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Old 11-15-2010, 12:39 AM
 
6 posts, read 8,583 times
Reputation: 17

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRedneck View Post
MY first question is - what are the parents doing to be more proactive?!?? Why is it society's issue - the kids spend more time at home in the custody of their parents - why are THEY not more involved.

Look - this whole deal - "wolf packs", etc. - cries out that kids are NOT being engaged at home. If my kid came home with that kinda stuff, it'd be the last thing he/she did before being grounded for several months. You can't be a "friend" to your kids - you have to be a parent. That means you won't always be "cool", you won't always be a "bud" - but you WILL be the guiding force in their life, their rock of reference to "normalcy" and the person that keeps them on the straight and narrow.

All too often, kids are allowed to "express themselves", to "go outside the boundaries" as the parents live vicariously through them, thumbing their noses at societal norms. I see much of that on some of the posts here, as some members try to justify bad behaviour, outrageous comments and just plain anti-social actions. Anarchy for the sake of anarchy can only lead to a breakdown in society - and at some point, folks are going to have to wake up and realize it.
Who are you to dictate to someone else what "normal" is??? It is parents like you that lead most kids to running away or committing suicide because of narowminded, judgemental control freaks who act as if their children are property instead of human beings.
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Old 11-15-2010, 06:50 AM
Status: "Wants to adopt another .45!" (set 22 days ago)
 
Location: New Braunfels, TX
4,008 posts, read 4,522,171 times
Reputation: 3209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_Queen View Post
Who are you to dictate to someone else what "normal" is??? It is parents like you that lead most kids to running away or committing suicide because of narowminded, judgemental control freaks who act as if their children are property instead of human beings.
Conformance to societal norms shows respect for the rights and sensibilities of others, and fosters a sense of community IMO. Funny - having raised 4 kids, none of them ran away or attempted suicide, including one that was a disciplinary challenge for a number of years until I finally figured out how to "connect" with him in a meaningful way. No two kids are alike, and each required their own parenting. Challenging, but ultimately rewarding. A lot of work, lots of patience - and enough love to be willing to make the tough calls that I knew would result in challenges.

Sorry to have burst your preconcieved notion of being such a horrible parent...
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Old 11-15-2010, 06:54 AM
 
3,614 posts, read 3,524,903 times
Reputation: 1697
Hopefully more is down to combat bullying. Too many children suffer not just at school but also at home by their own parents at times.

NISD responds to federal warning about bullying at schools | kens5.com | San Antonio News, Weather, Sports, Traffic, Entertainment, Video and Photos

I also do not think that running away or suicide are the only markers for bad parenting. A good marker though is check on them after they have grown up and see how well the whole family gets along at Thanksgiving, Christmas, and when it comes to will time. If they don't visit for holidays, or do and just fight, then something was not done right. If they moved far away it was most likely for several reasons.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:17 AM
Status: "Wants to adopt another .45!" (set 22 days ago)
 
Location: New Braunfels, TX
4,008 posts, read 4,522,171 times
Reputation: 3209
True, Merovee....but unfortunately, by then it's too late for that generation. I think there are "markers" earlier in life, but their likely more subtle - such as the response given a parental direction by a teen. All of 'em rebel to an extent - it's to be expected, because they all think they're smarter than the parents. But one will grumble and obey, while the other will ignore. The one that ignores, IMO, is the one headed down the path to loss.
There's no way to fully convey the parental skills/techniques one uses via the net - or even in a well-meaning book. A lot of that is because just as with the kids, the mental mindset of the parent must be taken into account as well. I'm a big guy - pretty strong, etc.. While seeing someone of my wife's size use a paddle or even a belt on a child doesn't bother me (obviously, if used with restraint) - someone my size using one can easily create serious injury. I never used anything *but* my open hand on their rears, and was able to keep control. The earlier-mentioned son was a challenge, requiring an extended "woodshed" moment in his early teens in which I really wondered if I'd ever "get through" to him - but I finally did, and from that moment on there was a transformation in him, as if I'd finally found his "switch". The other 3 - one took a bit, another took a look - and another couldn't do enough to please me. Guess what?
The easiest one worried me the most, because I always wondered if she was pulling the wool over my eyes (after all, yeah - she was my baby girl even though she was the oldest). Over the years, I found out that she simply "knew" that if she got out of line, I'd catch her - so she just tended to do what was expected. To be sure, she'd stray from time to time, but she'd get back in line pretty readily.
All in all, while I was a tough disciplinarian, it was tempered with a deep love - a love that was strong enough to make me do the tough things needed to keep them in line with my expectations. Each and every one of them knew that if they needed to they could come to me with ANY issue/problem, and I'd help them sort it out and find a solution. They knew that if they brought it TO me, then there were no repercussions, even if they had done something wrong. I taught them that honesty was its' own reward, and that even "lost honor" could be regained if done properly.
Today? A homemaker, a retail operations manager, a cop and a professional driver. Those with children already are mirroring what they learned from me, with their own "tweaks" to adapt to their personalities (and those of their kids). That gave me a pretty good indication that what I did w/them worked for them and I.
I'll be the first to tell you that each of us has to adapt/adopt based on ourselves and the needs of our kids. It's not easy, nor is it always fun in the early years - but while I may seem mean and overly strict to many, my kids all knew that I did what I did out of love for them - and to me, that's all that matters.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:28 AM
 
3,614 posts, read 3,524,903 times
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For me, while discipline is an important issue, I just feel that bonding, paying attention, spending time, and getting to know your kid at an early age is the most important thing of all. Too many kids just feel ignored, latch-key kids in many cases, and while all kids will need to break away from their parents to discover who they are as teens, the ones who had good parents will come back to resume that relationship.

