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Old 02-13-2014, 06:17 AM
 
2,721 posts, read 3,408,798 times
Reputation: 1536

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Political Hoopla. Making hay off racism. Listen to WOAI or KTSA if you prescribe to this sort of
propaganda.
AN open border is not a good idea, no one is backing this idea, but these mouthings by persons is for the sake of gaining political notoriety by appealing to our baser instincts. Take a ride south of town and see who is keeping the fences mended on farms and ranches.
A lot of noise but no laws for employer sanctions?
This is all that is needed, some negative reinforcement of hiring undocumented workers- so severe that it would shutter the doors of the employer.
Will this happen. Hell no, profit margins would suffer. Farmers and ranchers would be forced- I have heard estimates that the cost of a basket of strawberries would be $4.00 per basket if it were not for immigrants,
to raise the prices on produce astronomically.

I was on a flight and a Japanese businessman was seated next to me. Reading a publication on economics I made some comments to him about the declining Japanese economy because of its' aging population. Yes he said the same thing is happening here, in heavily accented english.
The difference is the immigration. Japan does not have enough to immigration to make up for its'aging population.
These political noisemakers are raising anti-immigration sentiment for vote getting purposes only.
Put legislation on the floor in to impose employer sanctions if you are serious about this issue.
Has this claim been made? Hell no. It is a political noisemaker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CyVaquero View Post
Kind of true - they will never do the right thing unless their FINANCIAL backers demand it. Keep in mind that the agricultural industry has a huge stake in maintaining low labor costs.
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Old 02-13-2014, 07:21 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
3,740 posts, read 3,840,748 times
Reputation: 3190
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy View Post
But in reality, there's no difference.

Most people who are against illegal immigration are also against bilingual education, for "English Only" laws, etc. In other words, they are against measures that help legal immigrants, too. And they're very selective in who they oppose. They don't care that Russians speak Russian, or that Poles speak Polish, or that Greeks speak Greek. But let them hear people speaking Spanish, and all hell breaks loose!

In my experience, 99% of people who say they are anti-illegal immigrant are just really anti-Mexican, period. They just don't want to admit it.
your whole post is not true what so ever...

If some one was anti-Mexican they wouldn't live in South Texas and if they do the will be miserable. You will find in South Texas the populations get along with no major issues to speak of. We also have plenty of Mexican Americans that don't support illegal immigration of any kind whether it be a Mexican or a Russian...
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Old 02-13-2014, 07:56 AM
 
2,600 posts, read 6,037,417 times
Reputation: 2428
You said it "they swore an oath to uphold the laws of the land" and just like many of them they use any loophole that they can find !!!.
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Old 02-13-2014, 09:09 AM
Status: "just keep scrolling then?" (set 12 days ago)
 
14,613 posts, read 31,138,127 times
Reputation: 6656
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy View Post
But in reality, there's no difference.

Most people who are against illegal immigration are also against bilingual education, for "English Only" laws, etc. In other words, they are against measures that help legal immigrants, too. And they're very selective in who they oppose. They don't care that Russians speak Russian, or that Poles speak Polish, or that Greeks speak Greek. But let them hear people speaking Spanish, and all hell breaks loose!

In my experience, 99% of people who say they are anti-illegal immigrant are just really anti-Mexican, period. They just don't want to admit it.
This sounds like something straight off an MSNBC tweet.
Well, maybe 2 tweets, I didn't count characters.
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Old 02-13-2014, 09:51 AM
 
Location: Grey Gardens
336 posts, read 413,816 times
Reputation: 322
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy View Post
In my experience, 99% of people who say they are anti-illegal immigrant are just really anti-Mexican, period. They just don't want to admit it.
I agree somewhat, but do certainly disagree in that my own family were immigrants, came to this country legally, worked hard to acclimate and became very proud, very successful US citizens. In doing so, they learned how to speak Americanized english (they spoke Gaelic) and attempted to fit in as best they could. They didn't make demands while having no leg to stand on. They knew they were at the bottom of the totem pole, but also knew they could work their way up.

I don't see that so much here in Texas with illegal Mexicans. I see folks wanting a fast track to money, not citizenship. They want a handout, not a hand up. Granted, Not all Mexican immigrants embody this, but I certainly have seen many who do.

American citizenship is an amazing thing and it should take hard work to achieve. There's a reason people want to come here. If my own family can achieve the American dream through the proper channels, then so can others. I have little compassion for illegal immigrants who are caught and deported.
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Old 02-13-2014, 10:33 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
4,149 posts, read 9,303,154 times
Reputation: 3308
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogersParkGuy View Post
But in reality, there's no difference.

Most people who are against illegal immigration are also against bilingual education, for "English Only" laws, etc. In other words, they are against measures that help legal immigrants, too. And they're very selective in who they oppose. They don't care that Russians speak Russian, or that Poles speak Polish, or that Greeks speak Greek. But let them hear people speaking Spanish, and all hell breaks loose!

