Has BART become a Bay Area tax grab? Anyone tired of it? (Fresno: taxes, price)

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jade408

I think that AC transit did make some improvements with the route consolidation process and they took community input. The problem is that service cuts decreased overall service quality. The solution is to increase frequency on many lines (obviously this is expensive).

They are fairly responsive to comments. For example, during one of the proposed service cuts, they were going to cut one of the AM P runs so the last one was at like 8:20. They added back the 9a run, and not that is the last one. They also extended the 11 by an hour. And adjusted the timing of the 57 in the evenings so it is timed with BART from SF or close enough...where at least you don't see it pulling off as you leave the fare gate. You now have around 4 minutes to get from the platform to the stop. :P

The real thing is, at a time when transit ridership is increasing, they have lower access to money and keep needing to cut. They totally screwed up the 57 route though. It used to end at Bay Street. And now it stops at San Pablo, even though it should serve the ginormous strip mall. No AC transit routes serve Target or Bay Street any more directly.

They can't decide what to do with the 57. Back in the day it ended at 40th and San Pablo. They extended it when Emeryville was built up. they should have continued it. I was here in 2006-2007 when it went there. Problem is, no one rode it because the Emery-Go-Round is free.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

That was a problem with whichever 51 it was that served Rockridge BART. Also, there didn't seem to be any night service from Rockridge BART. Or it was so infrequent, I'd give up and get a cab.

And they cut service because the local transit authority decided to support BART instead?

I'd say not directly. Let's say that MTC (the regional transit commission) prioritizes BART projects and deprioritizes projects that revolve around buses and other agencies. They put in more effort to het BART to money it needs for operations and capital projects. They are also well connected to the regional political machine and have a lot of influence.

At the same time BART had plenty of money to expand, AC Transit had to contract.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

That was a problem with whichever 51 it was that served Rockridge BART. Also, there didn't seem to be any night service from Rockridge BART. Or it was so infrequent, I'd give up and get a cab.

And they cut service because the local transit authority decided to support BART instead?

Both 51's today serve Rockridge BART. They both end there.

I think that's what Jade is saying and I agree with her after having seen in two different metro areas priority for rail service. This is more pronounced here in the Bay Area and most obvious in the East Bay. BART went for many years without even hinting at extending service. Now every line but the Richmond line has been extended or had another line branch off of it. There are at least ideas of going to the very outer reaches of the Bay Area by considering extensions to Brentwood and Livermore.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

They can't decide what to do with the 57. Back in the day it ended at 40th and San Pablo. They extended it when Emeryville was built up. they should have continued it. I was here in 2006-2007 when it went there. Problem is, no one rode it because the Emery-Go-Round is free.

True. But now that Target opened, I think more people who are not originating on BART might want to take a bus over to E-ville. Like Cal students. It seems weird. And or let's say people who live in Adam's Point. It seems odd that no AC transit route serves any of the e-ville shopping areas when e-ville is solidly in the district. The 57 could easily turn around at Hollis and 40th, and that would only add what 4 blocks to the route and make it infinitely more useful.

[Senno]

Originally Posted by DocGoldstein

My source is public record. As a PUBLICLY FUNDED company, they have to release this information. Seriously, call BART and they will e-mail you the same info I have. Heck, google it, it's probably online. They don't have to release WHY these thieves deserve a $130,000 bonus.

No one oversees BART! That's the thing.

Who oversees the Russian Mafia?

Who oversees the Yakuza?

Who oversees the Triads?

Actually I think they do have to reveal why.

The Sunshine Act contains the magic word BROADLY in several places. Thus I argue that in pursuit of why those bonuses were awarded, that the question is reasonable and should be answered. It's as simple as Who, what, when, where, why, and how really.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Califor...ition_59_(2004)

California Public Records Act - Sunshine Review

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jade408

True. But now that Target opened, I think more people who are not originating on BART might want to take a bus over to E-ville. Like Cal students. It seems weird. And or let's say people who live in Adam's Point. It seems odd that no AC transit route serves any of the e-ville shopping areas when e-ville is solidly in the district. The 57 could easily turn around at Hollis and 40th, and that would only add what 4 blocks to the route and make it infinitely more useful.

Completely agree. When I lived over on Moss I'd take the 57 then get off at the BART station and wait for the EGR. My destinations tend to be the Best Buy and Guitar Center there. Figures they've move the GC to Emeryville from El Cerrito now that I'm in Richmond

[jade408]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

Both 51's today serve Rockridge BART. They both end there.

