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Old 01-18-2008, 04:31 PM
 
Location: Memphis, TN
188 posts, read 490,354 times
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Again, I appreciate the information. I went to George Mason University right outside DC for undergrad, so I know that even commuter schools can have great academic programs. I went to a top ranked private program for grad school, and I'm much prouder of my Mason degree than the one from whatever that other school was!
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Old 01-19-2008, 10:25 PM
 
81 posts, read 198,017 times
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Originally Posted by professorsenator View Post
As anyone in academia should know, the definitive university rankings are compiled by the Carnegie Foundation. See:
Carnegie Classifications (http://www.carnegiefoundation.org/classifications/ - broken link)

San Antonio does not have a Carnegie I school, which is the most prestigious tier (i.e. doctoral granting major research university). UT-Austin and Rice are the only top-tier schools in Texas (sorry Aggies!).

That said, one can get a good education at a variety of schools (Trinity and UTSA included). But in terms of the academic pecking order, neither Trinity nor UTSA are at the top.
You are confusing the thread. It is about San Antonio schools, not Austin or Houston. Carnegie does not rank schools by quality of education, they classify them; you can see this on their site.

In all categories, where Trinity and UT meet criteria thresholds, Trinity meets or surpasses UT. For example, both are more selective but Trinity has higher SAT/ACT/GPA of incoming freshmen. UT and Rice are reasearch universities, which places them in the highest category of school. It does not mean they are better universities. Once again carnegie doesn't rank quality of education. Most people in academia will say Trinity is a better school than UT. Rice is a different story.
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Old 01-20-2008, 04:13 PM
 
2,027 posts, read 6,361,833 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsenator View Post
As anyone in academia should know, the definitive university rankings are compiled by the Carnegie Foundation. See:
Carnegie Classifications (http://www.carnegiefoundation.org/classifications/ - broken link)

San Antonio does not have a Carnegie I school, which is the most prestigious tier (i.e. doctoral granting major research university). UT-Austin and Rice are the only top-tier schools in Texas (sorry Aggies!).

That said, one can get a good education at a variety of schools (Trinity and UTSA included). But in terms of the academic pecking order, neither Trinity nor UTSA are at the top.
UTSA is actively pursuing tier 1 status (as are Tech, UT-Arlington, and a few others across the state). This is defined largely by their research funding and amount of doctoral degrees offered/awarded. I think current projections by UTSA plans to meet the criteria by 2016. Meeting the criteria alone doesn't guarantee tier 1 status. Tech will most likely garner tier 1 status before UTSA.
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Old 01-23-2008, 07:58 PM
 
Location: Beautiful New England
2,412 posts, read 6,465,429 times
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Originally Posted by schertz1 View Post
Most people in academia will say Trinity is a better school than UT

I am in academia and would 100% disagree. Go to any major professional acadmeic conference and ask poeple there what they know about Trinity. First, these scholars would asusme you're talking about Trinity College, Oxford University (U.K.) which is - hands down - the most famous Trinity in academia. "No," you say, "I'm not talking about Oxford." Then they might say "Oh, you mean Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut?" Now, if you mentioned the University of Texas at Austin, *EVERYONE" in acadamia has heard of UT and knows that UT has highly ranked programs in law, business, medicine, engineering, technology, and the liberal arts.

Look, Trinity U. in San Antonio is a good quality, selective undergraduate institution where the emphasis is upon exceptional teaching. It's a good school. But it has few, if any, graduate programs and its emphasis is upon the liberal arts. It is not in the academic big leagues.

The engine that drives academia and the basis of perceived quality in the business of academia is not teaching. It is research, publications, major grant funding, and graduate programs. And in Texas, UT-Austin is unquestionably tops.
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:00 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
957 posts, read 3,094,513 times
Reputation: 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsenator View Post
I am in academia and would 100% disagree. Go to any major professional acadmeic conference and ask poeple there what they know about Trinity. First, these scholars would asusme you're talking about Trinity College, Oxford University (U.K.) which is - hands down - the most famous Trinity in academia. "No," you say, "I'm not talking about Oxford." Then they might say "Oh, you mean Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut?" Now, if you mentioned the University of Texas at Austin, *EVERYONE" in acadamia has heard of UT and knows that UT has highly ranked programs in law, business, medicine, engineering, technology, and the liberal arts.

Look, Trinity U. in San Antonio is a good quality, selective undergraduate institution where the emphasis is upon exceptional teaching. It's a good school. But it has few, if any, graduate programs and its emphasis is upon the liberal arts. It is not in the academic big leagues.

The engine that drives academia and the basis of perceived quality in the business of academia is not teaching. It is research, publications, major grant funding, and graduate programs. And in Texas, UT-Austin is unquestionably tops.
IMHO, Texas only has a few REALLY good schools where the quality of education is of the upmost importance and they aren't recognized for sports. The only one I feel that is great at both is UT-Austin. UT-Austin is great all around and is a public school, so it costs less. Rice is a great school as well recognized for their academics.

Personally, I don't see why a research institution would be perceived as being of better quality and I have never heard this theory before today either. I never went to one, so I truly don't know, but I have heard people complain that their professors are always too busy for them and/or TAs are the ones really teaching. I'm sorry but that's not what I'm paying for.

I truly am not promoting it here, but I am an alumna of Trinity and I am half way into receiving my Master's degree there as well. True they do not offer many Master's degrees, and they don't offer any PhDs, however, their education system is top notch and you will bust your ass and then some if you go there. The students are very bright and the teachers know this. They expect nothing but the best from you and will not put up with slack! Never in my entire time there was I ever taught by a TA. The professors are amazing and you get very personal service outside of class as well.

