Californian gun control (Arnold: crime rate, home, neighborhood)

[dude25]

Who else believes this is a load of crap. Arnold is taking away our second amendment for those who don't know. What will you do when do when the domestic security force knocks on your door and takes away your rights. Trust me they are doing this for a reason, do some research.

[jeepejeep]

What can you expect from a RINO in charge of The Peoples Republik of California?

[bhcompy]

arnold isnt really a rino, hes just not a social republican. hes not a democrat(or the equivalent of a dixiecrat).

[flo2900]

Originally Posted by dude25

Who else believes this is a load of crap. Arnold is taking away our second amendment for those who don't know. What will you do when do when the domestic security force knocks on your door and takes away your rights. Trust me they are doing this for a reason, do some research.

Just don`t understand why ppl need guns at home in the 21st century?....whom do you want to defend against?...I could see the need for guns when Constitution was adopted couple of hundreds years ago but we`re in 2008 and dynamics have changed.
Maybe another school shooting like the Columbine will make ppl understand that America needs to line up to civilized western world and that the old wild west mentality should stop at western movies.
Social sophistication comes with time, travelling and exposure to information. In today`s modern world some ppl in America still live in a bubble. We live in a very competitive global economy and the eminent danger to our national security is the energy crisis not that we`re somehow outgunned by our government...now....put the gun down and go read a book!

[bhcompy]

as long as people are educated in their use there is no reason to take away guns. while gun murder rates go down, petty crime, rape, robbery, etc go up in countries where they've been taken away(australia, england, etc). the us and countries like switzerland operate just fine with their guns. hell, the swiss govt issues every citizen that serves their time in the armed forces(which is either everyone or every male i believe) a weapon and ammo

[jeepejeep]

Originally Posted by flo2900

Just don`t understand why ppl need guns at home in the 21st century?....whom do you want to defend against?

Have you not heard about muggings, home invasions, violent assault, rape? Sometimes, the only answer is with superior force. A gun provides that.

[cobmw]

It's simple. We just pass a law saying that all bad people need to turn in their guns. Then we take away guns from the good people. Problem solved.

[rifleman]

Originally Posted by flo2900

Just don`t understand why ppl need guns at home in the 21st century?....whom do you want to defend against?*...I could see the need for guns when Constitution was adopted couple of hundreds years ago but we`re in 2008 and dynamics have changed.

now....put the gun down and go read a book!

Flo, I respect your (misguided) belief that somehow guns are the problem and not the bad ethical standards and resulting behavior of people. That the US would somehow be maniac-free (i.e.: Columbine) if magically all of our guns were dissolved. In America you're allowed to express your feelings. But you are NOT allowed to push them on others, esp. when the statistics and outright evidence show different.

* " ...in the 21st century, what do we want / need to defend against?" Check the 21st century stats on home invasions, armed thug attacks on city streets, car-jackings, etc. etc. No need for defence? Perhaps you live in Pleasantville? Superman or Batman is always available? You're lucky.

Specifically, US per-capita crime rate is 19 times lower than in Mexico, where gun control is strict and viciously enforced, for example. I posted the link to the report by our very own FBI, prepaired in conjunction with a well-known university. Irrefutable. Undeniable. Note also that there were, I think, 4 other countries with significantly higher per-cap gun-related homicide rates that here, but ALL of them have much stricter gun laws.

The point? I hope I don't need to explain. The other point? Your personal dislikes, based on emotional, media-driven hype of humungous proportions, do not constitute grounds for confiscating our lawfully owned and used guns. The endless demonization and ad hominem attacks against lawful gun owners by the media is getting a bit tiresome. I assume you'd rather come to your own conclusions rather than blindly accept those of others, especially when you know they have an agenda. Right?

So please... I'd ask that you, not I, should go read a good FBI report book. With an honest, open mind. And perhaps visit a shooting range and meet some of the folks you have such a bad opinion of. I have always found them to be peaceful, law-abiding, respectful of others, proud of America, safety-oriented, and helpful. Not a bunch of skinheads (not welcome), liberal hotheads (not welcome unless they're interested in learning that they may have been wrong all along), rednecks (except perhaps for me...) or paranoids.

The only paranoids I've met in regards to this hot topic are the liberals who apparently really fear gun owners. Perhaps they don't like the idea that we can effectively resist an Orwellian government ?

Thanks for listening and thinking!

Peace!

[flo2900]

Originally Posted by rifleman

Flo, I respect your (misguided) belief that somehow guns are the problem and not the bad ethical standards and resulting behavior of people. That the US would somehow be maniac-free (i.e.: Columbine) if magically all of our guns were dissolved. In America you're allowed to express your feelings. But you are NOT allowed to push them on others, esp. when the statistics and outright evidence show different.

* " ...in the 21st century, what do we want / need to defend against?" Check the 21st century stats on home invasions, armed thug attacks on city streets, car-jackings, etc. etc. No need for defence? Perhaps you live in Pleasantville? Superman or Batman is always available? You're lucky.

