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Old 05-12-2008, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
25,306 posts, read 33,063,874 times
Reputation: 10724

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
How would people get to Piedmont or Alameda if they couldn't exit the Freeway
Hello? I dream of Jeannie? Blink their eyes and poof-your in Alameda.

 
Old 05-13-2008, 09:35 AM
 
4,134 posts, read 2,826,376 times
Reputation: 1588
This gets a bit comical. Oakland has a fairly high crime rate for the SF Bay Area but folks... Emeryville's (high rent area) rate is a LOT higher.

With that being said, the Oakland crime rate doesn't even land it in the top 100 on CD! If you really want to be randomly murdered, mugged, raped, or generally assaulted, you should move to the deep south or the Midwest. That's right, the land of apple pie and Norman Rockwell paintings yields the most dangerous cities on the planet.

The funny thing is that it's usually Midwesterners and people in Santa Clara (same thing) who are so afraid of Oakland! Give 'em a list of stats and they go nuts. I wonder if any of them take a peek at their own cities stats before getting scared of Oakland.

Here's the reality of the situation: Major California cities are rich. Even the poor are better off than most of America's middle class. California cities are pretty safe for the average Joe but if you are one to go out looking for trouble, you will find it. Cities are like that. It's true that there are gangs in these cities. We get back to the money thing. When there's disposable income floating around, vice becomes an issue. The gangs compete with each other for territory and do frequently kill each other off. Newsflash! Gangs are about money! They don't go randomly killing off their customers because they want to sell drugs, prostitution, bootleg software, etc. to people like you and me. If you're not in a gang and don't dress or act like you're in a gang, you're fairly safe. Yes, every time you buy a little bit of weed, a bootleg CD, DVD, software, fake Rolex watches, all of that crap, you are supporting gangs and putting honest people out of work at the same time! That's actually a really good example of the famed Midwestern work ethic from what I've observed. Wave the Chinese made American flag you bought at Wally-world while you charge your future away to the Chinese bank that owns your credit card at some flea-market shop that sells bootlegs and fakes.

Where you are in real danger is wonderful and quaint places in the deep south and Midwest where the economies have collapsed and there's real poverty. In places like that, anyone who looks like they might have a few bucks in their pocket are targets.
The criminals in Oakland aren't interested in mugging some clown on the street for a few bucks, that sort of thing is more of an East coast thing.

You want to be really scared of Oakland? Here's one for you...I just saw on the news that mandatory water rationing is back! Yipee! We're going to have pay through the nose so we can help 8 million people in LA water their lawns.

End of rant.

Last edited by Joe_Ryder; 05-13-2008 at 09:45 AM.. Reason: seemed like a good idea.
 
Old 05-13-2008, 09:48 AM
 
175 posts, read 560,088 times
Reputation: 43
Default I Disagree

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_Ryder View Post
This gets a bit comical. Oakland has a fairly high crime rate for the SF Bay Area but folks... Emeryville's (high rent area) rate is a LOT higher.

With that being said, the Oakland crime rate doesn't even land it in the top 100 on CD or any other list! If you really want to be randomly murdered, mugged, raped, or generally assaulted, you should move to the deep south or the Midwest. That's right, the land of apple pie and Norman Rockwell paintings yields the most dangerous cities on the planet.

The funny thing is that it's usually Midwesterners and people in Santa Clara (same thing) who are so afraid of Oakland! Give 'em a list of stats and they go nuts. I wonder if any of them take a peek at their own cities stats before getting scared of Oakland.

Here's the reality of the situation: Major California cities are rich. Even the poor are better off than most of America's middle class. California cities are pretty safe for the average Joe but if you are one to go out looking for trouble, you will find it. Cities are like that. It's true that there are gangs in these cities. We get back to the money thing. When there's disposable income floating around, vice becomes an issue. The gangs compete with each other for territory and do frequently kill each other off. Newsflash! Gangs are about money! They don't go randomly killing off their customers because they want to sell drugs, prostitution, bootleg software, etc. to people like you and me. If you're not in a gang and don't dress or act like you're in a gang, you're fairly safe. Yes, every time you buy a little bit of weed, a bootleg CD, DVD, software, fake Rolex watches, all of that crap, you are supporting gangs and putting honest people out of work at the same time! That's actually a really good example of the famed Midwestern work ethic from what I've observed. Wave the Chinese made American flag you bought at Wally-world while you charge your future away to the Chinese bank that owns your credit card at some flea-market shop that sells bootlegs and fakes.

