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Old 01-28-2012, 01:13 AM
 
Location: Police State
1,472 posts, read 1,850,097 times
Reputation: 1225

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Quote:
Originally Posted by evergraystate View Post
If we eliminated BART completely tomorrow, hardly anyone would notice. As a mass transit system BART is a complete failure.
This is absurd. You think the 580 and 80 freeways are messy now at rush hour? Imagine if BART was no more. It'd be even worse than the 405 through L.A.
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Old 01-28-2012, 08:57 AM
 
Location: Zurich, Switzerland/ Piedmont, CA
30,800 posts, read 49,186,293 times
Reputation: 13713
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZhugeLiang View Post
This is absurd. You think the 580 and 80 freeways are messy now at rush hour? Imagine if BART was no more. It'd be even worse than the 405 through L.A.
Yep, we'd have the worst traffic in the country without BART. People are crazy to think that BART has little impact. Seriously what foolishness.
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Old 01-28-2012, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
24,949 posts, read 24,733,082 times
Reputation: 22660
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
I'm really curious to where you are getting this from because I've seen you say it before but I don't see how you come to this conclusion based on data. Based on people entering stations, far more people enter through stations outside of the city of Oakland than within. From the data I've seen a little over 60,000 people enter stations in Oakland. Over 130,000 enter stations outside of Oakland not including SF. Most BART boarding originate outside of Oakland.

http://www.bart.gov/docs/StationProf...Report_web.pdf

I read it somewhere and can't seem to find it again. One of these days I'll remember where I read it! (Or the exact phrase so I can google it.)

Unfortunately I remember almost everything I read. Completely disconnected from its source.
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Old 01-28-2012, 01:02 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
14,474 posts, read 22,118,042 times
Reputation: 7969
Quote:
Originally Posted by 18Montclair View Post
Yep, we'd have the worst traffic in the country without BART. People are crazy to think that BART has little impact. Seriously what foolishness.
In what situation would you ever just remove a transit system like BART permanently? That is what I find foolish about this scenario people keep bringing up, it would never occur. But of course to suggest their would be no impact on the Bay Area if that did actually happen is equally absurd. Transportation and land are inherently intertwined, one clearly affects the other and vice versa. The Bay Area would not have developed the way it did without BART. Some of you act like if BART had never been built then traffic would be as if you had just removed BART from the Bay Area as it exists today. That simply is not true as the Bay Area would have developed much differently without a system like BART in place.

Yes BART is an integral and essential part of the region and could not function without it but it's not as if travel times would be triple if BART had never been built. The Bay Area would likely be far different w/o a system like BART. Likely more/wider freeways, less population/density, more spread out, more employment centers in the suburbs, etc..

Last edited by sav858; 01-28-2012 at 01:37 PM..
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Old 01-28-2012, 03:25 PM
 
5,956 posts, read 2,826,750 times
Reputation: 3114
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
In what situation would you ever just remove a transit system like BART permanently? That is what I find foolish about this scenario people keep bringing up, it would never occur. But of course to suggest their would be no impact on the Bay Area if that did actually happen is equally absurd. Transportation and land are inherently intertwined, one clearly affects the other and vice versa. The Bay Area would not have developed the way it did without BART. Some of you act like if BART had never been built then traffic would be as if you had just removed BART from the Bay Area as it exists today. That simply is not true as the Bay Area would have developed much differently without a system like BART in place.

Yes BART is an integral and essential part of the region and could not function without it but it's not as if travel times would be triple if BART had never been built. The Bay Area would likely be far different w/o a system like BART. Likely more/wider freeways, less population/density, more spread out, more employment centers in the suburbs, etc..
So, in some ways, more like L.A.?
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Old 01-28-2012, 03:32 PM
 
Location: anywhere but Seattle
1,082 posts, read 1,609,966 times
Reputation: 964
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZhugeLiang View Post
This is absurd. You think the 580 and 80 freeways are messy now at rush hour? Imagine if BART was no more. It'd be even worse than the 405 through L.A.
A bay area wide commuter bus system would easily absorb the BART riders at a fraction of the cost while at the same time serving many more destinations. Maybe we could start a state wide ballot initiative to shut down BART. I'm sure our friends in southern California would be more than happy to vote for it.
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Old 01-28-2012, 05:43 PM
 
172 posts, read 200,246 times
Reputation: 307
I don't think you will get even 100 people to sign it.

How old are you?
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Old 01-28-2012, 06:55 PM
 
Location: California
28,757 posts, read 29,018,258 times
Reputation: 23537
Quote:
Originally Posted by evergraystate View Post
A bay area wide commuter bus system would easily absorb the BART riders at a fraction of the cost while at the same time serving many more destinations. Maybe we could start a state wide ballot initiative to shut down BART. I'm sure our friends in southern California would be more than happy to vote for it.
Exactly how many buses will be stacked up on each other during rush hour?
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Old 01-28-2012, 07:43 PM
 
Location: Police State
1,472 posts, read 1,850,097 times
Reputation: 1225
Quote:
Originally Posted by evergraystate View Post
A bay area wide commuter bus system would easily absorb the BART riders at a fraction of the cost while at the same time serving many more destinations. Maybe we could start a state wide ballot initiative to shut down BART. I'm sure our friends in southern California would be more than happy to vote for it.
LMFAO.

Dude, we're done. I tried to take you seriously. You're so far removed from reality that a productive discussion with you just isn't possible.
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Old 01-28-2012, 08:28 PM
 
798 posts, read 946,561 times
Reputation: 739
Quote:
Originally Posted by evergraystate View Post
A bay area wide commuter bus system would easily absorb the BART riders at a fraction of the cost while at the same time serving many more destinations. Maybe we could start a state wide ballot initiative to shut down BART. I'm sure our friends in southern California would be more than happy to vote for it.
You don't know what you're talking about. How many buses do you think it would take to replace even a single BART train during rush hour? Then multiply that by the number of trains. We're talking about hundreds of additional buses on the freeways.
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