In my experience, 99% of people who say they are anti-illegal immigrant are just really anti-Mexican, period. They just don't want to admit it.
Your "experience"? I'd love to hear what this "experience" is.

No...this is a spin that those for immigration put on it. They always try to make those against illegal immigration into some sort of evil demon that hates brown people. It's a typical tactic used by folks that can't use logic and facts to debate.

Say there's a town that had a great, solid and beautiful bridge built. Can hold 10,000 cars at a time. They decide that they want to let more people experience their beautiful town, so they put up a few pillars and add another layer, enabling tons more people to come at the same time. However, against the engineer's advice, they do nothing to the original structure to prepare for that extra weight.

As pretty as they make it look, it's going to end in tragedy. There's no way it can't. You cannot keep piling things on top and assume it'll hold. Our infrastructure in this city and country is the same.

Yes, we are a nation of immigrants. And yes, the system is broken. But they need to fix the system. Everyone that comes over here should have responsibility. They should pay the taxes. They shouldn't be given anything on OUR backs. Mexican, Cuban, Polish, New Zealander, etc.

Doesn't matter. There is a right way and a wrong way to do things. This is the wrong way. It's all about pulling on heart strings and talking about the "poor children" that will be sent back to their country. Heck, these other countries don't allow immigration like we tolerate. Why are WE the bad guys?

Use logic and I think you'll find that your argument makes no sense. Don't just cry racism and expect folks to cower and give in.
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Old 02-13-2014, 01:08 PM
 
3,669 posts, read 5,897,807 times
Reputation: 1788
Quote:
Originally Posted by rynetwo View Post
your whole post is not true what so ever...

If some one was anti-Mexican they wouldn't live in South Texas and if they do the will be miserable. You will find in South Texas the populations get along with no major issues to speak of. We also have plenty of Mexican Americans that don't support illegal immigration of any kind whether it be a Mexican or a Russian...
One cannot really speak for other groups they are not in. How Tejanos and Chicanos feel is not going to be freely shared with those not in our ingroup. We have a history with other groups, we don't forget the past or our relations with those groups, we are also aware of the changes.

When others speak of immigration to the US in general terms, that is not the same at all as when they begin speaking about South Texas and ethnic relations here. We can be cordial and polite to all groups. When it comes to Mexican immigration we don't see our cousins from the other side as complete foreigners as others might, especially if they are Nortenos or from La Frontera. Truth is we might feel many of the Americans coming from California are more foreign to this land.

There will be some Mexican Americans who feel different, many of them served in the military, but the rest of us like our Mexican cousins, we still have family back there in some cases, or have married back into families that have connections to Mexico.

So yes, we get along, work with other groups, that doesn't mean we really like them, should hear us talk when we are alone.
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Old 02-13-2014, 01:11 PM
 
Location: the 50s and the 60s
834 posts, read 1,791,758 times
Reputation: 1542
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merovee View Post
.

snip

should hear us talk when we are alone.
.
.
.
give us a few examples.........
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.
.
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Old 02-13-2014, 01:32 PM
 
5,621 posts, read 6,404,848 times
Reputation: 3593
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merovee View Post
One cannot really speak for other groups they are not in. How Tejanos and Chicanos feel is not going to be freely shared with those not in our ingroup. We have a history with other groups, we don't forget the past or our relations with those groups, we are also aware of the changes.

When others speak of immigration to the US in general terms, that is not the same at all as when they begin speaking about South Texas and ethnic relations here. We can be cordial and polite to all groups. When it comes to Mexican immigration we don't see our cousins from the other side as complete foreigners as others might, especially if they are Nortenos or from La Frontera. Truth is we might feel many of the Americans coming from California are more foreign to this land.

There will be some Mexican Americans who feel different, many of them served in the military, but the rest of us like our Mexican cousins, we still have family back there in some cases, or have married back into families that have connections to Mexico.

So yes, we get along, work with other groups, that doesn't mean we really like them, should hear us talk when we are alone.
Before I understand your post completely...I need to ask....Who exactly is "We" as you state many times in your statement above?

I am lost because you started off with "One can not really speak for other groups they are not in".
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Old 02-13-2014, 01:35 PM
 
3,669 posts, read 5,897,807 times
Reputation: 1788
After reflecting briefly can now see how the above might seem to others so just to clarify nothing hateful is said toward any group. It is more along the lines of reminding each other that we are simply not in the same group, mostly in somber tones after one or another has felt slighted in some form. Not being a victim per se but accepting the cultural boundaries which still exist today although in much weaker forms.

Will South Texans ever truly feel like one group without noticing differences? Because off the bat many South Texans have no major issues with Mexican immigrants. That puts a dent on others claiming this whole city feels one way or another, that there is such a thing as a right or wrong way to approach this issue, there is not. Compromise is required.

My original point was that one should not speak for other groups. There is simply no way to compromise when you speak for the other groups.
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