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Old 05-25-2012, 04:15 PM
 
Location: Burlington, Colorado
347 posts, read 729,514 times
Reputation: 498

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Kind of, I'm a supporter of a system where if you work hard and want to have some space to shoot, hunt, swim, be close to nature, etc, you can buy some land and do it. If you want to work hard and use your money to buy a tiny lot in a crowded subdivision where you have no exposure to nature (which I agree would stink)... I think that is up to you if that is what will make you happy, its a short life. If, as a society, we want to spend some of our tax dollars for "public spaces", great. I understand you see it differently and I respect that... but I don't say that you just haven't "seen the sun" when it comes to the joys of private land ownership.. its just a difference of opinions.

 
Old 05-25-2012, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
17,841 posts, read 18,171,430 times
Reputation: 44013
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJBarney View Post
When you contribute to the purchase price and taxes on my land, you can enter. I'm waiting.


Of course I want it "all to myself." I PAID for it. I PAY for it all year long.

You mind if I occasionally come over and borrow your car for a few days from time to time, without meeting you or asking you? Or do you want your car ALL TO YOURSELF?
I'm a land owner,too, and I laughed out loud at your comment.
 
Old 05-25-2012, 05:27 PM
 
24,841 posts, read 32,887,308 times
Reputation: 11471
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
Yup, there is nothing that a few trips a year to remote parklands cannot fix (if you can afford it). I'm talking about everyday life of everyday people having no readily accessible space around them to enjoy and you throw at me some distant parklands in Texas and Metro Detroit area park maps. That what happens if you cage and deprive people of the accessible space for generations. They accept their caged existence as the only possible. For three pages already I try to explain that there were/are times & places (that includes USA, btw) where unregulated access to public (rather communal) land was/is an integral part of every day existence of an average community. All I'm getting map of parks and suggestions to drive 100 - 1000 miles to get my fair share of space. Yet, some people think I'm arrogant to say that you cannot explain Sun to cavemen who never saw it.
This is fun in the cage.


Coonhounds working coon in roll cage - YouTube
 
Old 05-25-2012, 05:34 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,490 posts, read 38,407,488 times
Reputation: 23086
Quote:
Originally Posted by RememberMee View Post
Yup, 400 miles round-trip to enjoy the public bounty of abandoned mine sites in SE & S Ohio. That sounds as very appealing ersatz of public space most of Ohioan don't have.

I think we are clearly speaking about different things. I'm talking about accessible public space in a context of every day existence (like a river bank, lake or forest on outskirts of a town for kids to play, for example) and you all are pointing to 200+ miles trips that can make up for the lack of public space in everyday life. What can I say more except that I'm trying to describe Sun to the people who never experienced it? And I'm afraid I'm starting to repeat myself.
I'm thinking and I can't think of a city that I've lived in or visited (and we're talking major cities here in many cases) that didn't have exactly what you're talking about.

And your Sun analogy? It's already been explained to you that it doesn't work and only makes you look arrogant and not too bright, given that you don't appear to be aware of the many parks and public lands (within and without of city limits) that are available and can be found with a few seconds of googling.

Heck, I'm in Canada, Toronto, right now, visiting family, and I've been to several such places that are easily accessible via bus lines and was able to find them and how to get there with no problem whatsoever. First time I've ever been here. I've managed the same in many other cities that I've visited.

What cities are you talking about that don't have this as a matter of course? Give some examples and we'll see what we can confirm about that.
 
Old 05-25-2012, 05:36 PM
 
Location: Central Texas
20,490 posts, read 38,407,488 times
Reputation: 23086
By the way, one of the links that I posted above (that you apparently didn't look at) was to parks in an around Detroit.
 
Old 05-25-2012, 05:59 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
17,841 posts, read 18,171,430 times
Reputation: 44013
Our farm has been in our family for almost 100 years. My grandfather didn't post the land because most people understood how to treat private land (ask permission to hunt, not damage or steal things, etc.).

