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Your idea of a typical lifestyle is not what most people live. A lot of stuff can come out of there.
For example, I haven't had a car payment since 2003. I don't have credit card fees because I won't open an account that has one with so many no fee options available.
You also have tuition for kids in there. Well, first of all, the poster doesn't have kids, and most people don't pay tuition for their kids because they send them to public schools.
Food, shelter, and clothing. If you have those three things, you can live.
Now, do you want more than that? Well, then, that's something you have to budget for.
But clearly, tuition for private school is not a necessity. Car payments aren't, either.
I totally agree with this. I've had this debate in a different thread with earlyretirement. Obviously, where you stand depends on where you sit. Since earlyretirement's location is Santaluz and he is probably in early retirement, I'm sure his typical lifestyle is far from typical. I agree that food, shelter, and clothing are the 3 main necessities. Then you rank the rest of the desire expense, and see what you can spend on with the remaining income. Also, most of the things on his list would change much between different city. So, instead of trying to find out what other people's expenses are, we should ask, how much he/she currently spend on housing and what would be the desired sample location. Then we can see if those two matches up. Not everyone is a saver. So, just because you're not a saver in NY doesn't mean you shouldn't move to SD because you won't be able to save.
I totally agree with this. I've had this debate in a different thread with earlyretirement. Obviously, where you stand depends on where you sit. Since earlyretirement's location is Santaluz and he is probably in early retirement, I'm sure his typical lifestyle is far from typical. I agree that food, shelter, and clothing are the 3 main necessities. Then you rank the rest of the desire expense, and see what you can spend on with the remaining income. Also, most of the things on his list would change much between different city. So, instead of trying to find out what other people's expenses are, we should ask, how much he/she currently spend on housing and what would be the desired sample location. Then we can see if those two matches up. Not everyone is a saver. So, just because you're not a saver in NY doesn't mean you shouldn't move to SD because you won't be able to save.
Sure, I know my situation is different than many people. But when I give advice it's objective advice that would apply to many people. Trust me...I have tons of friends in San Diego across a wide spectrum of situations. I know my situation is unique but it's still objective.
The reason I detail out the long list is because many people don't want to take the time to think about all the categories they spend in or leave them off. I'm NOT saying they apply to everyone (especially single people with no kids). In case you couldn't figure it out, I'm copying/pasting the list each time.
Yes, I totally agree with you that "not everyone is a saver". But it's still wise to take into account of exactly what goes out and what goes in. That's my main point.
Your idea of a typical lifestyle is not what most people live. A lot of stuff can come out of there.
For example, I haven't had a car payment since 2003. I don't have credit card fees because I won't open an account that has one with so many no fee options available.
You also have tuition for kids in there. Well, first of all, the poster doesn't have kids, and most people don't pay tuition for their kids because they send them to public schools.
Food, shelter, and clothing. If you have those three things, you can live.
Now, do you want more than that? Well, then, that's something you have to budget for.
But clearly, tuition for private school is not a necessity. Car payments aren't, either.
Nope. I never said my lifestyle is the "typical lifestyle". So you are wrong there. And I copy/pasted the list. My point is to know EXACTLY what goes out each month. Obviously the things on my list for kids wouldn't apply to anyone that doesn't have kids.
But the plain fact remains that the vast majority of people out there want to do more than "just live". I think it's safe to say it's smart to plan for more than "food, shelter and clothing". LOL.
Sure, I know my situation is different than many people. But when I give advice it's objective advice that would apply to many people. Trust me...I have tons of friends in San Diego across a wide spectrum of situations. I know my situation is unique but it's still objective.
The reason I detail out the long list is because many people don't want to take the time to think about all the categories they spend in or leave them off. I'm NOT saying they apply to everyone (especially single people with no kids). In case you couldn't figure it out, I'm copying/pasting the list each time.
Yes, I totally agree with you that "not everyone is a saver". But it's still wise to take into account of exactly what goes out and what goes in. That's my main point.
I don't disagree that it's wise to know what one's expense and income each month. But it's the internet after all. People won't tell you their entire budget. So, we can only assume they are handling it. It's not like they're asking, how can I save more money or why I can't save money. Besides the neighborhood information, the rest of the information can be found very easily, like taxes and what not. If someone decide to move there, there's a reason why they want to leave where they're at and why they chose here. We have to assume they at least do their own diligence in term of taxes and income difference.
I know you're copying and pasting the list. But is it really worth doing it? I don't see how it's relevant to the question of moving to SD? After all, is life insurance and dining out going to change as you move between cities? I would hope people want to maintain the same living standard. They just need to know what kind of housing cost they're looking at. I think it's more constructive to ask them what's their budget for housing and go from there. Instead of giving them a list of possible expense. That list of expense exist regardless of if they move to SD or NYC.
Nope. I never said my lifestyle is the "typical lifestyle". So you are wrong there. And I copy/pasted the list. My point is to know EXACTLY what goes out each month. Obviously the things on my list for kids wouldn't apply to anyone that doesn't have kids.
But the plain fact remains that the vast majority of people out there want to do more than "just live". I think it's safe to say it's smart to plan for more than "food, shelter and clothing". LOL.
There is where you're wrong. If the vast majority of people out there want to do more than "just live", then we wouldn't have the abysmal savings rate or the abysmal 401k savings. Fact is, most people are living pay check to pay check. All they can do is "just live".
