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Old 01-29-2016, 04:35 PM
 
Location: where the good looking people are
3,817 posts, read 2,969,045 times
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Sc is basically a colder and more rural version of Venice Beach, IMO

 
Old 01-29-2016, 04:39 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
1,723 posts, read 1,254,419 times
Reputation: 1307
Quote:
Originally Posted by sav858 View Post
I agree, Santa Cruz is warmer than Monterey/Carmel. It faces south so it gets shielded from the cool Pacific winds/fog unlike most of our coast. Few places along the CA coastline face south like SC.
Thank you.
For me, the weather is ideal. Even when it's foggy. I love fog. Although i brought this up in another post .... scientists at UCSC measured mercury in the fog, This was on the Monterey Bay area but i imagine it's all along the coast but i haven't researched this yet.
The amounts are below what's considered harmful but i wonder about the accumulative effect.
And what's supposedly not harmful to humans may very well be harmful to other creature.

Last edited by blueskywalker; 01-29-2016 at 05:00 PM..
 
Old 01-29-2016, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
1,723 posts, read 1,254,419 times
Reputation: 1307
Quote:
Originally Posted by WizardOfRadical View Post
Sc is basically a colder and more rural version of Venice Beach, IMO
Unlike some other posters (and i'm not naming names) i can say, "i don't know".
I don't know Venice Beach. But i'll take your word for it if you do know it.
See y'all ... not that difficult to admit you don't know.
Or refrain from commenting when you don't know.
Kinda liberating actually. Check it out.

Last edited by blueskywalker; 01-29-2016 at 05:07 PM..
 
Old 01-29-2016, 05:45 PM
 
Location: Downtown SJ
176 posts, read 194,315 times
Reputation: 281
I love SC, if I won the lottery I'd move there. There are lots of really nice parts of town. People who only know downtown or the Boardwalk areas will say otherwise, but it just proves their ignorance. It's probably the best Mt biking region in all of Nor Cal, including Tahoe IMHO.
 
Old 01-29-2016, 05:56 PM
 
1 posts, read 490 times
Reputation: 16
"Where is a good area to consider that is walkable to town, close to the ocean, and as affordable as realistic."

Rather than got caught up in the discussion that precedes this, I'll go right back to your question, OP. ( I get Bluesky's point about people who are on autopilot with Santa Cruz hate and that is not my viewpoint).

As a FORMER longtime resident, I would highly recommend against this move. In 1995? Sure. Today? Not so much.

Commute: That commute is going to be a nightmare, any way you slice it. If you are the type who doesn't mind being a passenger for a while on winding mountain roads (you don't get carsick), then that van option MAY make it bearable. Keep in mind that location of van stops should be key in looking for a place. If you AREN'T a great passenger on winding mountain roads, then you should drive. If the job is really a great opportunity, I would live closer to Morgan Hill or Gilroy and visit the beach on weekends.

But if you are committed to doing this job AND living by the beach, then here is what you are in for: at LEAST an hour commute each way, assuming no traffic (ha!). If you go up and over on Highway 17, you will be plagued by bad weather, crazy drivers, mudslides, brake-stomping traffic jams, hit deer, etc. that routinely grind everything to a halt. Seriously one of the worst commutes in America... yet done by a lot of people who can not resist the lure of big Silicon Valley money while also living at the beach. Done it... never again. So if you REALLY want to do this job, I would highly recommend living further East in the County, like Capitola, Soquel, Aptos, or La Selva. Then you could go over Highway 152, ANOTHER awful commute... but slightly less awful than going 17 as there are less people doing it. Also heading towards 152 is reverse commute. 1 is a parking lot from the "Fishhook" (learn that term) in SC to Aptos most mornings. Completely write off Davenport, North Coast, Bonny Doon, Westside of Santa Cruz, any of those locations would be horrendously far.

