become pretty clear from your anti-semetic statement above that you are a nut and don't really know what you're talking about anyways
Anything you say! But like you I am very sad Rochester like so many of New York States cities have deteriorated into this! But I am afraid that your closed insular attitudes of denial,, (just like the attitutes of those in political power in Albany , Washington and on State street,,) have put the City of Rochester as well as Upstate NY in its present economic mess!
I wouldn't say upstate cities are in an economic mess. I drove through mural Mississippi this summer and would say that some of the towns that I saw there are in an economic mess. My issue has always been that Rochesterians always hype Rochester in a way that is only meaningful to other people that already like Rochester. Yes, there are economic issues, but it's not like the average upstater is walking around, shirtless, barefoot, and begging for change.
By the way, i'minformed, congrats on moving back. I'm totally jealous! If you don't mind me asking, in what industry do you work?
You know what's crazy? I've been driving around Florida imagining I'm in Rochester or the Finger Lakes. I mean the kind of driving where you snap-to and wonder how you drove the last 5 miles without crashing because you were dazing into the horizon. Survival mechanism I suppose...
And, on the issue of sprawl, you guys should see the Tampa Bay Area. It's truly mind-blowing. I can drive for an hour in any direction and never leave a strip mall. It's crazy.
I'm a self-employed architect, with a law degree. haha. I am a special case and I realize that it isn't nearly as easy for most people to move ANYWHERE as it is for me, so I consider myself lucky to be able to move back home so easily. My sister moved back from Maryland several years ago too, and it took her a solid year to actually make the move a real posibility.
Anything you say! But like you I am very sad Rochester like so many of New York States cities have deteriorated into this! But I am afraid that your closed insular attitudes of denial,, (just like the attitutes of those in political power in Albany , Washington and on State street,,) have put the City of Rochester as well as Upstate NY in its present economic mess!
last i checked, several upstate cities were losing population and some industry. at the same time, albany, e.g., is revitalizing with nanotechnology etc.. and things like GE/lockheed and the government will likely never go away from that area.
people complain about things like the taxes in upstate new york, but they don't complain about the quality of many of the tax based schools (which were often very good when i used to keep up on it there), which i also find sort of interesting.
closed and insular? probably less so than most anywhere else i've ever seen in the states.
anyhow, as far as people harping on upstate NY, there is that (economic "issue"), but almost as a result of that "issue", NY is one of the most beautiful places in the country (Adirondacks, Finger Lakes, Champlagne, NYC, the architecture, incredibly beautiful seasons, the history - women's suffrage, revolution, woodstock, underground railroad, hudson valley and it's arts, eccentric and progressive little college towns, etc. etc.). many places with "booming economies" i've seen are really sort of soul-less, corporate machines with lots of traffic, walmarts/targets/applebees/walmarts/targets/applebees.... i think i'd take a little less "boom" for a little more of the other stuff, personally. so, yeah, i guess we should keep complaining about upstate New York terrible place - you'd never want to live there.
Last edited by hello-world; 07-31-2007 at 03:06 PM..
Having grown up and lived in Rochester for most of my life, I'd have to say it's a decent place to live, with plenty to do year 'round, 4 distinct seasons, etc. Great place to raise a family (depending on which part of town you're in, and whom you decide to associate yourself with).
Without getting into the details, that region has suffered through years of awful decline, without any sizable industry being wooed to that area in the last, oh, I don't know, 50+ years? The politicians, unions, and sundry other special interest groups run NY. Rochester never was, nor will it ever be, a union town, yet the successes of Rochester's past have been bled dry by the Socialism which exists in NY, as well as the ineptitude of the politicians. Rochester was always a precision, professional, and high tech town, but after years of decline and a tarnished image, it's become yesterday's news.
The only significant job growth in Rochester during these last 20 years or so has been in the public sector and in health care (especially the last several years). People lament the fact that Kodak used to employ 60K+ in that town, and that smug "you weren't nuthin' if you didn't work for Kodak" attitude still persists to this day. Rochester was never a one company town, and it had plenty of industry, talent, skilled trades folks, and sundry other professionals who kept the whole works going for decades, despite the high cost of doing business in NY. Then folks got wise in the late 70's, through to today, and got out of Dodge. The Sun Belt has benefited from the also ran status of so many northern towns like Rochester.
