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Old 11-02-2009, 12:01 PM
 
1,413 posts, read 1,866,750 times
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Football does not contribute to the education process in universities. Thus, who gives a darn about UTSA having one - except for fan ego. They certainly don't aid financially. It is pathetic that schools have to offer entertainment divisions to support their educational missions. The Chronicle of Higher Ed. has had a clear discussion of the corruption, waste of resources and lowering of standards that are correlated with big football.
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Old 11-02-2009, 06:08 PM
 
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UTSA is well aware that a football program will likely be a money-losing venture (unless they can boast national wins). The cost of coaching salaries, scholarships, facilities, marketing, etc. will not be covered by ticket sales. The schools isn't counting on any mutli-million dollar corporate contributions or sponsorships to make this a reality. The school is hoping that the program will bring talent, pride, prestige, recognition, and provide a more typical collegiate atmosphere.
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Old 11-02-2009, 07:21 PM
 
1,791 posts, read 2,434,246 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GEM-Texas View Post
Football does not contribute to the education process in universities. Thus, who gives a darn about UTSA having one - except for fan ego. They certainly don't aid financially. It is pathetic that schools have to offer entertainment divisions to support their educational missions. The Chronicle of Higher Ed. has had a clear discussion of the corruption, waste of resources and lowering of standards that are correlated with big football.
You don't know what you're talking about at all. I could make a huge laundry list of contributions, but it would be wasted energy.
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Old 11-02-2009, 09:41 PM
 
15,062 posts, read 19,621,616 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgannaway89 View Post
UTSA is well aware that a football program will likely be a money-losing venture (unless they can boast national wins). The cost of coaching salaries, scholarships, facilities, marketing, etc. will not be covered by ticket sales. The schools isn't counting on any mutli-million dollar corporate contributions or sponsorships to make this a reality. The school is hoping that the program will bring talent, pride, prestige, recognition, and provide a more typical collegiate atmosphere.
That doesn't make sense,
if High Schools and community colleges can have football teams
I don't see why a university with 30,000 students has to do a referendum to find out if they should have a football team.
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Old 11-03-2009, 12:34 AM
 
2,027 posts, read 6,351,961 times
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Originally Posted by Dopo View Post
That doesn't make sense,
if High Schools and community colleges can have football teams
I don't see why a university with 30,000 students has to do a referendum to find out if they should have a football team.
UTSA didn't even have a rec center on campus until 2003. There were few fees and school offered a "commuter campus" atmosphere. The school went on a spending spree, over $500 million in new buildings and renovations in just a few years. They more than doubled the number of on campus housing. This also resulted in a huge increase (nearly 10% some years) in tuition increases. They began raising admission standards in 2008 with plans to cap enrollment at 35,000. Football, and athletics overall, haven't been a priority of students or school officials. Even attendance at athletics events this year are pathetic even compared to a high school event. The school is really hoping the football team sparks interest in UTSA athletics.
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Old 11-03-2009, 05:12 AM
 
15,062 posts, read 19,621,616 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgannaway89 View Post
UTSA didn't even have a rec center on campus until 2003. There were few fees and school offered a "commuter campus" atmosphere. The school went on a spending spree, over $500 million in new buildings and renovations in just a few years. They more than doubled the number of on campus housing. This also resulted in a huge increase (nearly 10% some years) in tuition increases. They began raising admission standards in 2008 with plans to cap enrollment at 35,000. Football, and athletics overall, haven't been a priority of students or school officials. Even attendance at athletics events this year are pathetic even compared to a high school event. The school is really hoping the football team sparks interest in UTSA athletics.
Thanks, now it's making sense (somewhat)
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Old 11-03-2009, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Rancho Palos Verdes, California
62 posts, read 125,998 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GEM-Texas View Post
Football does not contribute to the education process in universities. Thus, who gives a darn about UTSA having one - except for fan ego. They certainly don't aid financially. It is pathetic that schools have to offer entertainment divisions to support their educational missions. The Chronicle of Higher Ed. has had a clear discussion of the corruption, waste of resources and lowering of standards that are correlated with big football.
Agree with TEXEX06 - the idea that a football program at UTSA is a "bad" thing is baseless. NCAA football can indeed be a cynical and corrupt system (witness Dexter Manley graduating from Oklahoma State yet being illiterate) - but it more than makes up for that with the amount identity, pride and alumni support it generates for the school.

UTSA's case cannot be compared to that of a tier-I state university - the football program for UTSA is more of a "legitimizing" agent for the university. Let's be frank, UTSA is not competing for students who would otherwise go to top-10 colleges. Having a football team does indeed interest prospective students who are "on the fence". Having a football team makes college "more fun". Having a football team eventually becomes a big business and brings in dollars, often at the minimal expense of having a few sub-par student atheletes. It also opens college education to students who otherwise would not attend college.

Most importantly, it is simply part of the legitimate collegiate experience. I am not sure where you went for higher education, but if it was anyplace other than a seminary, you can vouch for the centrality of the football team to the social atmosphere and identity of the school. It is also a point of pride to the community. UTSA desperately needs to be "put on the map", and it is extremely odd to have such a large school without a football program. That scares prospective students.

Please don't use the hackneyed arguement that it will raise tuition - if an extra $80 a year of fees breaks your bank, then clearly you lived on a precarious financial margin that could not include going to college. $80 is a night of drinking. College atheletics are an important part of ALL COLLEGES. As an alumni of a decidedly non-football schools (federal service academy and Ivy League Graduate School), I can personally attest that football has importance beyond the "football mills" of the Big-12 or poorly-founded "it hurts academics" arguements.

I for one welcome UTSA football, and it will go a long way to making the school a better institution.
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Old 11-03-2009, 10:45 AM
 
1,413 posts, read 1,866,750 times
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Centrality of football to a school's identity is a delusion in the mind of the football choir. It may be a particular regional cultural value. However, if being fan is more important than education - go for it. If you think a team is important for prestige as compared to well educated students and quality research - then you have your values inverted.

However, as with religion - the devoted are immune to evidence.
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Old 11-03-2009, 11:30 AM
 
Location: In a Galaxy far, far away called Germany
4,284 posts, read 3,722,410 times
Reputation: 2333
Quote:
Originally Posted by GEM-Texas View Post
Centrality of football to a school's identity is a delusion in the mind of the football choir. It may be a particular regional cultural value. However, if being fan is more important than education - go for it. If you think a team is important for prestige as compared to well educated students and quality research - then you have your values inverted.

However, as with religion - the devoted are immune to evidence.
But praise God/s that we have you to provide our dose of good, practical, and reasonable logic, right? Sometimes people like something (in this case, football) - not because it's better than something else, or even that it's beneficial in any way - but we like it regardless and (doggone it) just wanna' do it. If you can find something wrong with that, then you're hosed 'cause the Planet Vulcan is just make believe.
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