Specifically, US per-capita crime rate is 19 times lower than in Mexico, where gun control is strict and viciously enforced, for example. I posted the link to the report by our very own FBI, prepaired in conjunction with a well-known university. Irrefutable. Undeniable. Note also that there were, I think, 4 other countries with significantly higher per-cap gun-related homicide rates that here, but ALL of them have much stricter gun laws.

The point? I hope I don't need to explain. The other point? Your personal dislikes, based on emotional, media-driven hype of humungous proportions, do not constitute grounds for confiscating our lawfully owned and used guns. The endless demonization and ad hominem attacks against lawful gun owners by the media is getting a bit tiresome. I assume you'd rather come to your own conclusions rather than blindly accept those of others, especially when you know they have an agenda. Right?

So please... I'd ask that you, not I, should go read a good FBI report book. With an honest, open mind. And perhaps visit a shooting range and meet some of the folks you have such a bad opinion of. I have always found them to be peaceful, law-abiding, respectful of others, proud of America, safety-oriented, and helpful. Not a bunch of skinheads (not welcome), liberal hotheads (not welcome unless they're interested in learning that they may have been wrong all along), rednecks (except perhaps for me...) or paranoids.

The only paranoids I've met in regards to this hot topic are the liberals who apparently really fear gun owners. Perhaps they don't like the idea that we can effectively resist an Orwellian government ?

Thanks for listening and thinking!

Peace!

so, in other words we need guns to be the judge then the enforcer then pull the trigger!...BTW when you pull the trigger you`re going to jail right away regardless if you you had a reason to do it or not!....then...a jury of your peers will decide if you`ll ever get out!...NOT A GOOD DEAL!...We have ammended the constitution many, many times just because some of it became obsolete and because it was written over 200 years ago...owning guns and shooting at people for self proclamed "self defense" is primitive and will land you in jail!

Thanx for listening and thanx for admitting to being a redneck!

[rifleman]

Originally Posted by flo2900

so, in other words we need guns to be the judge then the enforcer then pull the trigger!...BTW when you pull the trigger you`re going to jail right away regardless if you you had a reason to do it or not!....then...a jury of your peers will decide if you`ll ever get out!...NOT A GOOD DEAL!...

Thanx for listening and thanx for admitting to being a redneck!

Which country do you live in again? There are innumerable cases where a law-abiding citizen gun-owning homeowner has lethally perforated an invader and the police don't even file charges. Many many. Get the idea? MANY!

Under duress, at 3:00am, in your darkened hallway, scared enough to dribble into your moccasins, and faced with a knife-wielding interloper, the law clearly states that if you personally and reasonably feel that your's or your family's safety is in danger, you MAY use Deadly Force. Legally, without even a strongly worded reprimand to follow. Generally, you are congratulated by the police, the mayor and your fellow citizens. One less predator on the streets!

Where you live, do you ask the intruder to wait while you call 911? Ever called 911? I have, as the thieves drove off with my Porsche. Right there in Canyon Country, CA no less! I watched them descend the road out of our neighborhood. The dispatcher said they had no officers available right then. They were involved in a more "important" situation. I later found out from a friend on the local PD force that they were all (6 of them!) talking to a particularly gorgeous girl down at the hospital who'd cut her head when she stumbled, drunk, out of a local bar and tripped. Fascinating!

The police arrived over an hour later. PS: when they did find my car, which ran out of gas in the middle of an intersection, they also found live 12ga buckshot rounds laying on the floor. Wonder what would have happened in your town if you'd diplomatically stepped out unarmed and asked them, please, to not take your car? (This, BTW, is the approach PE Obama has suggested to deal with thug states who only want to kill us. We'll soon see how that works for him. Or more unfortunately, for us. But THAT's another thread).

Yep, the American Constitution specifically allows us to defend ourselves. (Heller vs Washington, DC, recently. Google and read it. supported by no less than the SCOTUS). We, including you if you're an American, may act as judge and jury if the situation mandates it. If you were to be confronted on the streets one night, you'd better be wishing that I would conveniently happen along to save you. (PS: I happened to be one of the rare that actually held a California Concealed Weapons Permit. Apparently someone thought I was trustable, unlike you). Of course I'd not expect any thanks or appreciation.

And if my level of thinking is representative of rednecks everywhere, libs are definitely in trouble. Outnumbered, out-thought, out-gunned, and with a knee-jerk but PC dislike of certain parts of an inviolate Constitution. Must be frustrating for them, no?

Come on over for some "redneck" coffee (i.e.: unadulterated, strong, not decaffinated, modified or legislated, and without fake sweetners). If we can "channel" Thomas Jefferson, we'll also listen to his thoughts. He's gained my real admiration and trust through his obvious high levels of integrity and rational thinking. Musta also been a redneck, eh?

We'll all talk! You might learn something.

(PS: save me from the obligatory ad hominem attacks. Concede something thoughtfully, present a logical fact-filled response, or bow out. Thanks again, buddy!)