Where you are in real danger is wonderful and quaint places in the deep south and Midwest where the economies have collapsed and there's real poverty. In places like that, anyone who looks like they might have a few bucks in their pocket are targets.
The criminals in Oakland aren't interested in mugging some clown on the street for a few bucks, that sort of thing is more of an East coast thing.

You want to be really scared of Oakland? Here's one for you...I just saw on the news that mandatory water rationing is back! Yipee! We're going to have pay through the nose so we can help 8 million people in LA water their lawns.

End of rant.
I grew up in the "deep south". Just visited last week. I found the cities I was in to be clean and vibrant with tons of new development. I'm not sure what source you used to obtain your information but Oakland isn't even in the same league with ANY Major (or Minor) city in the south. There is always random crime everywhere especially if you wander into high crime areas. I've spent many many years in Atlanta (now THAT is a city) and was NEVER "mugged" or even approached by anyone in a threatening manner. There are homeless people in every large city but I've never been approached by any in the south. In addition although there are "gangs" in most cities, California has more than their share. I dare you to go park your car in downtown Oakland for any period of time. I hope you have good insurance.

As for Oakland being "Rich". I have to laugh about that one. California is an expensive place to live. A dollar here doesn't buy very much. Thus the need for "Wally World" as you call it. Perhaps you should visit some of the "most dangerous cities in the world" (don't just fly over them) before you spout fictional rhetoric. Yes, the south has poor areas as does California or any state for that matter but you can hardly say everyone in California is rich. If it is why are so many people receiving welfare?

You are also wrong about the economy in the south collapsing. I'll use Chattanooga, Tn as an example. When the industrial jobs dried up they put their heads together and have now revitalized their downtown area and it is a lovely, booming city that attracts tourist from all over the world. You won't find aggressive homeless people wandering around and your car will be quite safe parked anywhere downtown. (San Fran and Sac should take notes.)

I like California. It's a wonderful state. We have lived all over the world and it is where we chose to make our home. High cost of living or not.

I find it very annoying when people that have never lived outside of California "think" they know how the other side of the country lives and try to push their opinions as reality.

I agree with you on one topic. Let Socal go find their own water!!!
Oh, and PG&E bites!!

Last edited by Alisande; 05-13-2008 at 10:57 AM.. Reason: update info
 
Old 05-13-2008, 10:11 AM
 
4,134 posts, read 2,826,376 times
Reputation: 1588
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisande View Post
I grew up in the "deep south". Just visited last week. I'm not sure where you are getting your information but Oakland isn't even in the same league with ANY city in the south. There is always random crime especially if you wander into high crime areas. I've spent many many years in Atlanta and was NEVER "mugged" or even approached by anyone in a threatening manner. There are homeless people in every large city but I've never been
approached by any in the south.


I was born in Houston. Most of my family lives in the deep south. My uncle lived in Louisiana and I spent plenty of time working on his boats. My cousin lives in Mobile. Most of my family came to the US in the 1600s and settled predominantly in the south. I am somewhat familiar. Crime stats tend to back up my claims.

I've lived in Oakland for 20 years and never been mugged here either. So what's your point? Facts are facts look it up for yourself. I'd give you links but the mods tend to delete links so it's up to you to prove me wrong. I won't be swayed from my opinion by anecdotal "evidence". The fact that you were never mugged indicates nothing. I was never mugged in Detroit, New York, Atlanta, or anywhere else in the US but that doesn't make any of those places safe. Gang members killing each other off doesn't make it dangerous either... unless of course you're a gang member or a clueless suburban adolescent lookalike.
 
Old 05-13-2008, 10:34 AM
 
Location: San Jose, CA
6,869 posts, read 17,006,742 times
Reputation: 2586
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_Ryder View Post
This gets a bit comical. Oakland has a fairly high crime rate for the SF Bay Area but folks... Emeryville's (high rent area) rate is a LOT higher.
Much of which is because of folks coming up from West Oakland. There have been some very well-publicized cases of this within the past couple of weeks.
 
Old 05-13-2008, 12:44 PM
 
175 posts, read 560,088 times
Reputation: 43
Default Oakland again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_Ryder View Post
I was born in Houston. Most of my family lives in the deep south. My uncle lived in Louisiana and I spent plenty of time working on his boats. My cousin lives in Mobile. Most of my family came to the US in the 1600s and settled predominantly in the south. I am somewhat familiar. Crime stats tend to back up my claims.