Nowadays, the little manufacturing which is left there, as well as a few other industries, always have their hands out to Albany/Washington, just to keep the doors open. It's a vicious circle these days in Upstate, with no appreciable gains in private sector job growth. Thus the tax base declines, while public/private health care spending continues unbridled, and NY grapples with a $5B budget shortfall this year (in addition to the $50B the state already carries as debt).
If you're an outsider, good luck finding a job. Rochester has become a big "ya gotta have connections" town in the last 20+ years, and some of the smug locals look down their noses at, well, pretty much everybody else in this world. Most decent to good companies' HR offices have a pile of resumes to leaf through, with incredibly competent, educated folks, all looking for a decent job. Prepare to take a number. Few companies offer any kind of relocation assistance. Wages are, generally, 15%-40% below areas with lower costs of living. If you work for a company or organization with, say, more than 10 employees, you'll invariably work with disgruntled former Kodakers (or, for that matter, disgruntled folks from a host of companies which have shed numerous workers), incompetent folks who got their job because of their last name/ personal connections, etc., the list goes on. This is what happens to an area which is in permanent decline.
God forbid you get laid off, especially during a recession. Most folks under the age of 45 just simply move out of state when that happens, as you have little chance of finding a comparable job in yours or a related field, and the wages will most likely be exceptionally low. I was lucky to take only about a 10% pay cut after the one time I was laid off. Many people there do as I did; they go back to school, then eventually just move away.
Your new co-workers may look at you with contempt, derision, and jealousy, and may even openly and brazenly display this childish mentality. You'll cringe watching the nightly news, as yet another night of murder happened within the city, another drug bust happened in Greece, another company laid off its employees or closed down, another Kodak building is demolished, another bomb scare happened in Penfield schools, another Rochester house is torched, etc. It's like a mini Detroit or Newark. The ones who don't feel depressed or shudder at all this are the locals, who are mostly numb to it, and are in some ways brainwashed into thinking living in an area of permanent decline doesn't weigh on the mind, soul, and body.
When looking for a place to live, make sure you find one with a trendy/high end zip code. Nothing west of the river, or even south of town, will do. If people you barely know ask where you are from or where you live, ask them back if it's because they want to rob you. That always gets 'em! The only town outside of Monroe County which seems to be an "acceptable" place to live, according to many folks, is Victor. Still close to the Chee$ecake Factory and trendy Ea$tview Mall. Oh, and Pitt$ford Wegmans, too.
I've worked with lazy, angry, incompetent idiots, of all stripes, up there. What used to get folks fired for there is now swept under the rug, for various reasons. One reason is because nobody is moving there, so the talent pool continues to shrink. Companies in other parts of the U.S. wouldn't put up with the nonsense which goes on within Rochester companies. Most American workers wouldn't put up with the crap that goes on there, either. That whole group think, "we'll hold you over a barrel" attitude don't fly in other places, especially in areas with moderate to excellent job growth. I guess they treat people like that, up there, to keep the doors open. You'll invariably work with the usual "Rochester born and bred, Rochester is the greatest place on Earth", folks, who lament the fact that local retailers are supposedly being swallowed up by big box stores. They'll ask you if there's a Wegmans, Nick Tahou's, or some other local "culture" stuff in your hometown. Those are the "educated" ones, too.
They say Rochester is like a big small town, which I agree with, as everybody wants to know your business, where you grew up, where you work, where you went to school, etc. Prepare to be interrogated in all manner of social settings. Folks up there do that to keep people in their place. They act like they own you, somehow. If you work for a company or organization your interrogator has never heard of, prepare for that quizzical, deer in headlights, look. Same goes for real jobs they've never heard of. Rochester is one of the few towns in the U.S. where a generic liberal arts or business degree is enough to land a decent job. Oh, wait, it's all about connections=-) You'll get this from people who don't even work, or really don't do anything for a living. Potential landlords may also treat you this way. Many landlords there complain they can't find tenants, which, again, illustrates an area in decline. Some of those said landlords depend solely on rent money to get them through life, which is all but unheard of in other places.
