South Bay Expressway (La Mesa, Mesa: trip , work, street)

[jkoz]

I agree with JK above. . . The freeway and the new mall are gorgeous, but this is not North County, and it is not Rancho Mirage! Many are still going to other malls, and many are still going to head westward to I-805 instead of using the new freeway. It is a shame because the freeway is a timesaver without a doubt. El Cajon is now 15 minutes away, Grossmont Hospital is 10 minutes away, and I went from my home in Eastlake to the Spring Valley Big Lots in 6 minutes (never realized how close Spring Valley is!), much quicker that I could go to the Big Lots in Chula, but that little trip would cost me $4.00, even with FastTrak, probably more than I would spend at Big Lots!

As far as Otay Ranch Town Center, it is by far the prettiest mall in the county, but what were they thinking? Don't they study an area before they build? Their first clue that this is not an upscale area should have been when they looked across the street and saw a WalMart. You don't find WalMarts in La Jolla or Del Mar--Walmart generally builds their stores in MIDDLE/UPPER MIDDLE CLASS areas, and that is what we are here.

Yes, I will use the new freeway for my occasional trips to East County, but probably not more than once a week. As for the mall, I love to take my dog walking there, but most of the stores are way, way, above my budget. I think I speak for many in this area.

My predictions: The freeway will be used but will not be "in the black" for a very long time. The westward treks to 805 will continue down the H St./Otay Lakes/Olympic Pkwy corridors. The upscale stores in the mall will gradually be replaced by lower scale stores more suited to the area. The movie theatre and restaurants will do fine as they are.

[Imperial1904]

Originally Posted by db108108

I honestly don't think that traffic is bad enough in eastern Chula Vista that the new freeway is going to be enticing to people. My partner travels daily to Otay Mesa from East Palomar, taking Brandywine, Main, Heritage, and then the 905. The trip takes about 25 minutes and traffic is rarely an issue. The freeway would cut a few minutes off of that trip, but not enough to make it worthwhile, really.

Now, if he worked in East County (El Cajon, La Mesa, etc), the freeway would make sense. But I honestly don't see a whole lot of traveling between those points. Especially considering the troubled housing market in Eastern CV, I don't see the freeway being in the black for years.

Have you ever taken the toll road in Orange County? Hardly any traffic there. I'm assuming the South Bay Expressway will be the same.

[jksouthbay88]

Well if the Toll Roads in OC are hardly used come on picture the SBE.Nothing but middle class people who aren't willing to pay 4 bucks to shave 10 mins.Speaking of shaving 10 mins,those people on the news that are like"it will save me 5/10 mins?"Those people are idiots!!!You can't manage 20 more mins of your time to save 8,9,10 dollars?That's sad;go on and waste your money on a stupid toll road.As for the mall thing,a lot of those stores are already closed.But they are being replaced by the same type of "we don't have that kind of money down here store".The FILA store lasted 3 and a half months!!!The dining and moves will do but shopping?Doesn't fly.Been there about 15 times,never bought anything.I just go to walk around and wonder"What a big waste of money and space."

[Sassberto]

Originally Posted by jksouthbay88

Speaking of shaving 10 mins,those people on the news that are like"it will save me 5/10 mins?"Those people are idiots!!!You can't manage 20 more mins of your time to save 8,9,10 dollars?That's sad;go on and waste your money on a stupid toll road.

Don't take this the wrong way - but here is the secret why poor people stay poor and rich people get richer:

Time is money.

If I make 10 dollars an hour (16 cents a minute), then driving 20 minutes costs me 3.2 dollars. So paying 8 bucks to save 10 minutes nets me a loss of 6.40.

However, if I make 50/hr (83 cents a minute), a 20 minute drive costs me 16 dollars. So if I pay 8 bucks and half my commute time and save 8 dollars in time, I break even, If I can save more than 10 minutes, I start to make money on the deal.

The reason toll roads work in high-cost areas like NYC and Orange County (there are high-end housing developments around the 73) is because wealthy people take advantage of the time savings by using that saved time to make more money. Poor people tend to not perceive their time as valuable and as a result tend to waste it, or spend it on crap, like fancy clothes and rims for your car.

[Imperial1904]

Originally Posted by Sassberto

Don't take this the wrong way - but here is the secret why poor people stay poor and rich people get richer:

Time is money.

If I make 10 dollars an hour (16 cents a minute), then driving 20 minutes costs me 3.2 dollars. So paying 8 bucks to save 10 minutes nets me a loss of 6.40.

However, if I make 50/hr (83 cents a minute), a 20 minute drive costs me 16 dollars. So if I pay 8 bucks and half my commute time and save 8 dollars in time, I break even, If I can save more than 10 minutes, I start to make money on the deal.

The reason toll roads work in high-cost areas like NYC and Orange County (there are high-end housing developments around the 73) is because wealthy people take advantage of the time savings by using that saved time to make more money. Poor people tend to not perceive their time as valuable and tend to waste it with the intent of saving money.

That's a good point. I was going to say that SoCal freeway traffic is very unpredictable and if you can avoid sitting in traffic while wasting gas, the toll road is a good alternative.

[Sassberto]

Originally Posted by Imperial1904

That's a good point. I was going to say that SoCal freeway traffic is very unpredictable and if you can avoid sitting in traffic while wasting gas, the toll road is a good alternative.

Absolutely - add in the soaring costs of gas, not to mention wear on your car from traffic, and the numbers become more acute.

[jksouthbay88]

Yeah I can't take it the wrong way because I can't relate.You do a good job stating your case.

[jkoz]

Tip: Taking the toll road to westbound 905 DOES NOT save time if you are planning on traveling to the 805 and points further west. I tried it in mid afternoon (not rush hour). There is the still that few-mile span between the 125 and the 805 that you have on the other corridors with numerous stoplights and heavier traffic than East H, Otay or Olympic due to the border crossing down there, and more big rig traffic than cars. 905 does not get to freeway speeds until after you cross the 805, so you are sitting in more gridlock than you would taking the other routes.

[chulajuana]

Foolish people. Your gasoline taxes and motor vehicle registration fees have already paid for this road and then some, and now you're going to pay for it over and over again in inflated tolls?

Here's something to make you feel better about it: Mexicans driving cars bearing Mexican plates will get to use the road for free. That's right, and here's why: When a picture is taken of the license plates of their cars as they bust though the toll plazas and transponder readers the toll road operator will dutifully send a citation to the address associated with the license plate number according to state DMV files. But guess what? The Mexicans don't have accurate, much less automated motor vehicle registration information. And even if they did, they wouldn't share it with the hated gringos! So, you the US taxpayer will not only pay a toll to drive on a road your tax dollars have already paid for many times over, but you also get the privilege of subsidizing the tolls for our lawless, corrupt "neighbors" to the south!

Feel better about paying tolls on the South Bay Expressway yet ?

[tande1n5]

Hey, if it's clear because no one wants to use it and it's rush hour on the 805, I'll pay.

I do have to agree with the above poster though, (although I guess I'm an idiot for saying I'd use it)... I wish it was more like the Turnpike system back East... this is more about finding a lower traffic equilibrium by adding a dollar amount, where back east it saves money by privatizing some of the roads, and thus you only pay it when you use it, as opposed to giving too much tax money to the dept. of Transportation to do a crappy job maintaining them. Too late for that in CA with the huge network of roads around here, but it's a shame there aren't more toll roads in CA for this latter purpose.