Walking in street instead of sidewalk? Just curious (Houston, San Antonio: house, neighborhoods)

[Chaka]

Originally Posted by shenane

Thanks for all great responses. But still don't understand the street walkers in my neighborhood. We have a mile of new, even sidewalks, no overgrown bushes, garbage cans, no cars hanging out because it's a mile long walking trail - no driveways.

Thanks again

Why don't you stop and ask the walkers one of these days?

by the way - I hate it when people park their cars in the driveways so it crosses the sidewalk. Arggh!!!

[shenane]

Good idea. BTW, just remebered that I did get two reponses about why people like to walk on the street - the said the asphalt is easier on the joints.

I can understand folks' frustration with cars hanging out into the sidewalk but I appreciate folks packing their cars into their driveway the best they can instead of parking in front of my house all day and night.

Originally Posted by Chaka

Why don't you stop and ask the walkers one of these days?

by the way - I hate it when people park their cars in the driveways so it crosses the sidewalk. Arggh!!!

[motown mary]

I am here from Michigan...Seriously, what is up for the intermittent sidewalks? I live in an apartment that was likely all built at one time, yet the sidewalk runs behind a building & stops. Picks up in front of another building & curves out to a road then stops. Starts back up again a few hundred feet away up a hill....I do not get it at all.
AND, this funky sidewalk "system" was touted as a sort of fitness "trail." Ridiculous, just ridiculous.
Then, outside of the apartment complex, there are hills with sidewalks and then several feet of just.....grass or dirt. And then the sidewalk starts again. I do not get it.

[twange]

Originally Posted by Chaka

I went to college in Santa Barbara, a very bike-friendly campus and town (heavily used bike lanes through campus and town). When I first got there, bikers were supposed to yield to pedestrians. After a bunch of bike accidents where the cyclists fell off their bikes or created a pileup stopping for pedestrians crossing the bike lanes, they changed the rule. Pedestrians had to yield to cyclists. It made much more sense, given that pedestrians could stop and move over much easier than 100 cyclists could...

However it was always illegal to ride on sidewalks, and yes, you did get ticketed (also could be arrested for riding a bike while drunk)

For sure. When bikes are riding in the street with auto traffic, yes, pedestrians should yield to bikes. But when bikes are on the sidewalk or trails they should yield to the slowest form of transportation:walkers!

Every time I've been in California, it always surprises me how cars slow down and yield to pedestrians. Say what you want about California and it's folks but they got that right in most of their cities. The pedestrian infrastructure and share the road mentality is pretty damn good.

[Chaka]

Originally Posted by twange

For sure. When bikes are riding in the street with auto traffic, yes, pedestrians should yield to bikes. But when bikes are on the sidewalk or trails they should yield to the slowest form of transportation:walkers!

On the campus, the bikes are not on auto roads but on specific bike-only paths. The pedestrians had to yield to the bikes, otherwise, there'd be a 100+bike pileup. There were also specific crossing places (note, the paths are only wide enough for 2 bikes each direction), you could be fined for crossing in a non-crossing zone.


(I speak in the past tense only because I'm not sure if it's changed in the many years since I've been there)

[Chaka]

Originally Posted by motown mary

I am here from Michigan...Seriously, what is up for the intermittent sidewalks? I live in an apartment that was likely all built at one time, yet the sidewalk runs behind a building & stops. Picks up in front of another building & curves out to a road then stops. Starts back up again a few hundred feet away up a hill....I do not get it at all.
AND, this funky sidewalk "system" was touted as a sort of fitness "trail." Ridiculous, just ridiculous.
Then, outside of the apartment complex, there are hills with sidewalks and then several feet of just.....grass or dirt. And then the sidewalk starts again. I do not get it.

Honestly? It's because it would seem the concept of walking in Texas is just foreign, so the people who put in sidewalks aren't really thinking about people actually *using* them. They're for show.

I swear Texans get in their trucks to drive across the street (I have *seen* this more than once!). When I'd tell people I walked the 1.2 miles to work they freaked out. On one trip to El Paso I said I didn't need to rent a car because my hotel was about a mile from the office and I could just walk, they argued with me for a week about how I "needed" a car.

Heck, on another local chat group once a poster was telling someone with a hotel reservation at the Hotel on St. Mary's/Lexington would require a cab to get to the restaurants on the Riverwalk because it was "too far to walk" - and this was not a disabled person but a healthy young 20-something. It's about a 10-15 minute walk at most.