No amount of discipline works without this bonding period in early childhood. Not entirely every parents fault either. It is difficult for many parents because both have to work full time or a single parent has to work period and not many places will offer convenient hours and more will simply change schedules for time to time. It also seems that too many parents emphasize discipline but do not actually spend much time with their children when they were younger. Many parents do get it right though. There is hope.

It is also silly to think a child is acting bad or needs discipline just because he wants to pursue alternative fashions. That has nothing to do with good or bad parenting. If one had a child who never was interested in such, or who themselves were never interested in this type of self expression, they clearly then cannot compare their parenting to that of another or assume a parent is bad if their teen is into alternative fashions.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:42 AM
Status: "Wants to adopt another .45!" (set 22 days ago)
 
Location: New Braunfels, TX
4,008 posts, read 4,522,171 times
Reputation: 3209
Agreed - to a point!<G> Lots of weekends I'd have rather been doing other things at first, but ultimately found that I looked forward to the time w/my kids more than anything else.
Alternative fashions were always welcome at our place. Like I told the boys - they could have all the earrings they wanted, as long as they understood that I'd be taking them off as they walked in the doorway....possibly with chunks of their ear. Seriously - I'd allow a certain degree of "flex" in their dress - but nothing severe, because often it crosses the line into an *appearance* of another lifestyle (thug, gang, etc.) - and you ARE judged by how you dress - whether that be by a cop or a potential employer, or a parent, teacher, etc. If you want to wear a ballcap backwards around me, you'd *best* be hunkered down over a rifle scope or otherwise engaged in an activity that would make such appropriate. Period.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:48 AM
 
5,076 posts, read 4,379,800 times
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I think sometimes the issue is that parents are trying to be friends with their children instead of actually parenting. Some parents will even go as far as party with their children and won't discipline them. That's pretty much what happened to Lindsay Lohan.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:49 AM
 
3,614 posts, read 3,524,903 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRedneck View Post
Lots of weekends I'd have rather been doing other things at first, but ultimately found that I looked forward to the time w/my kids more than anything else.
Well we might disagree on alternative fashions if you think a backward ball cap is extreme lol but you got me sold on the above quote. That sounds like pure win. It is also the greatest contributing factor to the success of your children and family I believe, make them come first, spend time, get to know them.

Teaching your children the proper and safe use of firearms also scores mega points in my book.
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Old 11-15-2010, 07:54 AM
 
5,076 posts, read 4,379,800 times
Reputation: 3067
I also don't think wearing a baseball cap backwards is extreme or gangster, lol. I think that fashion has been around for decades and it mostly came from kids imitating baseball players. Tennis players also wear their caps backwards.
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Old 11-15-2010, 09:32 AM
Status: "aaaand I'm gone again :)" (set 28 days ago)
 
Location: San Antonio-Westover Hills
6,868 posts, read 12,968,539 times
Reputation: 4953
Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_Queen View Post
Who are you to dictate to someone else what "normal" is??? It is parents like you that lead most kids to running away or committing suicide because of narowminded, judgemental control freaks who act as if their children are property instead of human beings.
Wow. Talk about "narrow-minded" and "judgemental".


Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRedneck View Post
Conformance to societal norms shows respect for the rights and sensibilities of others, and fosters a sense of community IMO. Funny - having raised 4 kids, none of them ran away or attempted suicide, including one that was a disciplinary challenge for a number of years until I finally figured out how to "connect" with him in a meaningful way. No two kids are alike, and each required their own parenting. Challenging, but ultimately rewarding. A lot of work, lots of patience - and enough love to be willing to make the tough calls that I knew would result in challenges.

Sorry to have burst your preconcieved notion of being such a horrible parent...
Amen!

Quote:
Originally Posted by meisha210 View Post
I think sometimes the issue is that parents are trying to be friends with their children instead of actually parenting. Some parents will even go as far as party with their children and won't discipline them. That's pretty much what happened to Lindsay Lohan.

Man, no kidding! All one has to do to find out what is wrong with parents today is turn the channel to MTV and watch a few episodes of any/all of the following:

"My Sweet 16"
"16 and Pregnant"
"Teen Cribs"
"Jersey Shore"
"The Real Housewives of *insert city here*"


Really, I don't even know if you have to watch. Just the titles alone tell you all you need to know. People think it's just harmless entertainment. Others think it's fun to laugh and poke fun at others' stupidity/misfortunes. All anyone does when they watch these shows is VALIDATE them--and essentially, giving them value. It's pretty messed up.

These people that are raising teens today--this is what we're dealing with. It's frustrating because they are no longer a tiny minority, and so the folks that are trying desperately to raise their teens right and proper around these morons are constantly being underminded at every turn. The entitlement attitude is pervasive among so many teens that have learned it from their equally abhorrent, self-serving 80's "Me Me Me" generation parents. Awesome job. *thumbs up*

Last edited by Mom2Feebs; 11-15-2010 at 09:39 AM.. Reason: I keep adding stuff. LOL
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