Anyone here ever live in the NYC metro region? How does COL compare (taking Sunshine Tax into account) (San Diego: best cities, real estate)

[Shaolin Shadowboxing]

which place is better to be middle class in?

[sfosyd]

Absolutely no comparison. In my opinion, the NYC area is by far better for the middle class.

San Diego offers good weather but it is incredibly expensive and the salaries are ridiculously depressed unless you are in a niche industry like Biotech or Hardware. It is particularly rough right now because of the recent Qualcomm layoffs, and in almost all cases you have the added expense and hassle of having to maintain a car.

My personal situation:

I bought a co-op in Jackson Heights, Queens for 120k about 5 years ago. Units now go for around 180k. It is nice and livable, 1000 sq feet, great neighborhood, 20 minutes by train to my office in Midtown where I am easily able to make well over 150k in a technology job that offers flexibility and great benefits. I feel like with my skill set I could easily find another job in the NYC area, albeit maybe not one that lets me work from SD 3 months a year.

There is NO way I could find this setup in San Diego. I'd be *lucky* if the salary was half that and the real estate cost would be close to double. California income tax would be more than New York and City tax combined.

My situation is unique but even for a family, the schools seem so much better in the tri-state area, and there are many more options in Jersey and other places for housing and jobs. A rundown single family home in SD, far from the beach, in a decent school district starts at 500k.

[CNYC]

Native NY'er here just moved to SD 7 months ago.

I wouldn't go back to NYC for anything. I was dying to get out of there.

Here I am middle class. There it was never going to happen.

Once you get your housing and transportation together in SD it can be as cheap or expensive as you want it to be. NYC is a different animal. You are ALWAYS overpaying for EVERYTHING down to the sandwich you buy for lunch.

As a single person living in NYC I'd say you need at least 150k a year and you still would not be middle class...maybe lower middle class. Eat your meals at home and be spend thrifty then you might feel better about yourself.

The rent for a *** 1 bedroom apartment in Manhattan gets you a *****HOUSE in SD.

SD doesn't offer much in the jobs department. That is the only setback for some people.

You will love NYC for the first year then you will HATE IT.

[Shaolin Shadowboxing]

Originally Posted by CNYC

Native NY'er here just moved to SD 7 months ago.

I wouldn't go back to NYC for anything. I was dying to get out of there.

Here I am middle class. There it was never going to happen.

Once you get your housing and transportation together in SD it can be as cheap or expensive as you want it to be. NYC is a different animal. You are ALWAYS overpaying for EVERYTHING down to the sandwich you buy for lunch.

As a single person living in NYC I'd say you need at least 150k a year and you still would not be middle class...maybe lower middle class. Eat your meals at home and be spend thrifty then you might feel better about yourself.

The rent for a *** 1 bedroom apartment in Manhattan gets you a *****HOUSE in SD.

SD doesn't offer much in the jobs department. That is the only setback for some people.

You will love NYC for the first year then you will HATE IT.

though i think you're exaggerating a bit, i am from the NYC area and do agree to an extent on most of what you said.

[RosieSD]

As long as you're not planning to live in Manhattan - which is the most expensive city in the country - the purchase price of a single family home in the NY metro area can be comparable to San Diego. However, you have to add in high property and school board taxes, and these are going to be much higher than San Diego in many areas of the metro area. The cost of heating an older single family home can also add on costs quickly.

So, I think it is really difficult to say from a pure cost of living comparison that the NY metro area is a better middle class place than San Diego.

It really comes down to other factors based on the individual and family. For instance, for certain careers, the place to be is really NY. I also agree that families with children are likely to find more communities with great schools in NY (although, again, you'll pay for those schools in school board fees). Some people prefer better weather and year round outdoor activities, and San Diego is a better fit. There is something to be said for not having to worry about the weather. Others prefer all the cultural activities that NYC offers (and San Diego will never come close to those). Again, it all depends on how you envision a "middle class" lifestyle and where you choose to live in the two places.

I lived my entire life in the NYC metro area before I moved to San Diego. I still miss certain things about NY (still haven't found decent bagels or pizza here). But, I am happy with the middle class lifestyle we have here in East County SD, and wouldn't move back to NY if I was going to leave the San Diego area.

[sfosyd]

Originally Posted by CNYC

SD doesn't offer much in the jobs department. That is the only setback for some people.

The OP asked specifically about being middle class. To me, this indicates that jobs and wages are important.

San Diego just doesn't have a lot of good paying jobs, especially compared to NYC, and it's pretty much across the board except for some niche industries.

Yes, Manhattan rent is MUCH higher than San Diego rent. Yes, property taxes and sandwiches are higher. But it is much, much easier to make 150k in New York than San Diego, again across the board.

Unfortunately, in both San Diego and the New York metro area (not Manhattan), in my opinion, 150k is the minimum for what most of us define as middle class. And this doesn't include folks who bought their home 20 years ago (though for folks who did, San Diego is incredibly affordable because of prop 13 and this is why the schools generally suck as well).

Now if you don't need to work, or have a remote job where you can live anywhere, San Diego is a great place to live!

[skeke]

I can only tell you my daughter and son-in-law who live in LA (cost of living comparable to San Diego) looked in the New York City but said their friends there were paying a fortune for a postage stamp sized apartment and decided to stay in LA. They both work in the entertainment industry so New York or LA are the best cities of choice for those professions. LA won out due to housing costs in New York City.

[someguy10]

Originally Posted by sfosyd

My personal situation:

I bought a co-op in Jackson Heights, Queens for 120k about 5 years ago. Units now go for around 180k. It is nice and livable, 1000 sq feet, great neighborhood, 20 minutes by train to my office in Midtown where I am easily able to make well over 150k in a technology job that offers flexibility and great benefits. I feel like with my skill set I could easily find another job in the NYC area, albeit maybe not one that lets me work from SD 3 months a year.

There is NO way I could find this setup in San Diego. I'd be *lucky* if the salary was half that and the real estate cost would be close to double. California income tax would be more than New York and City tax combined.

So do you spend 3 winter months in SD working remotely? What are you doing for lodging those three months?

[sfosyd]

Originally Posted by someguy10

So do you spend 3 winter months in SD working remotely? What are you doing for lodging those three months?

I bought a condo downtown (foreclosure) in 2009...it's been a fantastic investment!

[Shaolin Shadowboxing]

Originally Posted by sfosyd

I bought a condo downtown (foreclosure) in 2009...it's been a fantastic investment!

living the dream. jealous!