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Old 09-16-2007, 07:12 PM
 
37 posts, read 74,872 times
Reputation: 20
Exclamation the great 281 debate

How is everyone doing? I thought that it would interseting to see what fellow san antonion's think about the article in the metro section of today's paper. Feed back from new residents and even tourists are appreciated as these opinions/info could help these who are relocating to our great city. A recent poll on this form shows in favor of tolls on 281. As a 30-year resident it's amazing how much I have seen us grow.
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Old 09-17-2007, 12:14 AM
 
Location: San Antonio North
4,148 posts, read 4,994,073 times
Reputation: 996
I don't drive on 281 all that much but i do on 1604. I will be paying when they open. Traffic is horrible on both roads. I just wish people would stop stalling the construction. I mean if you don't want to pay drive somewhere else. They are keeping free lanes on the roads anyway.
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Old 09-17-2007, 08:09 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
1,859 posts, read 3,096,575 times
Reputation: 1407
The problem with 281 is, and always has been, irresponsible development. It has been allowed to go on for decades. Developers come along and build a subdivision on 281 and then a new stop light appears. Soon another development and a new stop light. Now we have, guess what, gridlock. These developers should have been required to build an intersection complete with an overpass and entrance and exits in addition to traffic signals. They could have just passed the cost on to they're customers. Personely I can't think of a worse place to build a subdivision than on top of the aquifer. Even the village idiot know not to pee in the well.
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Old 09-17-2007, 08:54 AM
 
Location: 281 north of 1604 - otherwise known as traffic hell
450 posts, read 1,065,060 times
Reputation: 172
Snappybob, I couldn't agree with you more - but will respectfully disagree with your position. I will make that make sense.

You are right - the developers should have been required to help fund those things. However, they weren't. And now there needs to be something done. That is the part that us pro tollers hate. The anti tollers say something along the lines of "it could have been X, should have been Y, if we would have done X in 19XX then we wouldn't be where we are." Well duh.

But how does that change our current situation? You can't just keep saying if only they had done this back then we wouldn't be where we are today - and since they didn't I shouldn't have to pay a toll to drive on it. That is a crappy argument that doesn't fix the problems as they exist right now.

I would prefer non tolled expansion of the roads - however I don't believe there is any way to finance the expansions without tolls. So at this point I guess I would call myself a realist. I know that something needs fixing and that the best way to get it done the fastest is toll roads. So, I am in favor of them.

It isn't like I can afford to drive on them on a daily basis - but many people out here can. When they hop on the road it should eliminate a large amount of the cars on the free lanes. Meaning my commute will be faster without having to be on the tolls. And for morning where time is of the essence - I can just hop on the toll road and go.

Right now - there isn't any option. That bugs me to no end.

my .02
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Old 09-17-2007, 09:21 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
1,859 posts, read 3,096,575 times
Reputation: 1407
>>But how does that change our current situation? You can't just keep saying if only they had done this back then we wouldn't be where we are today - and since they didn't I shouldn't have to pay a toll to drive on it. That is a crappy argument that doesn't fix the problems as they exist right now.<<

Where will we be tomorrow if we don't deal with our problems in a realistic manner today. Why not just charge all the home owners in subdivisions and business owners along 281 a one time tax to cover the road improvements that are needed as a result of them being there in such numbers. I admit it would be a hefty sum, but it would be money that should have been rolled into the cost of living an doing business in that area in the first place. Perhaps if we make everyone pay for the REAL cost of irresponsible developement up front there might be less of it. These big developers know what they are doing. They come in buy a bunch of land, tear it up, screw up th e enviroment, make their money and go home. They don't live here and don't have worry about paying for the consquences.
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Old 09-17-2007, 09:31 AM
 
781 posts, read 2,680,581 times
Reputation: 245
<<<<Why not just charge all the home owners in subdivisions and business owners along 281 a one time tax to cover the road improvements that are needed as a result of them being there in such numbers>>>>

Snappy.....that statement must be sarcastic....How unrealistic to charge homeowners to build a specific road just because they happen to live near it????

I am for toll roads. I don't have a commute as I am a stay at home mom but if it will eleviate the stress and pressure for commuters I am all for it.
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Old 09-17-2007, 09:50 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
1,859 posts, read 3,096,575 times
Reputation: 1407
Why do we need toll roads on 281? Because there is traffic congestion on 281. Why is there on traffic congestion 281? Because of all of the subdivisions. IH 35 goes to Austin/Dallas in one direction and Mexico in the other. IH 10 goes to Houston in one direction and the West Coast in the other. IH 37 goes to Corpus Christi to the South and turns into 281 to the north. Where all of those people going on 281. To Spring Banch? To Blanco? After Spring Branch it turns into a two lane, undivided highway. No I'm not being sarcastic I'm serious. Let the people who are causing the problem pay to fix the problem.
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Old 09-17-2007, 10:14 AM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
545 posts, read 1,563,675 times
Reputation: 201
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnappyBob View Post
Why not just charge all the home owners in subdivisions and business owners along 281 a one time tax to cover the road improvements that are needed as a result of them being there in such numbers
While that sounds like a great theory, it'll never happen, so TxDOT is doing the next best thing and charging those who don't want to sit in traffic to drive on the new toll lanes. It works the same way...a 'tax,' if you will, to relieve congestion. The only way it won't work is if no one takes the toll roads, but I've gotta believe that if someone can 1) afford to live in Stone Oak 2) drive the vehicles I see people driving around there and 3) afford the price of gas sitting and burning it in traffic now, that people will drive on the toll roads.

The problem here is that the very vocal minority is getting all of the media attention. There is not a vocal majority calling up the new stations and telling them that, yes, we're willing to pay if they'll just build the stupid roads, already.

But I do agree with the first argument that developers should be required to plan for and build the roads to handle the traffic around new subdivisions. Thankfully, someone thought ahead (a little bit) because it looks like Culebra outside 1604 is going to get a little wider.
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Old 09-17-2007, 10:35 AM
 
Location: 281 north of 1604 - otherwise known as traffic hell
450 posts, read 1,065,060 times
Reputation: 172
Here is the thing - when I bought my home out here I was sold a bill of goods by TXDoT and the developers. This bill said that there would be a toll road out here. So, sure I made my bed and what not - but I was told something by TXDoT when I bought out here that is not true.

Now you want me - the little guy - to cough up a one time lump sum to pay for a road that I was promised. I think you must be sick in the head man.

Should the developers have done this - as I already said - YES. But you sure as hell can't go back and make the home owners pay for it now. It is more of a pipe dream than
a gas tax increase.

I think you are being more sarcastic than you let on because there is no way that was a rational well thought out plan.
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Old 09-17-2007, 10:39 AM
 
Location: 281 north of 1604 - otherwise known as traffic hell
450 posts, read 1,065,060 times
Reputation: 172
Do you think TXDoT is charging the dominion for the improvements being made to I-10?

There is a dramatic difference between I-10 and 281. One has red lights on it the other doesn't. Remove the red lights and you will have people getting killed on 281. So the only logical way to fix it is overpasses and on ramps. The thing is - there is no money for this. So, since the taxing each individual homeowner who bought out here how do you propose we go about fixing this?
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