School districts should eliminate sports programs to free up $$$ (San Antonio: vouchers, camp)

[catriona]

Originally Posted by sapphire

Just because you don't think it's important, does not mean that it's not. As someone mentioned earlier, sports have been around for decades and did not/do not cause these deficits. There is a lot of fat up above that should get cut first, but it's just like in the real world......the ones up top are safe, let's cut the front line people. Typical, knee-jerk reaction.

And you really need to get back to us when you have children enrolled in the public school system. It's easy to sit back and say "get rid of it!" until you have experienced first hand how important sports and music are in the development of young lives. Try going to an orchestra concert at your neighbrohood middle school, try attending a basketball game, or a volleyball game, and look at the hours of dedication, both on the students' part, and that of the coaches. Even when they lose, the learning and growth that takes place over a season or a school year is phenomenal to watch.

Amen, sister! Tried to rep you on your earlier post, but gotta spread the love around...

Another band parent chiming in. Sapphire's right about how hard parents work in order to raise funds for their student's activity, be it band, orchestra, choir, or athletics. These programs present opportunities for these students to grow mentally and physically as well as give them a sense of belonging and camaraderie. Want to help reduce the costs, then find out when the next spaghetti supper/silent auction/fund raiser is and attend! See what kind of work goes into a spaghetti supper! Those aren't hired caterers, those are parents working behind the scenes! Go to the next silent auction...see the items available? Parents went out and obtained those donations! Try going to the next play your local high school puts on, or orchestra/band concert. Check the school calendar!

Then there's UIL, NHS, Chess club, various foreign language clubs, student council, other clubs not mentioned that receive monies from the school district. All of these organizations are important to the growth and education of students. Would you cut them, too?

One more thing, lets not forget to mention UNIVERSITIES look at what extra curricular activities applicants participated in during their high school careers. Not just the volunteer activities at church or in the community, but school activities. Students are not judged on their grades alone, and cutting these programs either locally or just in the state alone, would seriously hinder our students from being competitive in the academic environment once they graduate high school.

[catriona]

Originally Posted by RGJ

Here's my thoughts on that subject. Get rid of mandatory testing. Get rid of the mandatory algebra, english classes that deal with anything other than basic english. Get rid of the no pass, no play rule.

Make available more classes involving plumbing, welding, electrical, heat/ac, construction. Some kids are just not going to be rocket scientists.

And I think eliminating the no pass, no play rule would encourage more kids to stay in school for the sports/band/ROTC, etc and maybe along the way, they'll get the needed skills.

What mandatory testing are you referring to? The TAKS test or something else? There has to be some way to evaluate how well a student is learning. What would be your proposal?

Under the 4x4 rule, students have to have 4 years of math. If you eliminate mandatory algebra, just what are they going to take? Algebra is the prerequisite for the other math classes. College bound kids need those higher level math classes to prepare them for what awaits them after graduating.

What do you consider 'basic English'? Do you have a high school student?

Eliminate no pass/no play? So a student can 'goof off' and still participate? Wouldn't you think that a student that is failing should spend their time studying and trying to raise their grade instead of participating in a school activity? Kids are motivated to stay in the band/athletics/ROTC/you name it because they want to be in those organizations, not because of no pass/no play rules.

[Dopo]

Originally Posted by catriona

Students are not judged on their grades alone, and cutting these programs either locally or just in the state alone, would seriously hinder our students from being competitive in the academic environment once they graduate high school.

What's more important?
Good grades (have enough teachers) or good extra-curricular activities (have enough sports)?

[RGJ]

Originally Posted by catriona

What mandatory testing are you referring to? The TAKS test or something else? There has to be some way to evaluate how well a student is learning. What would be your proposal?

Under the 4x4 rule, students have to have 4 years of math. If you eliminate mandatory algebra, just what are they going to take? Algebra is the prerequisite for the other math classes. College bound kids need those higher level math classes to prepare them for what awaits them after graduating.

What do you consider 'basic English'? Do you have a high school student?

Eliminate no pass/no play? So a student can 'goof off' and still participate? Wouldn't you think that a student that is failing should spend their time studying and trying to raise their grade instead of participating in a school activity? Kids are motivated to stay in the band/athletics/ROTC/you name it because they want to be in those organizations, not because of no pass/no play rules.

