New York : Jersey city as SF : ?? (San Francisco, Oakland: to rent, low crime, mortgage)

[04kL4nD]

And better weather. And less issues with parking.

[ArthurDent]

Ok, so hypothetically here is a house near Grand Ave. presumably that's Grand Lake area?
476 Cheney Ave, Oakland, CA 94610 is For Sale - Zillow
What do we do about the fact that the schools are rated 2 and 5?

[mrazyattic]

Originally Posted by ArthurDent

Having just hit the ground here, the only areas we would consider similar in terms of being able to lead an urban walk-centered life are Noe Valley/Castro/Bernal Heights, Mission, North Potrero Hill, Telegraph/Russian/Nob Hills and SOMA north. Most of these are insanely expensive with very few properties on the market.

Lamorinda and the Peninsula from Burlingame to Daly City are nice suburban areas but the notion of using a car only on weekends here is laughable.

Haven't been to Oakland yet; we are renting short term in Mission Terrace, but overall this is not looking very promising...

And you won't find anything. Maybe in 15-20 years in Oakland - but other than that, the bay area is a laughable joke when it comes to being truly urban. Come at me bros!!

[jade408]

Originally Posted by ArthurDent

Ok, so hypothetically here is a house near Grand Ave. presumably that's Grand Lake area?
476 Cheney Ave, Oakland, CA 94610 is For Sale - Zillow
What do we do about the fact that the schools are rated 2 and 5?

High schools in Oakland are pretty hit or miss today. Elementary schools are decent and improving around 15-20% year over year for almost the past decade now. Particularly in the more walkable areas. So it is up to you. If you don't have kids now by the time you have then the neighborhood schools will like be really good. That's happened in the Glenview, Dimond and Laurel over the past 7ish years and Grand Lake is a little behind those areas in terms of family amenities. You can look a little further from that area and pay more for Trestle Glen and Crocker Highlands which I believe feed into different schools. You can get less space in Rockridge and feed into today's good elementary schools.

But CA schools are among the worst in the country. You need to pay a lot to buy in a good school district and few would meet your walkable requirements in the entire state.

In the Bay Area you need to pick two out of three: schools, location, home quality/size. Unless you are really really really well-off.

[04kL4nD]

Originally Posted by mrazyattic

And you won't find anything. Maybe in 15-20 years in Oakland - but other than that, the bay area is a laughable joke when it comes to being truly urban. Come at me bros!!

Sigh. Please look up the definition of urban again.

[Gantz]

Originally Posted by 04kL4nD

*except for Berkeley and Oakland which clearly fit the definition of urban

Only maybe in small areas imo. Overall Jersey City is over two times more dense than Oakland, and the OP lived in the areas of Jersey City with densities that are comparable to SF itself. The areas OP comes from have 50 storey residential highrises as one of the main forms of housing.

[garyjohnyang]

Originally Posted by Gantz

Only maybe in small areas imo. Overall Jersey City is over two times more dense than Oakland, and the OP lived in the areas of Jersey City with densities that are comparable to SF itself. The areas OP comes from have 50 storey residential highrises as one of the main forms of housing.

This is still a misleading comparison. Jersey City is 21 square miles and Oakland is 78.

[ArthurDent]

Originally Posted by garyjohnyang

This is still a misleading comparison. Jersey City is 21 square miles and Oakland is 78.

Yes, but I am looking for one house, rather than buy the whole city. A couple of square miles will suffice. Will go to Oakland on the weekend...

South Beach would be the closest to the Jersey City waterfront.

[04kL4nD]

Originally Posted by Gantz

Only maybe in small areas imo. Overall Jersey City is over two times more dense than Oakland, and the OP lived in the areas of Jersey City with densities that are comparable to SF itself. The areas OP comes from have 50 storey residential highrises as one of the main forms of housing.

The livable/walkable parts of Oakland/Berkeley are dense enough. No, it's not Hong Kong, but that's not actually a bad thing.

[ArthurDent]

So we drove around parts of Oakland, Piedmont and Berkeley for a few weekends. Observations follow.

Places close to Grand or Lakeshore are walkable with good elementary schools, still not car free because you have to drive to Rockridge BART to get to work. (*) Houses close to Rockridge BART within Chabot school's borders sell within days of hitting the market for ~30% over asking, around $700/sq ft, which is almost SF prices.
(*) Yes there is casual carpool, but being mugged by strangers is not for us, thank you.

Piedmont schools are great. The best schools in Berkeley are 9, on a scale of 1 to 10. Oakland has a bunch that are good, but we are yet to figure out if there are any houses zoned for good elementary, middle AND high schools - so in Oakland, expect to move every 4 years.

To be fair, Jersey City schools are terrible. So asking for good public schools makes this a problem with no solution in NY metro as well as SF metro areas. Living in Orinda, CA or Piedmont, CA is like living in Short Hills, NJ - good schools, rich people, 45 min commute, prices through the roof.

Some links to see what the public schools are for any given address:
California school ratings by API scores: California School Ratings, rankings, test scores
Best schools in Oakland: California School Ratings, ranking, test scores - Search Results
School district borders in Oakland (PDFs of maps):Map Center & School Finder / Printable Maps
Online school finder by address:Map Center & School Finder / School Finder