Neighborhood Claims Homes Hit by Stray Bullets from Shooting Range (Garden Ridge: HOA, houses)

[majormadmax]

Much like the idiot couple that ran out of gas on a busy road, here's another sensationalized news story from WOAI...

Homes Hit by Stray Bullets from Shooting Range

GARDEN RIDGE, Texas -- Bullets flying into a subdivision have residents scared to walk outside their front doors.

Police believe the rounds are stray bullets coming from a nearby firing range in Garden Ridge. Residents said since bullets started flying into homes and yards and whizzing past joggers more than a year ago, they've been trying to get the firing range shut down.

The Bracken Rifle & Pistol Range has been on the outskirts of Garden Ridge for 25 years. Then in 2008, developers built the Wild Wind subdivision less than a mile away and right in the line of fire. Wild Wind HOA President Bob Shilliday said he's received 20 complaints of stray bullets littering the neighborhood. Four homes have been struck, including one that has been hit twelve times. (Full story)

Bracken Range has been in its current location for 25 years, and this new development is a little over a year old; but the residents think it's the range's responsibility to close down!

Developers should be required by law to notify potential residents of such things as nearby gun ranges, airports, quarries, military bases or any other establishment that may conflict with living in that location.

That way, the idiots can't act so surprised like this when things like this happen!

Actually, the probably still will; but at least that way they have no one to blame but themselves!

[sc hokie]

Normally I'm quite anti-idiot, but in this case I'd have to side with the residents. They shouldn't be allowed to complain about the noise, but Bracken should be held responsible for rounds that leave their property. Maybe a bigger berm on top of that hill behind the range might be all that's required to fix it.

Consider the case if I lived next door to you. I like to target practice in my front yard. If I violate one of the fundamental safety rules of firearms and fail to be aware of what's beyond my target and hit your house, I can't use the defense that I've lived on this street longer than you have. I shouldn't be liable for a noise complaint, but I should be held liable if I violate basic safety rules.

[majormadmax]

Sorry, but your analogy isn't the same; it's more like someone builds a house underneath the flight path of an airport then complains about the noise....

Ever been to Bracken Range? It's in an old quarry pit. Take a look at it on GoogleEarth, it's pretty deep. I honestly don't see how this many "strays" could be coming from it.

The neighborhood road closest to the range is just over a quarter of a mile away from the pistol range, or about 1500 feet (so ~500 yards). If I am not mistaken the rifle range faces a different direction. That makes me skeptical of these claims; but even if they are true the developer had to have known the range was there and choose to ignore it. Honestly, I don't think that's right, and demanding that a business close down that has been there so much longer than the neighborhood just isn't right...

[txtea]

I dunno.....I've been to that gun range many times, and I just don't see how that many "stray" bullets found their way to this new subdivision. The targets have more than enough backdrop behind them to keep that from happening. It would take some idiot shooting in the air, above the rim of the old quarry in order for a bullet to stray that far...and the management of the shooting range wouldn't tolerate that at all. The rifle range has targets placed at 50 and 100 yards, with a backdrop of quarry wall to stop the bullets. People go there to sight in their scopes, or just sharpen their shooting skills....not to shoot at birds passing overhead. I have a feeling this is just another story being blown out of proportion by the media, or the home owners trying to shut the place down because of the noise. Should have thought about that before you moved there!

[RGJ]

Problem is that I'll bet the builder/developer did not put a disclaimer in the paperwork about stray bullets, so more than likely all those Californians had no clue about a shooting range when they bought their house

[Dopo]

Originally Posted by majormadmax

Sorry, but your analogy isn't the same; it's more like someone builds a house underneath the flight path of an airport then complains about the noise....

Not a good analogy,
a better analogy would be "To buy a house close to the airport and keep on getting hit with s.... that falls off the plane"

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by Dopo

Not a good analogy,
a better analogy would be "To buy a house close to the airport and keep on getting hit with s.... that falls off the plane"

Agreed!

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by txtea

I dunno.....I've been to that gun range many times, and I just don't see how that many "stray" bullets found their way to this new subdivision. The targets have more than enough backdrop behind them to keep that from happening. It would take some idiot shooting in the air, above the rim of the old quarry in order for a bullet to stray that far...and the management of the shooting range wouldn't tolerate that at all. The rifle range has targets placed at 50 and 100 yards, with a backdrop of quarry wall to stop the bullets. People go there to sight in their scopes, or just sharpen their shooting skills....not to shoot at birds passing overhead. I have a feeling this is just another story being blown out of proportion by the media, or the home owners trying to shut the place down because of the noise. Should have thought about that before you moved there!

