Blinking yellow turn arrows (Dallas, Lubbock: school, law, legally)

[Bo]

Originally Posted by LindaGrace

It's my opinion that they've decided to try to dumb down traffic signals. Knowing you can turn left on a solid green light takes some level of common sense, and common sense is sorely lacking most of the time.

Given that people would howl if "common sense" were made a requirement for getting a driver's license, I like the notion of idiot-proofing traffic signals. If it has been proven through research (See TexHwyMan's post above) that the blinking yellow arrow keeps drivers from neglecting to yield when they make a left turn, that's fine with me.

[Taco-n-Beer]

I think the blinking arrows are cool and long overdue

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by LindaGrace

So basically the turning left on the flashing yellow arrow is the same as turning left on a regular green light?

If that's the case, why do we need the flashing yellow arrow?

No, there is clear difference, a green solid arrow indicates you have the right-of-way to turn. A flashing yellow arrow means you have to yield to oncoming traffic before turning. The latter is in lieu of a red light which means you sit and wait.

I finally saw some of these yesterday while running errands down around the San Pedro area. I think they are great, and are a welcome addition to help relieve traffic congestion in our town.

As folks have stated, it means you no longer have to wait while there is absolutely no traffic coming and you can safely make the turn. As TxHwyMan pointed out, these are proven enhancements and the majority of people are in favor of them. And, as also stated, these are used throughout the world with positive results.

Plus, if you think about it, it is actually no more dangerous than allowing a right turn on red. And many intersections that don't have a turn arrow allow turns to be made against oncoming traffic (yielding, of course), so the only differences is now allowing people to do the same with the flashing yellow arrow. For intersections where this is unsafe, the red allow prohibiting a turn will remain.

Lastly, the vast majority of traffic accidents in this town are due to people not following the rules of the road. This change to the turn arrows, if followed correctly, will not increase accidents.

Cheers! M2

[TexHwyMan]

Originally Posted by LindaGrace

So basically the turning left on the flashing yellow arrow is the same as turning left on a regular green light?

If that's the case, why do we need the flashing yellow arrow?

Because the circular green signal makes many drivers think they have the right-of-way even when turning left. With the flashing yellow arrow, drivers are more likely to default to yielding, which is the desired outcome. Go back and read my post earlier in this thread about the research behind the FYA:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/san-a...-arrows.html#6

BTW, these have been in place in San Antonio since December of last year.

[Troubleshooter]

There is a reason left turn signals are being changed. It is the dangerous condition called "yellow trap."

Yellow trap occurs when the traffic signal changes to circular yellow in one direction, wile opposing traffic still has a green light (and will shortly get a left turn green arrow). Any driver waiting to turn left on the approach that turned yellow will either be tricked into turning across traffic that still has a green light, or trapped in the intersection with a red light and oncoming traffic that is not stopping.

The problem is that the circular green used to permit the left turn must be ended at an unsafe time for the left turning driver, in order to stop the straight ahead drivers. It stops the permissive left turn through gaps in opposing traffic at the WRONG TIME.

The flashing yellow arrow prevents yellow trap. It can keep flashing after the circular green ends. This lets the left turning driver keep trying to turn through gaps in opposing traffic until that opposing traffic gets its yellow. This safely ends the permissive left turn without the yellow trap.

Why would the circular greens in opposite directions end at different times? Here are the reasons:

- No traffic is present on the cross street, but cars are waiting to turn left on one approach. The signal skips the greens for the cross street. But the one car waiting to turn in the other direction is waiting in the intersection, and so is not detected.

- The plan for signal progression (green lights at each intersection as you come to it) requires one of the left turns to get an arrow AFTER the oncoming traffic gets a circular green. This is called a lagging turn. Progression is often not possible without doing this in one direction. The other direction gets a leading turn (the left turn arrow is before the oncoming straight ahead).

- Making drivers wait for a red arrow (instead of letting them turn through gaps in opposing) traffic is not energy efficient. But red arrows must be used to prevent yellow trap if any approach has a lagging left turn (unless flashing yellow arrows are used).

- Preemption of the signal for a train, drawbridge, or emergency vehicle.

[edubya]

Originally Posted by TexHwyMan

Because the circular green signal makes many drivers think they have the right-of-way even when turning left. With the flashing yellow arrow, drivers are more likely to default to yielding, which is the desired outcome. Go back and read my post earlier in this thread about the research behind the FYA:
http://www.city-data.com/forum/san-a...-arrows.html#6

BTW, these have been in place in San Antonio since December of last year.

Your previous post was very informative. I had to laugh when several posters said they encountered flashing yellow arrows and weren't sure what to do, so they yielded by default. Let's see...where did I read about that kind of thing happening?

[BUSTOFF]

Your tax dollars are being wasted on this program. Just business as usual for Taco Town.

[scuba steve]

It's not a waste for me - for every red turn arrow that goes away I don't wait as long at lights.

[TexHwyMan]

Originally Posted by BUSTOFF

Your tax dollars are being wasted on this program. Just business as usual for Taco Town.

Once again, this is not just a San Antonio thing-- this is being implemented in many places across the country. Any program that improves intersection safety and efficiency is not a waste.

[majormadmax]

Originally Posted by BUSTOFF

Your tax dollars are being wasted on this program. Just business as usual for Taco Town.

Moderator cut: off topicWhy is it a waste of tax money? It helps traffic flow and prevents cars from piling up in turn lanes when there is a clear opportunity for them to make a yielded turn. And I am sure the modification is fairly cheap, so I can't fathom where your comment is coming from. Care to elaborate?