Santa Cruz vs. East towns: Do not kid yourself about the level of crime and drug use in Santa Cruz proper (and Watsonville). Bluesky is apparently someone who is comfortable around that grunginess. Not everyone is. If you are uncomfortable around gangs, bike thieves, wandering meth addicts, needles lying around public places, and any number of things, then you will not feel comfortable in Santa Cruz these days. While crime has been an issue in Santa Cruz a LONG time, it was generally confined to a few rough areas. These days, it is much more geographically spread out. I know many people who live on streets filled with million dollar homes that cannot leave their car unlocked ONE NIGHT in their driveway as it will be rifled for change. The main park where youth sports are played borders old cemeteries that are ruled by homeless tweakers. The needle exchange, which was supposed to give out "1 clean for 1 dirty" instead followed a policy of "1 dirty for however many clean you want", so needles have been found all over town. There are people working hard to clean up these problems, but they are up against some fairly entrenched patterns in the town's political life.

Also, take a look at some of these numbers...

http://www.city-data.com/city/Santa-...alifornia.html

For comparison, the theft rate in 2013 in Santa Cruz was 3,811.8 per 100,000 people.

To give you an example you can relate to as a So Cal resident, the theft rate in Santa Ana was 1,250.7 per 100,000 people. In Compton, 1184.8. In San Bernardino, 1878. Starting to get the picture? Now, even the FBI cautions that their stats don't give a "full picture". But I think they say something, right?

Well, there must be a silver lining there, right, like low cost living due to the high property crime rate? Hold off on that...

Estimated median household income in 2013: $63,377
Estimated median house or condo value in 2013: $618,394

Ouch.

Also, I did a search the other day on a "competitor site that shall not be named" and could not find a standalone single family home in the city for under $600,000.

Or one can always rent... in the third most expensive rental market in the US.

Santa Cruz, California - America's most expensive rental markets - CNNMoney

Again... ouch. In other words, Santa Cruz is BOTH a high crime area with a large underclass while also being a rapidly gentrifying "new Malibu". Result for middle class? Not so hot.

So, East County... places like Capitola, Aptos, and Soquel all meet your desire for a) beach b) walkable town areas. However, you haven't told us your budget for rent or buying, so that makes it pretty hard to assess whether they are affordable. At least there, however, you may get somewhere safe, beautiful and walkable for your money. All three of those towns have cute, walkable, downtownish areas where you can get coffee, good meals, etc.

If you have a good amount of money, then these are wonderful places to live. However, many of the nicer areas are also ridiculously expensive. Also, despite the high level of property values and incomes, none of those towns are immune to the problems affecting the city of SC. Even "nice schools" like Aptos have significant gang and drug issues. There is significant ignorance and denial among the parents about this topic. Police, politicians, school officials, etc. are more aware, but like to keep things quiet on the surface and that plays into the parental denial. It's a vicious cycle. You didn't mention kids, but if you are considering it down the road, SC County may not be the most wholesome place to bring them up. However, you can generally avoid the worst of the stuff going down in Santa Cruz by living in Capitola/Aptos/Soquel.

Ocean: longtime surfer here... the water is WAY colder than OC year-round. It is bearable to jump into during summer, but not truly comfortable the way it is south of Point Concepcion. However, wetsuits and booties are a wonderful thing! I also like gloves. If you don't like wetsuits, then it's not the area for you. If you don't mind them, it's a surfing paradise! The East Side has plenty of breaks, some very crowded, some not so much. There is vibe in the water at the most popular breaks, but plenty of other breaks all over the county where you can have space. Less so these days, but I always found a place to surf and had ONE incident the entire time I surfed there. The ocean is a very good reason to move to Santa Cruz, in my opinion, but plenty of other people have the same idea, and you better weigh the issues that causes.

hope this helps, and good luck in whatever you decide!
 
Old 01-29-2016, 06:46 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
84,562 posts, read 77,728,732 times
Reputation: 85758
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueskywalker View Post
Actually Ruth4Truth .... Ummmmm .... where do i begin?

You may want to refrain from giving information about the Santa Cruz surf culture. They're a gnarly bunch and ya don't want to **** them off.

The Santa Cruz Surfing Museum is at Steamer Lane >>> West Cliff Drive! Steamer Lane is the most famous break in Santa Cruz and is known to all local and all true / hardcore surfers in Santa Cruz, in California and beyond.