Nobody is moving there, who isn't originally from there. At least not in any great numbers. What a difference from the 60's and 70's. So, you have to deal with the locals, many of whom have no clue what life is like outside Monroe County. The brainwashed masses love it there, with combined avg. school/property taxes in the $4K-$8K range, higher than average utility costs, higher than average auto ins. costs, etc.
I'll take my new environs, the little traffic we have, and the nice people around here over the stresses, decline, and ignorance of Rochester, any day of the week. My pay went up 20%, and my cost of living went down 15% or so, just by virtue of moving to here from Rochester. That place has its merits, but, it can be a rough town. Take my words with a grain of salt, as well as a little humor. Many folks there hate to hear anybody criticize their wonderful town;-)
Its one thing to criticize a place with facts. Its another thing to make ignorant untrue sweeping generalizations about the attitudes of people and employment situations. There may be one or two points in that long winded rant that hold any truth.
No, there aren't droves of transplants here but I've met more than I can count. Only a handful of people I've come across have the attitudes you describe. The overwhelming majority of people are very nice and accepting. I have not met one person with the "you're not nothing if you haven't worked at kodak" mindset.
I don't have connections and was able to find a decent job.The majority of my peers don't have connections and found jobs. I don't know of anybody looking down their nose at outsiders. Please tell me where all of these people exist because I haven't seen them. I don't know where you are getting this wage information either. I've worked with plenty of people since being in the workforce and former Kodak workers make up a minimum.
Your claims about crime are bunk as crime has gone down. I've never been robbed after being asked where I live. And please tell me where all of these people that think victor is the only acceptable place to live are.
I don't come across too many people that need to know my "business" as most people respect others privacy.
You are just making things up.
Your only valid points are what you said about property taxes and high utilities. The rest is bitter untrue dribble. Are you one of those bitter ex kodak employees you are talking about?
Having grown up and lived in Rochester for most of my life, I'd have to say it's a decent place to live, with plenty to do year 'round, 4 distinct seasons, etc. Great place to raise a family (depending on which part of town you're in, and whom you decide to associate yourself with).
Without getting into the details, that region has suffered through years of awful decline, without any sizable industry being wooed to that area in the last, oh, I don't know, 50+ years? The politicians, unions, and sundry other special interest groups run NY. Rochester never was, nor will it ever be, a union town, yet the successes of Rochester's past have been bled dry by the Socialism which exists in NY, as well as the ineptitude of the politicians. Rochester was always a precision, professional, and high tech town, but after years of decline and a tarnished image, it's become yesterday's news.
The only significant job growth in Rochester during these last 20 years or so has been in the public sector and in health care (especially the last several years). People lament the fact that Kodak used to employ 60K+ in that town, and that smug "you weren't nuthin' if you didn't work for Kodak" attitude still persists to this day. Rochester was never a one company town, and it had plenty of industry, talent, skilled trades folks, and sundry other professionals who kept the whole works going for decades, despite the high cost of doing business in NY. Then folks got wise in the late 70's, through to today, and got out of Dodge. The Sun Belt has benefited from the also ran status of so many northern towns like Rochester.
Nowadays, the little manufacturing which is left there, as well as a few other industries, always have their hands out to Albany/Washington, just to keep the doors open. It's a vicious circle these days in Upstate, with no appreciable gains in private sector job growth. Thus the tax base declines, while public/private health care spending continues unbridled, and NY grapples with a $5B budget shortfall this year (in addition to the $50B the state already carries as debt).
If you're an outsider, good luck finding a job. Rochester has become a big "ya gotta have connections" town in the last 20+ years, and some of the smug locals look down their noses at, well, pretty much everybody else in this world. Most decent to good companies' HR offices have a pile of resumes to leaf through, with incredibly competent, educated folks, all looking for a decent job. Prepare to take a number. Few companies offer any kind of relocation assistance. Wages are, generally, 15%-40% below areas with lower costs of living. If you work for a company or organization with, say, more than 10 employees, you'll invariably work with disgruntled former Kodakers (or, for that matter, disgruntled folks from a host of companies which have shed numerous workers), incompetent folks who got their job because of their last name/ personal connections, etc., the list goes on. This is what happens to an area which is in permanent decline.