If everyone knows what EXACTLY goes out each month and actually care to do something about it, we wouldn't have the savings rate we do today. So, do you think regurgitating a canned list will somehow get someone who don't care to start caring about their budget? BTW, there are a VAST group of people, I would dare say they're the majority who can ONLY afford food, shelter, and clothing.
There is where you're wrong. If the vast majority of people out there want to do more than "just live", then we wouldn't have the abysmal savings rate or the abysmal 401k savings. Fact is, most people are living pay check to pay check. All they can do is "just live".
If everyone knows what EXACTLY goes out each month and actually care to do something about it, we wouldn't have the savings rate we do today. So, do you think regurgitating a canned list will somehow get someone who don't care to start caring about their budget? BTW, there are a VAST group of people, I would dare say they're the majority who can ONLY afford food, shelter, and clothing.
I totally agree with you that the savings rates are terrible overall for the masses. But in many cases it's simply not because they don't make enough. It's because they simply spend everything that comes in.
I wouldn't call what I'm posting "regurgitating a canned list". And it's baby steps. Yes, if people take the time to put everything down it will help. If you don't like my posts/advice or don't find them useful just skip over them or ignore them.
What I've found with many people is they ask for advice on moving to San Diego, they don't have a clear picture of the cost of living or the economy or job market here. You tell them something they don't want to hear and they get a bit grumpy. With my posts I'll always tell it as I see it is and be objective in nature with my advice.
Yes, it is "worth it" for me to do it. And many have PM'ed me to tell me that it really helped get them thinking. Many people DON'T want to take the time to figure out EXACTLY what goes out and that is an essential, basic thing you MUST do when thinking about making a move to San Diego.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with starting from a template, and tailoring it to meet one's own situation. It's a behavior pattern that sensible peoeple follow every day. So to those who are drama-queening over a "not typical" list, you're not being helpful. You're just being a distraction.
I don't disagree that it's wise to know what one's expense and income each month. But it's the internet after all. People won't tell you their entire budget. So, we can only assume they are handling it. It's not like they're asking, how can I save more money or why I can't save money. Besides the neighborhood information, the rest of the information can be found very easily, like taxes and what not. If someone decide to move there, there's a reason why they want to leave where they're at and why they chose here. We have to assume they at least do their own diligence in term of taxes and income difference.
I know you're copying and pasting the list. But is it really worth doing it? I don't see how it's relevant to the question of moving to SD? After all, is life insurance and dining out going to change as you move between cities? I would hope people want to maintain the same living standard. They just need to know what kind of housing cost they're looking at. I think it's more constructive to ask them what's their budget for housing and go from there. Instead of giving them a list of possible expense. That list of expense exist regardless of if they move to SD or NYC.
Because it is the internet after all and everyone posts under an alias, I think a more pertinent question is why not share expenses as it might relate to living here?
Like oddstray said, sharing a template of finances going in/out is a pretty sensible behavior pattern. The point of a public forum is to pick and choose if it applies to your situation or not. Keep in mind there are probably more readers reading that dont contribute than those that do. I am sure someone will learn something and think about it a little differently.
As far as the OP, I would stay away from Spain unless you have some deep connections there. I have a very good friend that was killing it in real estate in BCN and MAD several years ago and left about 2.5 years ago when things started to collapse. She headed back to the UK (not that much is better there) and hasnt looked back since.
She told me it was like someone hit the pause button on any type of activity and its at a complete standstill in terms of economy (hiring, purchasing etc)
Definitely if you can use your connections here to land a job, IMHO in plain terms of just getting to these shores, is a tremendous jump to the front of the line. However I am not sure you will find a European feel for MAYBE some parts of La Jolla. SD is just designed for the automobile for the most part vs horse and carriage
There are plenty of smallish village centres like found in South Park, but SD is not really a live/work city in the sense of a major intl city. I dont have data but its far more likely even downtown, that people commute outside the area they live to get to work.
Because it is the internet after all and everyone posts under an alias, I think a more pertinent question is why not share expenses as it might relate to living here?
Like oddstray said, sharing a template of finances going in/out is a pretty sensible behavior pattern. The point of a public forum is to pick and choose if it applies to your situation or not. Keep in mind there are probably more readers reading that dont contribute than those that do. I am sure someone will learn something and think about it a little differently.
Exactly. Very few people post their real names on these message boards. I HAVE seen it a few times but it's not common. So there really aren't any privacy issues in place. I agree with Shmoov, "why not share"? The reason I post that long list is it forces people to really sit down and put together how much they spend.
Many people don't take the time to put together everything they spend. And you know what? Many people do NOT want to take the time to sit down and actually put on paper what they spend in each category because it might depress them.
And the other reason I think is because they don't want people poking holes into their claimed budgets of what little they spend.
I do a LOT of consulting and typically what always helps is when I force my clients to put on paper these types of things. Because by doing it, it really forces them to understand everything.
Yep, as Shmoov mentioned, the vast majority of people are lurkers and don't post so my aim is to help them and provide them with some objective advice as well.
Obviously if you want to "just live" and only worry about food, clothing and shelter than that's your business and you can ignore much of my advice. But there is MUCH more to real world living than food, clothing and shelter.
thanks for all the info and the banter back and forth.
Question for you all, are there people that commute from San Diego to LA or Long Beach? I'm sure there are but those people must be making six figures I would assume to make a commute like that no? I ask because for my field has much more opportunities in LA/Long Beach(due to Long Beach Port and LAX) but I'd much rather be living in San Diego than any one of those places.
Is mass transit still as bad as I've heard? Or have they made substantial improvements?
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