You say, "The main beach in town, that's in a bay and is more protected, is where the surfing takes place". Which "main beach in town" are you referring to? The great (not to mention famous!) breaks in Santa Cruz (Steamer Lane and Pleasure Point to name 2 of the best known) have nothing to do with any beach! And much of the coast line of Santa Cruz is on the northern "edge" of the bay! Santa Cruz = Monterey Bay.

And though there are a few short beaches down from West Cliff, it is certainly not where the good beaches are in S.C. itself or in the county as a whole. Not at all!



To say that it is the "least sketchy area" in Santa Cruz is a false statement! Yes, there are some lovely (and very expensive) properties in that area but there are lovely and very expensive properties and neighborhoods throughout Santa Cruz and throughout the entire county (and many are much tonier and safer) that are as un-"sketchy" And i sure wouldn't want to live right on West Cliff Drive with the constant traffic, air pollution from that traffic, cruising going on, tourists, etc.. Way too frenetic.

And if you're referring to New Leaf Market (the one that you say is like Whole Foods but perish that thought! - Whole Foods is a corporate parasite) is not within walking distance nor are there lots of "corner markets scattered around there". Although you're so vague that i don't know what you mean when you say "there". Do you?
And since the o.p. is concerned about cost of living in the county, to guide her to that area is to misguide her. It's certainly not a place where inexpensive rentals (or expensive ones for that matter) abound.


And you say, "The closer you get to Mission St., the cheaper the rents, it looks to me, and the higher the student population. There's also a Safeway store off Mission. That whole area is in the SW corner of town. You can pull up a map to get an idea of the layout."

When you say above that, "It looks to me" .... well it's an indication that you're using the internet / looking at maps, etc.. to glean and then give information about a community that you clearly don't know or understand.
Santa Cruz is not a place that's easy to define with clear and obvious demarcations (with some exceptions ... like for example living in the Flats may not be wise) re; cost, crime, etc., etc.. It takes a long time to really get to know this of community. It's different than many other places in that regard.

Mission St. is a continuation of HWY1 coming from the north and there are lots and lots of businesses on Mission St. It's also a long street that varies re; businesses, neighborhoods, etc., on it and off of it and you can't make such a general statement about it. Well you can, but you'd be wrong.

But yes and yay .... there is a SafeWay on Mission St.!
I didn't say anything about SC surf culture, except to comment (in case the OP was interested in that, which we don't know) that most of the surfing takes place elsewhere than on the majority of W Cliff Dr., the part facing, um--west, which was the part of town I was discussing. Steamer Lane is on the bay, albeit near the edge.

Ah yes, "what bay" you ask. There is no bay, you protest, except Monterey Bay. It's not believable that you're not aware that most of Santa Cruz is on its own small bay that's in a corner of Monterey Bay. Its bay is celebrated by artists in the area, and is one of the favorite features of the town, enjoyed by visitors and residents alike. Entire businesses are oriented toward helping aficionados enjoy that beloved amenity. It simply isn't possible that you didn't know this basic fact about the town you claim to know so well. I can't imagine why you'd pretend you didn't.

I never suggested the OP look to live on West Cliff Dr. I don't know what you're talking about. I was directing her to a general part of town, notably absent of homeless and the kind of sketchiness one sees in certain other areas. Whether you agree or not, that is the part of town many people go to for renting or buying when they want a beautiful neighborhood, walkability/bikeability, amenities, beach/ocean/easy access to beautiful views, and a quiet, relatively safe environment in town. It is, indeed, one of the least sketchy parts of town. Your opinion may be otherwise, but that doesn't justify attacking another person's reasonable opinion.

New Leaf "isn't within walking distance" of what? Clearly, you missed the phrase, "depending on where you're located" [within that general area]. You also missed the phrase, "it's certainly bike-able". You'd save yourself a lot of agitation by reading more carefully. You also seem to have missed my statement about NL having started as a local co-op (in contrast to WF's corporate nature), followed by the comment that it's better than WF. You see? We're actually in agreement that NL is better than WF. The ambience, products and layout remind me of WF, though, which is what I meant. If one is looking for a healthy foods/organic grocer that carries the type of food and variety that WF does, NL is the best in SC, IMO. And their prepared foods are all made on location, rather than bought from a national supplier and trucked in, like at WF, so they're not full of fillers and sugars, unlike those at WF. I'm sure you would agree.