[TexasNick]

Okay that does it.

Today as I was driving to the bank, I saw a guy in one of those bike-things that are real low to the ground (like half a foot) with a hammock-style seat that leans back and you just pedal with your feet as if it was a paddle boat. That wasn't bad, but what did it for me was when he had to have 4 large dogs on leashes spread out all around in a huge 360 degree circle as if he was a drunken iditarod dog sled team that was late for chow. They took up the entire road and i couldn't pass him. Not wanting to disturb the peace, I decided to take a detour around a different street thinking I could pass him before he got to the other corner. Wrong.

Now that's ridiculous.

[twange]

Originally Posted by Chaka

Honestly? It's because it would seem the concept of walking in Texas is just foreign, so the people who put in sidewalks aren't really thinking about people actually *using* them. They're for show.

I agree. I usually get attacked for making statements like this but since you brought it up...I guess the reality is that many of Texas' cities developed long after the car sunk it's oily talons into American culture(obviously the cities were here but they weren't as big as they are now). In many of the large cities up north, most of the older neighborhoods were developed much earlier around pedestrian and streetcar design, so it's just more encouraging(and safer) to walk in those kinds of areas. Tree-lawns are also rare here in Texas, which gives folks more of a separation from barreling SUVs.

This is not a judgment about Texas and it's people, simply a statement based on historical city planning and how design influences behavior. So before anyone starts calling me a damn yankee, communist, hippy, un-American, anarchist or any other foolish, reactionary name for someone who might have different expectations of what constitutes a good neighborhood/city, please try and consider that we are after all, built for walking

Originally Posted by TexasNick

Okay that does it.

Today as I was driving to the bank, I saw a guy in one of those bike-things that are real low to the ground (like half a foot) with a hammock-style seat that leans back and you just pedal with your feet as if it was a paddle boat. That wasn't bad, but what did it for me was when he had to have 4 large dogs on leashes spread out all around in a huge 360 degree circle as if he was a drunken iditarod dog sled team that was late for chow. They took up the entire road and i couldn't pass him. Not wanting to disturb the peace, I decided to take a detour around a different street thinking I could pass him before he got to the other corner. Wrong.

Now that's ridiculous.

Indeed. I might have had to (kindly) say something to that guy. It's inconsiderate and frankly unsafe to take up a whole lane with something that travels that much slower than regular traffic. Poor dogs.

[Chaka]

Originally Posted by twange

I agree. I usually get attacked for making statements like this but since you brought it up...I guess the reality is that many of Texas' cities developed long after the car sunk it's oily talons into American culture(obviously the cities were here but they weren't as big as they are now). In many of the large cities up north, most of the older neighborhoods were developed much earlier around pedestrian and streetcar design, so it's just more encouraging(and safer) to walk in those kinds of areas. Tree-lawns are also rare here in Texas, which gives folks more of a separation from barreling SUVs.

Weeeellll, actually, my 'hood predates the car, and yet there were very few sidewalks. The roads were made for carriages.

I think you've got it though. Texas cities (among others) were built around the automobile, not the pedestrian. No one expects you to walk anywhere. But it's not just Texas. It's all of the US (with some exceptions - even the East Coast, though tending to be more walking oriented, is still very car-centric). Bill Bryson -travel writer, American who lived 20 years in England then moved to New Hampshire - has a brilliant essay on this.

We do walk everywhere downtown, and for the most part there are sidewalks, but outside downtown it's a lot more challenging. I often walk to lunch in the Medical area, and people are always offering me a ride. I say "No thanks, I want to walk." They clearly see me as an eccentric.

[wralyn]

I'm a little late getting in on this discussion, but I think I'm familiar with the area of Live Oak you are referring to. My wife and I walk it occassionally and tend to walk in the street because the sidewalk is too narrow for us to walk side-by-side. Also, there is a place where the sidewalk drops off and part of the sidewalk is at the edge of an undeveloped field which can be a perfect place for snakes to hang out. We do, however, walk towards the oncoming traffic as all pedestrians should...when in the roadway. We also move over to the sidewalk when a vehicle is approaching. Since the speed limit is a strictly enforced 20mph and you have an excellent line of sight on the roadway, there is plenty of time to move over. Most of what you are witnessing is pure ignorance and disregard for public safety. Most of these people probably drive the same way they walk.