God forbid you get laid off, especially during a recession. Most folks under the age of 45 just simply move out of state when that happens, as you have little chance of finding a comparable job in yours or a related field, and the wages will most likely be exceptionally low. I was lucky to take only about a 10% pay cut after the one time I was laid off. Many people there do as I did; they go back to school, then eventually just move away.
Your new co-workers may look at you with contempt, derision, and jealousy, and may even openly and brazenly display this childish mentality. You'll cringe watching the nightly news, as yet another night of murder happened within the city, another drug bust happened in Greece, another company laid off its employees or closed down, another Kodak building is demolished, another bomb scare happened in Penfield schools, another Rochester house is torched, etc. It's like a mini Detroit or Newark. The ones who don't feel depressed or shudder at all this are the locals, who are mostly numb to it, and are in some ways brainwashed into thinking living in an area of permanent decline doesn't weigh on the mind, soul, and body.
When looking for a place to live, make sure you find one with a trendy/high end zip code. Nothing west of the river, or even south of town, will do. If people you barely know ask where you are from or where you live, ask them back if it's because they want to rob you. That always gets 'em! The only town outside of Monroe County which seems to be an "acceptable" place to live, according to many folks, is Victor. Still close to the Chee$ecake Factory and trendy Ea$tview Mall. Oh, and Pitt$ford Wegmans, too.
I've worked with lazy, angry, incompetent idiots, of all stripes, up there. What used to get folks fired for there is now swept under the rug, for various reasons. One reason is because nobody is moving there, so the talent pool continues to shrink. Companies in other parts of the U.S. wouldn't put up with the nonsense which goes on within Rochester companies. Most American workers wouldn't put up with the crap that goes on there, either. That whole group think, "we'll hold you over a barrel" attitude don't fly in other places, especially in areas with moderate to excellent job growth. I guess they treat people like that, up there, to keep the doors open. You'll invariably work with the usual "Rochester born and bred, Rochester is the greatest place on Earth", folks, who lament the fact that local retailers are supposedly being swallowed up by big box stores. They'll ask you if there's a Wegmans, Nick Tahou's, or some other local "culture" stuff in your hometown. Those are the "educated" ones, too.
They say Rochester is like a big small town, which I agree with, as everybody wants to know your business, where you grew up, where you work, where you went to school, etc. Prepare to be interrogated in all manner of social settings. Folks up there do that to keep people in their place. They act like they own you, somehow. If you work for a company or organization your interrogator has never heard of, prepare for that quizzical, deer in headlights, look. Same goes for real jobs they've never heard of. Rochester is one of the few towns in the U.S. where a generic liberal arts or business degree is enough to land a decent job. Oh, wait, it's all about connections=-) You'll get this from people who don't even work, or really don't do anything for a living. Potential landlords may also treat you this way. Many landlords there complain they can't find tenants, which, again, illustrates an area in decline. Some of those said landlords depend solely on rent money to get them through life, which is all but unheard of in other places.
Nobody is moving there, who isn't originally from there. At least not in any great numbers. What a difference from the 60's and 70's. So, you have to deal with the locals, many of whom have no clue what life is like outside Monroe County. The brainwashed masses love it there, with combined avg. school/property taxes in the $4K-$8K range, higher than average utility costs, higher than average auto ins. costs, etc.
I'll take my new environs, the little traffic we have, and the nice people around here over the stresses, decline, and ignorance of Rochester, any day of the week. My pay went up 20%, and my cost of living went down 15% or so, just by virtue of moving to here from Rochester. That place has its merits, but, it can be a rough town. Take my words with a grain of salt, as well as a little humor. Many folks there hate to hear anybody criticize their wonderful town;-)
....yawn. blah blah blah same old same old. Don't worry, you've escaped this HORRIBLE place and never have to come back. The rest of us who never left, or have returned (like me, who also moved to the crapolinas) will just stay here and be ignorant/smug, whatever the hell else everyone who doesn't like the area stereotypes us "booster's" as.
I'm sorry that you had a bad experience in Rochester. I hope you're happy in your new home, wherever it may be. Perhaps you intentionally left it out for fear of the onslaught of Rochestarians that may have followed and attacked you because of your libelous post.
Since your location is now South Carolina...do not worry, you will not run into anyone from upstate New York there. LOL. Good riddance.
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terrible place - you'd never want to live there.
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