I was primarily making reference to those kids that will go on to a career after high school and may not go to college. I'm referring to any kind of exit exam as a requirement. Graduate those that want to go straight into the job force. And does everyone need algebra? or 4 years of math? Even those not going to college? I agree college bound kids need the higher level of math. As far as English, I'm not sure knowing who the King of England was in the 18th century is important. Again, college bound kids may need, or want that information. Not those directly joining the workforce.

And yes, my older son(who played baseball) just graduated. My younger son is a junior and will be a two sport 5 letter athlete by the time he graduates. He's also an A-B student. Some kids are motivated by sports to simply stay in school. If they learn a trade along the way, then we are'll better off than if those kids just drop out. And I don't believe you should deny a kid the opportunity to receive an athletic scholarship because he doesn't understand or pass algebra or some other course he'll never use. That was my point on the no pass/no play rule.

[mamatotex97]

There are trade classes in high schools. I know at our elective night recently I saw classes such as Business/Finance/Money Management, auto mechanics, hotel and restaurant management, gourmet/chef related classes, tools, engineering/computer classes, medical/health related classes, education/teaching etc.

Cut that budget and will the schools be able to keep them?

[L210]

Originally Posted by RGJ

I was primarily making reference to those kids that will go on to a career after high school and may not go to college. I'm referring to any kind of exit exam as a requirement. Graduate those that want to go straight into the job force. And does everyone need algebra? or 4 years of math? Even those not going to college? I agree college bound kids need the higher level of math. As far as English, I'm not sure knowing who the King of England was in the 18th century is important. Again, college bound kids may need, or want that information. Not those directly joining the workforce.

And yes, my older son(who played baseball) just graduated. My younger son is a junior and will be a two sport 5 letter athlete by the time he graduates. He's also an A-B student. Some kids are motivated by sports to simply stay in school. If they learn a trade along the way, then we are'll better off than if those kids just drop out. And I don't believe you should deny a kid the opportunity to receive an athletic scholarship because he doesn't understand or pass algebra or some other course he'll never use. That was my point on the no pass/no play rule.

You do not learn about the King of England in English class; you work on comprehension and analytical skills in high school English classes. Besides that, I do agree with you. High schools should concentrate more on graduating students who are trained in a trade. ACCD is looking at steering those who need a lot of remedial courses to vocational training.

[catriona]

Originally Posted by Dopo

What's more important?
Good grades (have enough teachers) or good extra-curricular activities (have enough sports)?

You took my comments out of context. It wasn't a situation of good grades vs good extra-curricular activities. I was referring to the fact that college bound students need to have a mix of both to be considered by the admissions boards. What I said was:

One more thing, lets not forget to mention UNIVERSITIES look at what extra curricular activities applicants participated in during their high school careers. Not just the volunteer activities at church or in the community, but school activities. Students are not judged on their grades alone, and cutting these programs either locally or just in the state alone, would seriously hinder our students from being competitive in the academic environment once they graduate high school.

[Dopo]

Originally Posted by catriona

You took my comments out of context. It wasn't a situation of good grades vs good extra-curricular activities. I was referring to the fact that college bound students need to have a mix of both to be considered by the admissions boards. What I said was:

I completely understand and support kids having a perfectly rounded education (math, english, sports, trade classes, etc).
But as somebody mentioned earlier "we are in a crisis" and my point is that every school should make a list of priorities and start cutting from the bottom up.

But it seems as if some people love to "cut wasteful spending" until it comes to cutting something that they like (their sacred cow)

[Azure110]

Originally Posted by Dopo

But it seems as if some people love to "cut wasteful spending" until it comes to cutting something that they like (their sacred cow)

Well said. I totally agree with you there.

[SAFD_Wife]

Originally Posted by Hedgehog_Mom

So you're working at the school and sitting there judging people for using the pre-k program? I really hope you're not the teacher.

Oh my goodness, don't try so hard to come up with something off the topic. You apparently support K4, I don't in every instance. And you would be lucky if I were you child's teacher. I loved my students, it's not their fault some of their parents are low lifes.