I think that's what Jade is saying and I agree with her after having seen in two different metro areas priority for rail service. This is more pronounced here in the Bay Area and most obvious in the East Bay. BART went for many years without even hinting at extending service. Now every line but the Richmond line has been extended or had another line branch off of it. There are at least ideas of going to the very outer reaches of the Bay Area by considering extensions to Brentwood and Livermore.

Exactly. For example, there is chatter about a "San Antonio BART station"
Message to Bart: Build a San Antonio Station | 21st Century Urban Solutions
San Antonio Bart Station | 21st Century Urban Solutions

This sums it up pretty well:

BART’s suburban majority will keep focusing on projects that serve the suburbs… if they don’t they’ll just be voted out and replaced by someone who will.
But, that doesn’t mean that all urban projects are necessarily out. They just needed to be billed in a light that’s more attractive to the suburban BART rider/voter...........

Geary BART: “Sounds boring. Isn’t Geary near all the drug addicts in the Tenderloin? No way, give us BART to Tracy!!!”
BART to Golden Gate Park: “OMG that would be so great! I never go to Golden Gate Park on weekends because it takes me two hours to drive there, but now I can just hop on in Lafayette and be there in no time! DeYoung here I come!”
San Antonio Station: “Where is San Antonio? Texas? Oh it’s in Oakland? Sounds like a place I wouldn’t want to go, since it’s not the airport, the coliseum, or Emeryville.”
Estuary Station: “Ooooo sounds environmental! Will I get to see sea otters and whales?”
Albany Station: “Well, I guess.”
Solano Ave/Albany: “How North Berkeley! I’ve read about it in the Chronicle’s ‘Yuppie’ section!”

Now the projections for that hypothetical station would easily have a feeder area within 1-2 miles that is among the densest in the Bay, and would likely hit the daily boarding of any of the far flung stations in suburbia, without planning for any population growth or change.

Of course there are also the ideas of BART to Jack London. And BART to Albany.... none of these have any serious consideration. But I am sure BART to Tracy isn't too far off. And BART to Gilroy will happen before BART to 98th Ave.

Here are some proposed good ideas:
What BART Should Look Like in 2030. | Wilshire/Vermont

[Ruth4Truth]

BART already goes to Solano. The El Cerrito BART station's right there.

Outer Geary definitely needs a BART station. But once you build that, people will want one to the beach.

San Antonio?? Where tf is that? We're building BART to Texas, now?? (jk) These extensions will never end. Pretty soon, we'll have BART going to Redding. Well, maybe not "pretty soon", but "eventually".

People can go to GG park on BART to SF, then muni. What's wrong with people, they want door-to-door service? Why not combine transport systems the old-fashioned way? I always go to GG park by taking BART, then Muni. It's not that big a deal. I catch a Geary Limited, which gets out there a lot faster than any other bus.

[jade408]

Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth

San Antonio?? Where tf is that? We're building BART to Texas, now?? (jk) These extensions will never end. Pretty soon, we'll have BART going to Redding. Well, maybe not "pretty soon", but "eventually".

It is right between Lake Merrit BART and Fruitvale BART. Also near the bridges to Alameda. And the proposed huge Oak to Ninth development in Oakland. Pretty much a perfect infill station. Even if it has a big parking lot!

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by jade408

Exactly. For example, there is chatter about a "San Antonio BART station"
Message to Bart: Build a San Antonio Station | 21st Century Urban Solutions
San Antonio Bart Station | 21st Century Urban Solutions

This sums it up pretty well:


Now the projections for that hypothetical station would easily have a feeder area within 1-2 miles that is among the densest in the Bay, and would likely hit the daily boarding of any of the far flung stations in suburbia, without planning for any population growth or change.

Of course there are also the ideas of BART to Jack London. And BART to Albany.... none of these have any serious consideration. But I am sure BART to Tracy isn't too far off. And BART to Gilroy will happen before BART to 98th Ave.

Here are some proposed good ideas:
What BART Should Look Like in 2030. | Wilshire/Vermont

Don't even get me started again on that BART Geary thing. Muni runs double long buses on the 38/38L line every 3 minutes. They are always packed throughout the day often standing room only. Golden Gate park would be convenient but the 5 does the McAllister/Fulton corridor and it really isn't that busy. Not only will there no San Antonio station but it will continue to fly through that area at 70 mph.