I've lived in Oakland for 20 years and never been mugged here either. So what's your point? Facts are facts look it up for yourself. I'd give you links but the mods tend to delete links so it's up to you to prove me wrong. I won't be swayed from my opinion by anecdotal "evidence". The fact that you were never mugged indicates nothing. I was never mugged in Detroit, New York, Atlanta, or anywhere else in the US but that doesn't make any of those places safe. Gang members killing each other off doesn't make it dangerous either... unless of course you're a gang member or a clueless suburban adolescent lookalike.
You've lived in Oakland for 20 years so your view would of course be biased. As SF became more expensive people were pushed out to Oakland/Pittsburg and other less expensive areas. Areas that were once nice. I'm sorry but I wouldn't live there. I have school age children. I wouldn't want them to have to deal with the thugs I see around the Oakland Schools. Perhaps since you've been in Oakland for a long time you know what areas NOT to visit. You've been lucky and I hope your luck holds.

You know what they say about statistics? I don't feel the need to prove anything. The news says it for me. Regardless of what people say everything you read on the internet is not true

The South you think you knew isn't there anymore. You really should take a trip I think you'd be surprised. (However, I will say Louisana and Alabama are 2 of the states that are still in financial trouble (and have been for as long as I can remember) but those 2 states are not the entire south.) With the disaster in New Orleans there are still many displaced families and a lot of poverty. However, the situation was there before the hurricane just not as apparent. The problem now has spread beyond New Orleans so the media is paying more attention.
 
Old 05-13-2008, 01:01 PM
 
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
25,306 posts, read 33,063,874 times
Reputation: 10724
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisande View Post
You've lived in Oakland for 20 years so your view would of course be biased.
20 years of Personal Experience is not as valid as what the news says?

I'm sorry, but if that's the way you think, then Oakland is better off without you. ta ta.
 
Old 05-13-2008, 01:10 PM
 
Location: Bay Area, CA
24,822 posts, read 28,747,876 times
Reputation: 11737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisande View Post
I dare you to go park your car in downtown Oakland for any period of time. I hope you have good insurance.
I park my car in Oakland all the time (I work there almost every Saturday) and haven't yet had it broken into, dinged, or even keyed... not to say it doesn't happen, but you make it sound like nobody parks downtown without incident. And I go to many different parts of the city, from the worst to the slightly nicer, and still haven't been scared or threatened once - don't even have problems when I work in Richmond, and that's arguably worse than O-town.

FYI - I'm originally from the east coast, and have lived in Maryland, Philadelphia, and Oregon... was FAR more scared in West Philadelphia, where my sister was mugged 3 times in her 4 years there. As for D.C., well let's ask my mother about her years as a schoolteacher downtown. I don't know the deep south very well, so can't disagree with you on that area, but I know the northeast cities are sketchy at best. I'm not trying to say that Oakland is 100% safe, because we all know that isn't true... however, people do love to exaggerate about it.
 
Old 05-13-2008, 01:14 PM
 
14,205 posts, read 26,395,221 times
Reputation: 8362
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisande View Post
You've lived in Oakland for 20 years so your view would of course be biased. As SF became more expensive people were pushed out to Oakland/Pittsburg and other less expensive areas. Areas that were once nice. I'm sorry but I wouldn't live there. I have school age children. I wouldn't want them to have to deal with the thugs I see around the Oakland Schools. Perhaps since you've been in Oakland for a long time you know what areas NOT to visit. You've been lucky and I hope your luck holds.

You know what they say about statistics? I don't feel the need to prove anything. The news says it for me. Regardless of what people say everything you read on the internet is not true
I can't fault anyone for wanting to do the best they can for their family and I can't think of any parent wanting their children to have to deal with thugs...

It doesn't take long to learn where to shop or what area to avoid no matter where you live... I'm third generation Oakland and my biggest problem is the perceptions of people that do not live here... they are always telling me I need to "Get Out"

I've got the best neighbors... no one has bars on their windows, pit bulls, alarms or fenced front yards... Amongst the neighbors, we all have keys to each others homes and we help each other... that goes for black, white, Asian and Gay/Lesbian neighbors...

Would I walk the streets of International Blvd alone at midnight... no, but I wouldn't walk the streets of down town San Francisco, San Jose or Sacramento at midnight either...

Oakland must be doing something right... after all, over 400,000 people call it home as well as many businesses and international corporations...

As a side note... I have had several of my cars broken into or vandalized and it has never happend in Oakland... Try San Leandro, San Francisco, Walnut Creek and Tahoe...
 
Old 05-13-2008, 01:15 PM
 
Location: Fullerton, CA
677 posts, read 815,345 times
Reputation: 407
Well guess what. Oakland has one the worst crime rates in the nation. Its robbery rate is about 5 times the national average and its murder rate is about 7 times. Has you car been stolen yet? Because it also a leader in auto theft.
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