How could I possibly tell from a map where the lower rent areas are? Your criticisms don't make any sense. "It looks to me" means literally that: one can observe the lower-rent areas when passing through them. That area around NL and that section of Mission attracts students and other people on a tighter budget than elsewhere in that part of town. I also have relatives who graduated from UCSC a few years ago who have settled in that area as they get their careers off the ground, for it's relative affordability, the vibe, and the walkability. You seem to have an odd allergic reaction to the phrase, "it looks to me". You're projecting all manner of inappropriate things onto it. Chill, dude.

As to the mom/pop grocers in the general area, you must realize it would be absurd to have posted exact addresses or streets in a comment meant as a general orientation in response to the OP's interests. Sorry you're not aware of these conveniences in a town that you claim to know so well. Now you can have an adventure seeking them out, a sort of treasure hunt. Enjoy!

And last, but by no means least, re: your query as to which "main beach" I meant, it's called, "Main Beach" shocker! Were you not aware that the main beach in the town you claim to know so well was called Main Beach? back at'cha.

Your comments are ludicrous and petty, nit-picking, misguided and puzzlingly poorly-informed BS, my fellow SC enthusiast. If you were sincerely interested in contributing constructively to the thread and helping the OP, you would have posted about more affordable parts of town, locations of better beaches, your take on walkable neighborhoods, etc. But you didn't. The silence from you is deafening on that score, which speaks to the fact that your agenda is other than posting in good faith and being of help to the OP.

Last edited by Ruth4Truth; 01-29-2016 at 07:19 PM..
 
Old 01-29-2016, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
1,723 posts, read 1,254,419 times
Reputation: 1307
That's a good post EX831pat
Im not in denial about the challenging issues that S.C. faces. But there are so many people in S.C. that live good lives and that manage to deal with those difficult issues.
There is a lot of grunginess and yeah, i'm not uncomfortable with funkiness and grunginess. I am not however comfortable with people invading other peoples spaces and certainly that can be an issue.
Also, i lived in a big city for many years so those difficult city issues aren't new or daunting to me ... not ideal but i can deal.
There are many good neighborhoods throughout S.C. and the entire county but like you say, they aren't immune to crime. That said, i've lived all over the county for many years ... never had a negative issue with homeless, crime, etc..
And i've never known anyone (and i've known quite a few people here throughout my time here) who has had negative experiences with homeless folks, crime, drugs, etc..
And places that i've lived in both Soquel and Aptos (more rural) we didn't even lock our doors.
The county is so varied.
I just get tired of people demonizing a place that i love ... and many others love it too ... so much so that they tolerate the more difficult aspects of it.
Santa Cruz is like patchouli . It provokes very strong feelings in people and, generally speaking and from my experience, people either love it or they hate it. That's why almost every thread on S.C. (and i've been around c-d-f for almost 10 years on and off and with different user names) i've ever seen gets a bit intense with some truly vitriolic responses. Kinda funny actually.
I think that often people, before the visit, have a notion that Santa Cruz is some kind of quaint, cute little beach town (or something like that) and don't realize that it's (once again, i'll say it) a small city.
Also, i always recommend that people consider the entire county and don't limit themselves to S.C. proper.
And 152 ... i don't drive it often but when i listen to the radio (which is like much of the day - no t.v. for me) there seems now to be as many accidents on it as on 17.
The county has gotten nuts no doubt. It is overly impacted and the traffic is more than annoying ... and not just on 17 and 1. Aptos used to be empty with the exception of commuter times and now, it can be a drag just to go to the library. Sigh. Too many people on the planet and too many people in S.C. county.
And yet, i'm still here and so are many others and by choice.

Last edited by blueskywalker; 01-29-2016 at 07:05 PM..
 
Old 01-29-2016, 06:52 PM
 
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
1,723 posts, read 1,254,419 times
Reputation: 1307
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
I didn't say anything about SC surf culture, except to comment (in case the OP was interested in that, which we don't know) that most of the surfing takes place elsewhere than on the majority of W Cliff Dr., the part facing, um--west, which was the part of town I was discussing. Steamer Lane is on the bay.


