Teaching Jobs (San Antonio, Schertz, Howe: appointed, sale, high school)

[saywhat?]

I teach in NISD and my husband teaches in NEISD. These districts do not have any problem with an adequate applicant pool. They tend to weed out more aggresively than other districts and it goes from there. Small towns, like maybe Three Rivers, are good to try out if you only have alt cert (and can coach)......the pay is a lot less though in those areas. Districts along the border are much more likely to hire an alt cert. Del Rio would be a nice place to live as well.

[slaleman]

Originally Posted by saywhat?

I teach in NISD and my husband teaches in NEISD. These districts do not have any problem with an adequate applicant pool. They tend to weed out more aggresively than other districts and it goes from there. Small towns, like maybe Three Rivers, are good to try out if you only have alt cert (and can coach)......the pay is a lot less though in those areas. Districts along the border are much more likely to hire an alt cert. Del Rio would be a nice place to live as well.

OK, here's my trump card: I've worked as an administrator in NEISD, a teacher in SAISD, and currently am an administrator in SCUCISD. From my experience and conversations with other administrators in the above districts as well as Northside, I know for a fact that they will hire the best person for the position regardless of if they have a certification through "traditional" channels or through alternative certification. I've seen more and more teachers over the past 5 years be hired with alternative certification because the needs for certified teachers in these districts simply aren't being met by the local universities.

I've also seen discrimination against those teachers with alternative certification by teachers with traditional certification. If you're discouraging this person from applying for a position here in San Antonio based on the fact that they're going to have an alternative certification, shame on you.

There is no difference between the teaching certificate of someone who went through alternative certification and someone who went the traditional route, so by saying that a person has "only an alternative certification" you're minimizing the effort and hard work they've put into becoming a certified teacher after they've already achieved another degree outside of education and in most cases had another career. The only difference is in their resume, which will show a degree other than education.

Just because someone doesn't go the traditional route doesn't mean they're going to be a worse teacher, in fact, many of the teachers I know with alternative certification are better teachers and have more passion for the profession than some of those with traditional education degrees.

[LadyAlli]

Well said slaleman! I have a few friends who have alt. certifications and they all work for NEISD. They all had other degrees and decided they wanted to teach after they had worked in the corporate world. I commend them for taking the classes and getting certified while working all day. It's a lot of work. There is no need to go to a small town to teach if you have an alt. cert. The big school districts in San Antonio will hire you, and you will get paid the same as the teachers who have an education degree and a "traditional" certification.

[saywhat?]

Of course we need all the good educators we can get! And it's never come up whether someone is traditionally or alternatively certified and thus being discriminated against - at least not in my experience.
I've known some great people who got their alternative certification but found it difficult/impossible to get a job because the big districts' preference for the "traditionally certified" teacher. THAT is a shame and shame on them.

[delsuburban1]

Originally Posted by slaleman

OK, here's my trump card: I've worked as an administrator in NEISD, a teacher in SAISD, and currently am an administrator in SCUCISD. From my experience and conversations with other administrators in the above districts as well as Northside, I know for a fact that they will hire the best person for the position regardless of if they have a certification through "traditional" channels or through alternative certification. I've seen more and more teachers over the past 5 years be hired with alternative certification because the needs for certified teachers in these districts simply aren't being met by the local universities.

I've also seen discrimination against those teachers with alternative certification by teachers with traditional certification. If you're discouraging this person from applying for a position here in San Antonio based on the fact that they're going to have an alternative certification, shame on you.

There is no difference between the teaching certificate of someone who went through alternative certification and someone who went the traditional route, so by saying that a person has "only an alternative certification" you're minimizing the effort and hard work they've put into becoming a certified teacher after they've already achieved another degree outside of education and in most cases had another career. The only difference is in their resume, which will show a degree other than education.

Just because someone doesn't go the traditional route doesn't mean they're going to be a worse teacher, in fact, many of the teachers I know with alternative certification are better teachers and have more passion for the profession than some of those with traditional education degrees.

