Moving into the Quarry at Iron Mountain (Liberty: pricing, garages)

[mrstxcop]

Originally Posted by joe123456

Stage Run and Springtree. Both of these subdivisions I believe are in the last phase of development.

i wonder how many lots stage run still has --- just out of total curiosity --- i drive thru the main streets of stage run everyday to pick up my daughter and they have moved out of the model home area into a little white trailer this appears to be on a vacant corner lot --- but i don't see any other empty lots around --- could be a hard sell for them considering all their negative publicity...

[Eleanor Rigby]

After reading that website, I can see why people would be upset. I, as I think I have made clear before on this board, LOL, am NOT a fan of production builders or new construction in general, but the difference between the earlier product and the current product is striking. While it's not my thing, stylistically, the earlier lines show that someone, somewhere along the line in the design and development process put some thought and care into those homes. They look like they were designed and built, and not extruded or stamped out. The new line, on the other hand, is just abhorrent. The one-story home they show on the website looks like some sort of mutant toadstool, with the weird hunched roof and the single sad window in the front. It's obvious why people would be sincerely and legitimately upset to have something like that spring up next to them, when their homes show at least some design flair and interesting detail-work. And to be honest, I've seen production homes in the price range of the newer line that HAVEN'T been complete abominations, so it's obviously doable, but it doesn't really have a place in a community that was pitched as being of a certain quality and value.

So, all in all, I can see why people are fed up enough to build elaborate websites. However, I think banker's approach probably will see more results, since what really needs to be done is to browbeat KB into creating a homogenous neighborhood, price level-wise, and that seems to be happening.

[banker]

Originally Posted by Eleanor Rigby

After reading that website, I can see why people would be upset. I, as I think I have made clear before on this board, LOL, am NOT a fan of production builders or new construction in general, but the difference between the earlier product and the current product is striking. While it's not my thing, stylistically, the earlier lines show that someone, somewhere along the line in the design and development process put some thought and care into those homes. They look like they were designed and built, and not extruded or stamped out. The new line, on the other hand, is just abhorrent. The one-story home they show on the website looks like some sort of mutant toadstool, with the weird hunched roof and the single sad window in the front. It's obvious why people would be sincerely and legitimately upset to have something like that spring up next to them, when their homes show at least some design flair and interesting detail-work. And to be honest, I've seen production homes in the price range of the newer line that HAVEN'T been complete abominations, so it's obviously doable, but it doesn't really have a place in a community that was pitched as being of a certain quality and value.

So, all in all, I can see why people are fed up enough to build elaborate websites. However, I think banker's approach probably will see more results, since what really needs to be done is to browbeat KB into creating a homogenous neighborhood, price level-wise, and that seems to be happening.

Yes that is happening. I can't wait for the new plans to be revealed. They really are nice and unique. Something that was the foundation of the Quarry when it was originally envisioned three years ago.

As to the current "extruded and stamped out" line. Your description is spot on and gave me a laugh. It doesn't fit with the Estate and Liberty line homes - but isn't as bad as they portray when seen in person. Like I said, they took the least desireable aspects and concentrated on those in their presentation. They aren't as bad as presented...they just would fit in better in one of KB's lower line communities.

[mrstxcop]

so banker, are you saying that because of you KB actually designed new floor plans??? --- or are these plans that they already had in existence???

ok, i just re-read your earlier post that these are plans from austin --- disregard the question...

[banker]

Originally Posted by mrstxcop

so banker, are you saying that because of you KB actually designed new floor plans??? --- or are these plans that they already had in existence???

No. Let me set the record straight, they did not design them because of me. I began lobbying about three months ago that KB bring some complimentary designs from existing communities in Austin. My requests fell on deaf ears until the beginning of December when the San Antonio President was fired. San Antonio has now been integrated into the Central region falling under the management of the Austin President. When I heard this (being that Austin was the region I wanted KB to bring unique up market plans from) I immediately directly contacted the president in Austin. We spoke and exchanged emails about my concerns and desire for change in the Quarry. He told me back on December 16th that he would take my requests/recommendation under consideration. Then, last week he emailed me again with the new floor plans for my community. He indicated that partially as a result of my campaign over the past three months they integrated some of the plans I suggested/requested into our community. He agreed that the new plans fit with the community better than the current Trails/Empire floor plans. He thanked me for the feed back and said that we will begin seeing changes soon.

Sadly - the same week he followed up with me from my request/conversation back in the beginning of December these KBLies.com folks launched their website.

