USNEWS 2012 College rankings......... UTSA moves up!!! (Houston, Dallas: school, colleges, dangerous)

[Backliteyes]

Originally Posted by Saytown

Yeah, that does look ugly............but some degrees are 5yrs. As was mine.

That is a bit misleading. They should exclude programs that are supposed to take longer than 4 years from that statistic (maybe they do, I don't know).

Other than that if you're in a full-time program, you aren't working on the side, you're not a double-major, or some other legitimate excuse, if you take longer than 4 years to graduate you're just being lazy. Or indecisive and switching majors multiple times.

It just seems awfully high that 93% of students transfer, drop out, or take longer than four years. That number dropping to something like 70% would help UTSA gain credibility as an educational institution of worth.

[Danbo1957]

UTSA'S graduation rates are not representative of its educational mission-- and that 7% four-year graduation rate includes the dropout rate. My brother gratuated with a B.A. in Business Administration in five years because he worked all five years taking 12 hours per semester. Five-year graduation rate at UTSA is around 35% and six year graduation rate is 26%.

[Backliteyes]

Originally Posted by Danbo1957

UTSA'S graduation rates are not representative of its educational mission-- and that 7% four-year graduation rate includes the dropout rate. My brother gratuated with a B.A. in Business Administration in five years because he worked all five years taking 12 hours per semester. Five-year graduation rate at UTSA is around 35% and six year graduation rate is 26%.

It should be part of their educational mission in my opinion. It makes sense if you're working while going to school (or have some other valid reason) that you'll take longer than four years. And of course the 7% statistic includes the drop out rate. Why wouldn't/shouldn't it?

My point is that it speaks to the quality of an institution when more of it's students don't transfer, don't drop out, and are dedicated enough (assuming they're not working or have some other valid reason) to graduate in the normal amount of time for their degree program (usually 4 years).

[Danbo1957]

Well, UTSA, University of Houston, and UT-Arlington attract a very different student demografic than that of Rice, Texas A&M and SMU. An average of eighty-five percent of students at the first three schools I mentioned live off campus and 55% of the student body works sometime during matriculation. Rice's four-year graduation rate of 79% is to be lauded, but graduation rate comparisons of UTSA to that of Rice or Texas A&M, in any manner, are going to be misleading.

And, in my opinion, we are going to see more students going to the UTSA's of the world which offer more attendance flexability.

[Backliteyes]

Originally Posted by Danbo1957

Well, UTSA, University of Houston, and UT-Arlington attract a very different student demografic than that of Rice, Texas A&M and SMU. An average of eighty-five percent of students at the first three schools I mentioned live off campus and 55% of the student body works sometime during matriculation. Rice's four-year graduation rate of 79% is to be lauded, but graduation rate comparisons of UTSA to that of Rice or Texas A&M, in any manner, are going to be misleading.

Of course. It is comparing apples and oranges. They're different students and different schools. And the things you mentioned are part of the reason those other schools are better. It's much harder to do well in a full-time program in college when you're working part or full-time on the side. Aside from the fact that UTSA is obviously not nearly as selective as other, better schools in the first place. These are all things that, over the long-term, UTSA will need to address if it wants to become a better quality school and rise in the rankings.

[Danbo1957]

UT-Austin's four-year graduation rate is 51%, Powers wants 70%. How would this really be accomplished?

Powers stresses importances of high four-year graduation rates | The Daily Texan (http://www.dailytexanonline.com/news/2011/09/15/powers-stresses-importances-high-four-year-graduation-rates - broken link)

[HillCountryHotRodMan]

Originally Posted by Backliteyes

Four year graduation rate is only 7%. Holy smokes.

Actually, any student who "takes a break" for even 1 semester while pursuing their undergraduate degree is hitting that rate, so it is truly not representative of anything...

[Backliteyes]

Originally Posted by HillCountryHotRodMan

Actually, any student who "takes a break" for even 1 semester while pursuing their undergraduate degree is hitting that rate, so it is truly not representative of anything...

Why do 97% of students need to take a break (or transfer, drop out, etc)? Most 4-year degree programs are really not that hard.

All I'm saying is, better schools have higher four-year graduation rates. I'm sure it's a case of correlation and not causation. But higher four-year graduation rates indicate high-achieving students that put their education first. A school is not highly ranked that doesn't have a culture like that.

[Saytown]

Originally Posted by Backliteyes

Why do 97% of students need to take a break (or transfer, drop out, etc)? Most 4-year degree programs are really not that hard.

All I'm saying is, better schools have higher four-year graduation rates. I'm sure it's a case of correlation and not causation. But higher four-year graduation rates indicate high-achieving students that put their education first. A school is not highly ranked that doesn't have a culture like that.

No offense, but that is not neccessarily true. Sometimes there are circumstances. I was an average HS student. My parents made too much money, so I could not get a scholarship or financial aid. I paid my way thru school as I went.........took me longer, but I owed "0" when I graduated. There is more than one way to skin a cat, and sometimes it doesnt show up on USNews.

[Backliteyes]

Originally Posted by Saytown

No offense, but that is not neccessarily true. Sometimes there are circumstances. I was an average HS student. My parents made too much money, so I could not get a scholarship or financial aid. I paid my way thru school as I went.........took me longer, but I owed "0" when I graduated. There is more than one way to skin a cat, and sometimes it doesnt show up on USNews.

I hate to say it, but the following is true. The better college institutions are not built on a student body of largely average high school students. It's pretty dang rough to get into UT-Austin, for example, as an average high school student.

In the context of UTSA moving up the rankings, and eventually becoming a well-respected academic institution, everything I've said so far is totally true. I never said anything about just graduating, of course you can graduate in 5, 6, 7, 10, 25 years and have your "cat skinned", that isn't what I was discussing.