Good points! I have to admit that I went through Alternative Certification and passed my 5 tests the first time around! I have a lot of friends that have their degree in Education and it took them numerous times to pass the tests!

[saywhat?]

I didn't get my degree in Education either - this is my later in life career that I love with all my heart.
I did have to take about 60 hours to get enough hours to take the Social Studies Composite, plus education courses, student teaching. I recall that the ExCet professional exam was very tough when I took it in 1999 - my school had low scoring special groups so there was a lot of emphasis on getting us to pass that exam. Glad they did - wouldn't have wanted to take that thing a second time.
It's a great time to be a teacher and there are so many people with talents in certain areas, as well as life experiences, to share with our students. The Alt Cert program should be recognized as a pragmatic way to get those teachers into the system. And NOT that these people are trying to "short cut" their way into the profession.

[pobre]

Yes, but those districts won't hire Alt Cert people AS INTERNS. As time goes by, fewer and fewer districts are even hiring interns, and preferring to hire those who have their certificates in hand. I can't speak for discrimination AFTER they obtain certification, but there are very few areas in which ANY district will hire an intern.

As for NEISD, NISD, and the like not having a large enough pool, I can speak to that. I attended job fairs in May (NEISD) June (NISD) and June (all-SA area). Let me tell you, there are PLENTY of applicants. Many were either veteran teachers, or certified in ESL/bilingual/Spec Ed, etc, the higher need areas. At NEISD, there were lines of up to an hour to drop off resumes at a school that has NO OPENINGS, and already had a stack approaching 4 inches high. At NISD, they had the openings posted. I counted 24, with approximate attendance of over 2000. Many were leaving once they saw the crowds. At the SAAPA one, again, lines of up to an hour per district. Few openings. There were, however, some districts from over an hour and a half away. Even they were only looking for a few, very specialized applicants.

A recent article in the paper quoted an NISD representative stating that teacher salaries (at least entry level) had risen over 24% in the last 3-4 years. So, you have lower attition rates (because salaries are finally moving up), PLUS more people entering (partly due to more attractive salaries). I think that this year, supply met demand in a big way.

I don't think that districts should hire alt-cert as interns over a qualified person who is already certified. But, once the certification is in place, there should be no difference. Let's also not forget those principals who prefer graduates of certain universities, or who hire friends and children of friends.

This year, there was very little movement in NEISD. I heard veteran teachers discussing it, how no one was able to transfer within district. The turnover rate seems to have crawled to a halt. Many of the schools have reached their capacities already, so no new positions. Now, I am mostly speaking about elementary, but I am sure the same holds for MS/HS.

Originally Posted by slaleman

OK, here's my trump card: I've worked as an administrator in NEISD, a teacher in SAISD, and currently am an administrator in SCUCISD. From my experience and conversations with other administrators in the above districts as well as Northside, I know for a fact that they will hire the best person for the position regardless of if they have a certification through "traditional" channels or through alternative certification. I've seen more and more teachers over the past 5 years be hired with alternative certification because the needs for certified teachers in these districts simply aren't being met by the local universities.

I've also seen discrimination against those teachers with alternative certification by teachers with traditional certification. If you're discouraging this person from applying for a position here in San Antonio based on the fact that they're going to have an alternative certification, shame on you.

[slaleman]

The problem with looking for a specific opening at a specific school is that you're not going to get it. Sure, there will always be long lines of people waiting to talk to a Stone Oak Elementary, or an Alamo Heights ISD, but how many people were standing in line to talk to Woodlawn Elementary or Burbank HS, or Jay HS for that matter?

Citing a specific number of openings doesn't truly tell you how many openings a school or district might actually have. Many times the principals don't know how many spots they'll have until late in the summer. They may have an idea of who is leaving, but since teachers don't have to resign until late in June, they can't post a position until it's actually vacant. Even then, since registration hasn't finished yet, schools won't know how many teachers they really need until the start of the school year, and sometimes later. I've heard too many horror stories of teachers who were hired on at one school only to be transferred to another during the first month because the projections were off, only to have that school hire another teacher three weeks later because more kids came in. It happens all the time.