Trinity is a well recognized name in the south and I'm speaking of the University, not the college. I've told many people in Houston, Louisiana and even California I am from Trinity and they know I am talking about the school in San Antonio. Then when I visit NYC and tell them where I go, of course they assume I'm talking about the one in CT. Many down here don't even know there's one in CT and I'm sure those in CT don't know of us down here.
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:13 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
957 posts, read 3,094,513 times
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Originally Posted by LittleTPot View Post
Does anyone have any feedback on the different universities in San Antonio? My husband and I will be relocating this summer, and I work in higher education administration. I know there are a lot of universities in the area, but I have no familiarity in terms of the caliber or reputations of the schools. Can anyone provide feedback on the local universities or point me the direction of a good resource for researching them? I know that working for and attending a university are two completely separate things, but I'm curious about general reputation as a place to work or attend.

Thanks!
Some feel this may be biased, but you can always view Princeton Review and/or US News and World Reports.

To answer your question a little more thoroughly, UTSA has a bad reputation in regards to their undergrad program (sorry to offend anyone that goes there, but that's what is said) however their grad programs are good. That doesn't mean you won't learn though if you are a bright and dedicated student. Again, I don't know if it's true, but I have heard the quality of education has gone down at Incarnate Word as well.

I have an adjunct professor right now for my law class who also teaches at St. Mary's School of Law and he actually told us he makes our law class (Trinity) harder and our class discussions are intellectually more stimulating and we're not even getting law degrees. I also had a classmate that transferred from St. Mary's during undergrad and she said Trinity was twice as hard.

It also depends on what you're looking for in terms of the degree. I have heard UTSA has a great Comp Sci program, but bad Liberal Arts. Trinity is top notch for Liberal Arts, but they offer few advanced degrees. So in essence it kind of all depends.
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:16 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
957 posts, read 3,094,513 times
Reputation: 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by schertz1 View Post
In all categories, where Trinity and UT meet criteria thresholds, Trinity meets or surpasses UT. For example, both are more selective but Trinity has higher SAT/ACT/GPA of incoming freshmen. UT and Rice are reasearch universities, which places them in the highest category of school. It does not mean they are better universities. Once again carnegie doesn't rank quality of education. Most people in academia will say Trinity is a better school than UT. Rice is a different story.
I like your way of thinking and agree with you 100%
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:25 PM
 
81 posts, read 198,017 times
Reputation: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsenator View Post
I am in academia and would 100% disagree. Go to any major professional acadmeic conference and ask poeple there what they know about Trinity. First, these scholars would asusme you're talking about Trinity College, Oxford University (U.K.) which is - hands down - the most famous Trinity in academia. "No," you say, "I'm not talking about Oxford." Then they might say "Oh, you mean Trinity College in Hartford, Connecticut?" Now, if you mentioned the University of Texas at Austin, *EVERYONE" in acadamia has heard of UT and knows that UT has highly ranked programs in law, business, medicine, engineering, technology, and the liberal arts.

Look, Trinity U. in San Antonio is a good quality, selective undergraduate institution where the emphasis is upon exceptional teaching. It's a good school. But it has few, if any, graduate programs and its emphasis is upon the liberal arts. It is not in the academic big leagues.

The engine that drives academia and the basis of perceived quality in the business of academia is not teaching. It is research, publications, major grant funding, and graduate programs. And in Texas, UT-Austin is unquestionably tops.
I assume you have ties to UT and have drunk the Kool-Aid. If anyone in academia doesn't know about Trinity, they are not really in academia. There is a difference in having a job and actually knowing a sector. Trinity is usually first in its class; where is UT? There are several small schools in the U.S. that are more selective, prestigious, and offer higher quality programs than UT. Your argument about graduate programs, grant funding, research, and publications mainly pertain to professors or PhD level students. It has little benefit for undergrads and you must have a undergraduate degree first. Trinity has a higher quality undergraduate program. No, they do not offer as many degree plans, but they are better at what they do offer. I don't have information on this-call it a hunch-but I doubt Trinity Alumni are busting UT's door down to attend graduate programs. There is a reason for that.

Don't get me wrong; I like UT. It is a good school, just not the best. Trinity and Rice are better, practically Ivy League.
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Beautiful New England
2,412 posts, read 6,465,429 times
Reputation: 3054
Quote:
Originally Posted by schertz1 View Post
I assume you have ties to UT and have drunk the Kool-Aid.
Nope, no ties and no Kool-Aid. I just know academia and in the academy, Carnegie I (major research schools) is the top rung. Rice is certainly there. Trinity U., a fine liberal arts college, is not. That's no rap against Trinity, by the way. It's just the nature of the business--small liberal arts schools are generally not considered the top tier of academia. Such schools may undoubtedly be academically challenging and intellectually rigorous. But the major "movers and shakers" in academic administration; the most published and widely-cited scholars; the biggest and most influential research projects; and the Nobel and Pulitzer prize winners are almost invariably found at the major research schools.

Last edited by professorsenator; 01-23-2008 at 09:53 PM..
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Old 01-23-2008, 09:49 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
957 posts, read 3,094,513 times
Reputation: 139
Quote:
Originally Posted by professorsenator View Post
Nope, no ties and no Kool-Aid. I just know academia and in the academy, Carnegie I (major research schools) is the top rung. Rice is certainly there. Trinity U., a fine liberal arts college, is not. That's no rap against Trinity, by the way. It's just the nature of the business--small liberal arts schools are generally not considered the top tier of academia.
You just said it yourself-Trinity is NOT a research institution. However, top research school, non-research school aside, Trinity is def. top notch in terms of academics-as are Rice and UT.
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