Anyway - I took the approach that instead of demanding change - looking for something that was mutually beneficial to both KB and our community by leveraging existing premium plans still in production (since the Estate/Liberty plans were not in production anywhere in Texas) would eventually find an ear with management. It did.

But - the biggest factor was getting the Austin President to take over the San Antonio market. That change made my request feasable. I won't say it was all me - but I did suggest the changes that are taking place now three months ago. I am just thankful that KB San Antonio has been teamed up with a more successful city in terms of product and community development.

[achtungpv]

Originally Posted by banker

But - to your point about KB - they have much better reputations at the mid point market in other markets other than San Antonio. Austin is a prime example.

That's not accurate. KB has a **** poor reputation at all price points in Austin. Look at the Austin board and many Realtors on there have said that they will not list or show KB built homes to their clients because of the shoddy construction.

KB does have a decent reputation in other states but definitely not Austin.

[banker]

Originally Posted by achtungpv

That's not accurate. KB has a **** poor reputation at all price points in Austin. Look at the Austin board and many Realtors on there have said that they will not list or show KB built homes to their clients because of the shoddy construction.

KB does have a decent reputation in other states but definitely not Austin.

They have a better reputation in Austin than San Antonio...didn't say that it was perfect. San Antonio has suffered with the baggage of RAYCO ever since KB purchased RAYCO back in the mid/late 90's.

Austin has been more accepting of KB's higher end product than San Antonio by a long shot. So clearly there are more buyers of higher end homes built by KB in Austin than the couple failed attempts in San Antonio.

[nrlatsha]

Originally Posted by banker

They have a better reputation in Austin than San Antonio...didn't say that it was perfect. San Antonio has suffered with the backage of RAYCO ever since KB purchased RAYCO back in the mid/late 90's.

KB is hated less in Austin only because they have fewer people.

KB is definitely out of the RAYCO shadow and have developed this reputation all on their own blood, sweat and tears (of the homeowners).

[banker]

Originally Posted by nrlatsha

KB is hated less in Austin only because they have fewer people.

KB is definitely out of the RAYCO shadow and have developed this reputation all on their own blood, sweat and tears (of the homeowners).

I would argue that they are still not out of the RAYCO shadow. Many people still mention RAYCO today when I tell them I built a KB home. They are surprised to find out that KB is not affiliated with RAYCO. Combine that with the fact that KB San Antonio continued to build many RAYCO floor plans for nearly a decade after purchasing the company. Just now are they finally switching out all their RAYCO floor plans.

Again - As far as I know - everyone on my street is more than satisfied with their KB home. I have been in many of them and they are beautiful on the inside and out.

[datacity]

Originally Posted by banker

No. Let me set the record straight, they did not design them because of me. I began lobbying about three months ago that KB bring some complimentary designs from existing communities in Austin. My requests fell on deaf ears until the beginning of December when the San Antonio President was fired. San Antonio has now been integrated into the Central region falling under the management of the Austin President. When I heard this (being that Austin was the region I wanted KB to bring unique up market plans from) I immediately directly contacted the president in Austin. We spoke and exchanged emails about my concerns and desire for change in the Quarry. He told me back on December 16th that he would take my requests/recommendation under consideration. Then, last week he emailed me again with the new floor plans for my community. He indicated that partially as a result of my campaign over the past three months they integrated some of the plans I suggested/requested into our community. He agreed that the new plans fit with the community better than the current Trails/Empire floor plans. He thanked me for the feed back and said that we will begin seeing changes soon.

Sadly - the same week he followed up with me from my request/conversation back in the beginning of December these KBLies.com folks launched their website.

Anyway - I took the approach that instead of demanding change - looking for something that was mutually beneficial to both KB and our community by leveraging existing premium plans still in production (since the Estate/Liberty plans were not in production anywhere in Texas) would eventually find an ear with management. It did.

But - the biggest factor was getting the Austin President to take over the San Antonio market. That change made my request feasable. I won't say it was all me - but I did suggest the changes that are taking place now three months ago. I am just thankful that KB San Antonio has been teamed up with a more successful city in terms of product and community development.

Even with what people think of KB (and I think much of it is warranted), I think that your approach to lobby them was a great way to help them help existing home owners and themselves. Obviously KB didn't just bow to your ways. Still, the fact that the changes KB made at the beginning of 2008 at the Quarry made things worse for them (i.e. fewer sales) and combined with other problems around SA probably led to the SA president being relieved. This then provided you an opening for dialogue with the new president and to provide him a customer's POV of the situation.

In the end, if they even get back to something that looks close to the Liberty series (Empire may be asking too much), it should help. Good luck to you all.