As for interns, if you're referring to student teachers, then they're not hired, they're placed. I can't speak to placing folks in alt certification programs as student teachers, because I went the traditional route, but my university handled all of the setup with the district...they just tell you where to be on the first day.

[pobre]

No, I'm not talking about a specific opening at a specific school. I'm talking about attending a job fair for elementary schools, at the district's job fair. And yes, there were plenty of people standing in line at every school, not just certain ones. The shortest waits were at least 30 minutes. And, at NEISD/NISD, hardly ANYONE was hiring. Just a 15 second handshake and passing of the resume. And the ones that were, were looking for positions other than classroom (counselors, etc).I can't speak for MS and HS, as I am attending elementary job fairs.

Since the districts hold their job fairs in May/early June, one can only go by that. Your hope is that 2 months later, when they have an opening, that you stand out from among the other 1000 plus resumes that they have (yes, I know of schools who have received that many resumes!!)

What I'm saying, is that THIS YEAR, there are WAY more applicants than in the past. I have heard princiapals comment on it. Yes, many times, openings come up in the summer. But everyone that I have spoken to is surprised at the low movement.

In addition, SAISD is shedding positions. Not by actually laying off (yet), but through attrition. So, that is also a factor.

I know the difference between a student teacher and an intern. I was referring to Alt-Cert candidates being hired as interns. What I said was, when they are still in the process of obtaining certification, they are hired as interns. I don't know of Alt-Cert programs that place student teachers, only interns. So, tight job market means that an ALt-Cert candidate looking for an internship will have a harder time than in the past, due to the greater number of viable certified candidates. The job market should have zero effect on student teachers.

Originally Posted by slaleman

The problem with looking for a specific opening at a specific school is that you're not going to get it. Sure, there will always be long lines of people waiting to talk to a Stone Oak Elementary, or an Alamo Heights ISD, but how many people were standing in line to talk to Woodlawn Elementary or Burbank HS, or Jay HS for that matter?

Citing a specific number of openings doesn't truly tell you how many openings a school or district might actually have. Many times the principals don't know how many spots they'll have until late in the summer. They may have an idea of who is leaving, but since teachers don't have to resign until late in June, they can't post a position until it's actually vacant. Even then, since registration hasn't finished yet, schools won't know how many teachers they really need until the start of the school year, and sometimes later. I've heard too many horror stories of teachers who were hired on at one school only to be transferred to another during the first month because the projections were off, only to have that school hire another teacher three weeks later because more kids came in. It happens all the time.

As for interns, if you're referring to student teachers, then they're not hired, they're placed. I can't speak to placing folks in alt certification programs as student teachers, because I went the traditional route, but my university handled all of the setup with the district...they just tell you where to be on the first day.

[buffy888]

I would love to come back down to San Antonio for another week to set up interviews, but financially that just isn't feasible right now. I am about to give up on the thought of moving back down to San Antonio because this just doesn't seem like it's going to work - it is a cliche, but it feels like we are in a Catch-22. We don't have the means to move down there without having jobs in place, but I don't feel I am going to get a job there unless we have already physically moved there.

I have applied with all of the districts that have internet applications. I received 2 calls a couple of weeks ago from schools in NISD that wanted in-person interviews. I had a phone interview set up with a school in ECISD, but the call never came. I do have a phone interview set up with a school in Edgewood ISD for later in the week, but that is really on the opposite side of town from where we would like to live. My preferences would be SCUCISD or Judson ISD - I graduated from Judson and have a friend who teaches there, but also have a friend who has taught in SCUCISD for many years and loves it. My husband has a few family members that live in that area as well. Location-wise, NEISD and possibly NISD would also work well.

I am just frustrated and don't know what to do. We haven't put our house up for sale because we feel like we are just in a waiting game to see if we will even be able to move.