Yep, I have to agree with this as well. It's been a while since I shot at Bracken, but based on my experience a shooter would have to be hard-pressed to overshot the range. As I said, it's in a quarry pit that prohibits the majority of accidental shots over the berms.

Secondly, the management at Bracken is renown for being very strict and enforcing of the rules. In some cases, almost too much so; but the stories I hear from people who have shot there recently would leave me to believe that such nonsense would not be tolerated for a second.

Lastly, considering the way WOAI presented the story, it reeks of sensationalism. Dear God, it sounds like they are living in Kabul or Sarajevo; but I am curious why they didn't show any of these alleged hits against the houses that were claimed. A few bullet holes in someone's home wouldn't be something the reporters wouldn't show, as a matter of fact it would be something they would focus on!

This is why I hate local news, they are only competing for ratings and it is to the point of ridiculousness. Such drama, such hype, such crap! I only came across this story on the 'Net, and it sounded so crazy that I had to share!

[sc hokie]

Originally Posted by majormadmax

Sorry, but your analogy isn't the same; it's more like someone builds a house underneath the flight path of an airport then complains about the noise....

So if I sit on my front porch and start shooting off rounds I'm not responsible for what happens, just so long as I was there first? Or is it required to first be public knowledge that I'm prone to such actions? I'm not trying to oversimplify what you're saying, so please correct me if I don't seem to understand your point. Are you really saying someone is not responsible for a bullet that leaves their property?

Ever been to Bracken Range? It's in an old quarry pit. Take a look at it on GoogleEarth, it's pretty deep. I honestly don't see how this many "strays" could be coming from it.

The neighborhood road closest to the range is just over a quarter of a mile away from the pistol range, or about 1500 feet (so ~500 yards). If I am not mistaken the rifle range faces a different direction. That makes me skeptical of these claims; but even if they are true the developer had to have known the range was there and choose to ignore it. Honestly, I don't think that's right, and demanding that a business close down that has been there so much longer than the neighborhood just isn't right...

I have been there quite a few times as it's my normal range. I also referenced Google Earth to verify distances. You're correct that the rifle range is 90 degrees out from the direction to Garden Ridge. I also agree that the range owners are extremely strict and would not allow any shenanigans.

According to Google Earth the elevation of of range is 775ft above sea level. The height of the hilltop behind the range is 814ft and is 150 yards away. My trig calculations show the angle required to clear the hill as 5 degrees. I would have guessed the height difference to be more though. In any case, with the new addons to the ceiling at the pistol range there's no way anybody could shoot at a higher angle than 5 degrees. I can barely shoot at -5 degrees there to hit the bottom targets when standing and I'm 5'9".

The only range in the correct direction to Garden Ridge is the open pistol range used for classes. That is 508 yards to Wild Wind Park Rd.

I pulled some numbers from my Speer Reloading Manual #14 for .45 ACP 230gr RN. I plugged those numbers into JBM Ballistics's calculator. With a ballistic coefficient of .153, muzzle velocity 850 ft/sec, 80F degree, 80% humidity, and a 32.5 degree angle (more than enough to clear the hilltop), I get a maximum range of 1726.7 yards with a terminal velocity of 264 ft/sec. At 500 yards I get 457 ft/sec and 152 ft/lbs of energy remaining. That's about twice the speed of a paintball gun, though of course a .45 ACP round has a great deal more density.

I realize there are handgun calibers with higher muzzle velocities, but I picked .45 ACP because I know you're such a fan of it. I could have input the date incorrectly or done my trig incorrectly. The rise of the hillside could be greater than I got off Google Earth, which I suspect might be the case. But you'd still need a hill 286 ft higher than the range to block a 32.5 degree angle shot. Of course that also assumes no range master is present to prevent obnoxiously high angle shots like that. It also assumes my measurement of 450 feet from the range to the top of the hill (horizontal range, not slant range). I was guessing of Google Earth, so that of course could throw off my calculations.

[sc hokie]

I'm not saying I agree with the HOA President or that I think WOAI is an example of journalistic excellence, nor even that Bracken is responsible. Only that it's plausible bullets from the range could reach the neighborhood.