My father started to post part of the land when people started to misuse his trust. Strangers would go on our land and cut down Christmas trees (trees that we had trimmed and saved for our use or to sell for a little extra money), target practice around our cattle, throw beer parties in the woods and leave all the broken bottles for us to clean up, drag race on our farm fields, etc.

My siblings and I started to fence the outside & post all of our land when people started dumping old refrigerators and trash that we had to pay to haul away, people would come with chainsaws to cut firewood and steal things & then spray paint obscene pictures on sheds in the woods.

We are very happy to let neighbors, who ask permission first, walk on our many trails, picnic and enjoy the quiet wonders of nature. In fact, many summer days there are numerous respectful neighbors and friends using our woods. But, we have had our fill of rude, obnoxious strangers who come on our land just to damage it.
 
Old 05-25-2012, 06:06 PM
 
570 posts, read 1,161,648 times
Reputation: 750
Snickered my way through at least half this thread. A certain group of posts sounds much like sour grapes from a person who doesn't like the area he's stuck living in and isn't able to buy his own land or move away. And anyone who isn't aware that there are countless acres of beautiful public land, easily accessible, is either living under a rock or doesn't want to accept reality because it doesn't mesh with his rant. Just sayin'
 
Old 05-25-2012, 06:24 PM
 
2,878 posts, read 3,926,100 times
Reputation: 3083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driller1 View Post
This is fun in the cage.
Some sad little people having fun at expense of a caged, defenseless animal. 'Tis the culture, you should be proud of it, your ancestors decimated the buffalo, you may as well do the same to anything that is "lesser than you"

OD
 
Old 05-25-2012, 06:28 PM
 
2,878 posts, read 3,926,100 times
Reputation: 3083
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady View Post
National Forests and Grasslands Map (almost 190,000,000 acres)

You will note that there are not a lot in Texas. That's because Texas kept the vast majority of its public lands upon joining the Union, so most of our public lands are state parks rather than federal.

This does not include, of course, the numerous private property owners who open their lands to the public for a fee or, at the very least, the common courtesy of asking and receiving permission.

Seems to me someone has a bad case of Entitlement Syndrome.
The vast majority of Texas public land is in Big Bend National park (800,000 acres of Federal land) and Big Bend Ranch State park (I think about 400,000 acres?). There are grasslands in the north east, there is forest in the east (San Angelo etc.) so there is plenty of land in Texas.

However, in total, 96% of land in Texas is private owned

OD
 
Old 05-25-2012, 06:35 PM
 
2,878 posts, read 3,926,100 times
Reputation: 3083
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal View Post
Oh pleeeeeeeeeeeeze!

While prior to Europeans arriving in North America Native American Indians may not have held paper titles to land, they certainly did defend their territories from other tribes and used lethal force in so doing. Protection of game was protection of the tribe's survival. Nothing says "no trespassing" quite like burial grounds or a collection of scalps originating from the heads of feuding tribal members.
You have said this in other threads and it is pure garbage. Vast majority of Native tribes were nomadic and had hunting grounds that they warred over with other tribes. They never claimed the land individually as Westerners do/did. Furthermore, due to their lack of interest in exploiting other living beings, they simply never had (and never would have developed on their own probably) the technology to exploit vast lands and wipe out whole species (like the buffalo).

It's fine that we discuss these things as the clock cannot be turned back anyways, all this is philosophical. However, please do not perpetuate garbage.

I ask you, who is the uncivilized barbarian people, one who lived in harmony with Nature for thousands of years or ones that arrived and slaughtered 30 million buffaloes in a few years? This is just a small example of the atrocities that modern Western culture committed on Nature and Native people all over the planet, not just here. Most of it in name of greed and religion.

It's funny that we are debating "no trespassing" signs, especially on land that has been in generations of people who essentially stole it through genocide.

To the OP: all this is just pure debate, laws say you need to obey the "No trespassing" signs, it is private property and the law is the law. If you don't agree with it, tough luck, either have the laws changed legally or move on...

OD
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