Ah yes, "what bay" you ask. "There is no bay" you say, except Monterrey Bay. It's not believable that you're not aware that most of Santa Cruz is on its own small bay that's in a corner of Monterey Bay. Its bay is celebrated by artists in the area, and is one of the favorite features of the town, enjoyed by visitors and residents alike. Entire businesses are oriented toward helping aficionados enjoy that beloved amenity. It simply isn't possible that you didn't know this basic fact about the town you claim to know so well. I can't imagine why you'd pretend you didn't.


I never suggested the OP look to live on West Cliff Dr. I don't know what you're talking about. I was directing her to a general part of town, notably absent of homeless and the kind of sketchiness one sees in certain other areas. Whether you agree or not, that is the part of town many people go to for renting or buying when they want a beautiful neighborhood, walkability/bikeability, amenities, beach/ocean/easy access to beautiful views, and a quiet, safe environment. It is, indeed, one of the least sketchy parts of town. Your opinion may be otherwise, but that doesn't justify attacking another person's reasonable opinion.


New Leaf "isn't within walking distance" of what? Clearly, you missed the phrase, "depending on where you're located". You also missed the phrase, "it's certainly bike-able". You'd save yourself a lot of agitation by reading more carefully. You also seem to have missed my statement about NL having started as a local co-op (in contrast to WF's corporate nature), followed by the comment that it's better than WF. You see? We're actually in agreement that NL is better than WF. The ambience, products and layout remind me of WF, though, which is what I meant. If one is looking for a healthy foods/organic grocer that carries the type of food and variety that WF does, NL is the best in SC, IMO. And their prepared foods are all made on location, rather than bought from a national supplier and trucked in, like at WF, so they're not full of fillers and sugars, unlike those at WF.


How could I possibly tell from a map where the lower rent areas are? Your criticisms don't make any sense. "It looks to me" means literally that: one can observe the lower-rent areas when passing through them. That area around NL and that section of Mission attracts students and other people on a tighter budget than elsewhere in that part of town. I also have relatives who graduated from UCSC a few years ago who have settled in that area as they get their careers off the ground, for it's affordability, the vibe, and the walkability. You seem to have an odd allergic reaction to the phrase, "it looks to me". You're projecting all manner of inappropriate things onto it. Chill, dude.


As to the mom/pop grocers in the general area, you must realize it would be absurd to have posted exact addresses or streets in a comment meant as a general orientation in response to the OP's interests. Sorry you're not aware of these conveniences in a town that you claim to know so well. Now you can have an adventure seeking them out, a sort of treasure hunt. Enjoy!


And last, but by no means least, re: your query as to which "main beach" I meant, it's called, "Main Beach" shocker! Were you not aware that the main beach in the town you claim to know so well was called Main Beach? back at'cha.


Your comments are ludicrous and petty, nit-picking, misguided and puzzlingly poorly-informed BS, my fellow SC enthusiast. If you were sincerely interested in contributing constructively to the thread and helping the OP, you would have posted about more affordable parts of town, locations of better beaches, your take on walkable neighborhoods, etc. But you didn't. The silence from you is deafening on that score, which speaks to the fact that your agenda is other than posting in good faith and being of help to the OP.
Ruth i respectfully say to you that i can no longer read / respond to your posts re; S.C. county (my home ... where i live ... now .... and have lived for a very long time) because it's clear to me that you are not familiar with Santa Cruz and county via direct experience and it's just way too frustrating to argue with you. It'll make me crazy if i keep indulging. I've come and gone from this forum a number of times throughout the years because i've had a tendency to get too involved with the shenanigans (mine as well) on this forum and so i've learned to dis-engage when necessary. I did not however, drown myself today so that's good.
But you go girl.
 
Old 01-29-2016, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Laguna Niguel, Orange County CA
9,809 posts, read 8,507,162 times
Reputation: 7923
The original question was whether SC was a better fit for the OP than OC. Only the OP knows that. I certainly hope that the OP is honest when exploring SC with its admitted raw natural beauty and charm. I hope the OP also notices the horrible homelessness problem (one can imagine why SC is a endless magnet for the homeless), drug problem (needles on the beach), filthy people, crime, and far too many hippies for my taste. We happily don't have that in coastal OC and I am sure the OP knows it.
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