4 Oakland Officers Killed (sale, coupons, rental)

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by City Boy

Are you really trying to compare a disability to hundreds of years of enforced racism that is heavily woven into American society? Something to which we still see the affects today. Yes in today's times we as Blacks and people of color have much better opportunities but the damage has already been done, we are digging our way out of a hole. The educational system has not rebounded and is not equal. Education equality is key.

I find it's a conundrum of sorts.

I work with people from just about every background...

One of the Doctors is from Spain... his family is from there and they are definitely upper class and educated... the conundrum is that he puts down Hispanic and it has been very beneficial.

I also have a friend from southern Italy and the same story...

How can white Europeans qualify as people of color?

[iTsLiKeAnEgG]

As I've said before, there is nothing wrong with receiving government assistance (I was one of these people). It should be used as a tool to get by until you are able to support yourself. The people I criticize depend on this type of support without any significant progressive. There are too many of these people getting a free ride.

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by City Boy

If you did then why are you using Asians as an example of people who succeed in America?

You're living off past perceptions of welfare created by Ronald Regan. The majority of people on welfare don't sit around and collect welfare checks for doing nothing. It's just not true.

sorry, many on welfare do sit around and do nothing. Reagan always said, there will always be 5% of the population that will be on welfare because they have no choice, the rest do have a choice...I have watched too many people in grocery stores paying for food I can't afford with their food stamps..


Nita

[nmnita]

Originally Posted by Nella925

I totally agree with all you said, esp. the first part. My mom was on section 8 for 5 years (she no longer is because she finally makes enough to get by (60000+ a year). She was not lazy, she worked 2 jobs and made sure my sister and I had whatever we needed. My father even helped... But what she made, did not match her needs esp in contra costa county. So she turned to assistance...which I see nothing wrong with that. She did not sit on her butt all day, she ensured she stayed employed and moved up in her job so she would be able to get off of section 8 and be able to buy her own house. Just wanted to share that story lol

and your mom is to be praised or congratulated, whatever. yes, there are some who work their A##s off to get off welfare, but for those there are 10X more who do not care, are addicted to something or just have always lived that way..

Nita

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

I find it's a conundrum of sorts.

I work with people from just about every background...

One of the Doctors is from Spain... his family is from there and they are definitely upper class and educated... the conundrum is that he puts down Hispanic and it has been very beneficial.

I also have a friend from southern Italy and the same story...

How can white Europeans qualify as people of color?

Not sure, but "hispanic" is not a race. I have a Panamanian friend that looks like Terrell Owens and a El Salvadorian friend who's parents are Japanese. Any racial group can be Hispanic/Latino. You have Black Latinos, Asian Latinos, etc just like you have Black Americans, Asian Americans etc. Spaniards for the most part are White Europeans.

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by nmnita

sorry, many on welfare do sit around and do nothing. Reagan always said, there will always be 5% of the population that will be on welfare because they have no choice, the rest do have a choice...I have watched too many people in grocery stores paying for food I can't afford with their food stamps..


Nita

Show me proof of that please. Ronald Regan also said Trickle down economics would work along with the War on drugs. Maybe you should get on food stamps then.

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by iTsLiKeAnEgG

I'm not using Asian as some kind of blanket statement. I am referencing my own friends and their families whom I personally know. I certainly can't speak for everyone on welfare, but my experience with 1) living among people who receive welfare, going to school with them, getting to know their family and 2) working as a banker in SF's Sunnydale area and seeing these peoples general banking activity, overall demeanor and outlook on life taught me a lot. Many of them are really nice people, but its clear to me that they aren't trying very hard. You may ask what being a banker tells me about any single person other than what they make and how they spend it. I got a great deal of my enjoyment in that position genuinely speaking to people, learning as much as I can and building relationships/trust. I can't possibly understand every facet of their life, but I do get something to base my opinion on. All of my comments are just that, personal opinion. It's ok for you to believe something else but my belief is not easily swayed and my personal experience with people provides a solid foundation with which I can debate.

You have your opinion but you don't know what people have been through or how hard they have tried by looking at them.

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by Nella925

I totally agree with all you said, esp. the first part. My mom was on section 8 for 5 years (she no longer is because she finally makes enough to get by (60000+ a year). She was not lazy, she worked 2 jobs and made sure my sister and I had whatever we needed. My father even helped... But what she made, did not match her needs esp in contra costa county. So she turned to assistance...which I see nothing wrong with that. She did not sit on her butt all day, she ensured she stayed employed and moved up in her job so she would be able to get off of section 8 and be able to buy her own house. Just wanted to share that story lol

[iTsLiKeAnEgG]

Originally Posted by City Boy

You have your opinion but you don't know what people have been through or how hard they have tried by looking at them.

They aren't animals or paintings stuck in a glass case. These are people I talk with on a personal level and understanding their financials is just a plus. I don't observe them and taking notes from a distance, I get to know them enough to form a fairly accurate opinion.

[MrSykes]

Originally Posted by iTsLiKeAnEgG

Well again, housing discrimination is not part of this equation. We lived in the ghetto among people of color. My mother worked hard for years and saved enough to secure a mortgage. No where along this path did another white person with a big heart offer us an advantage not offered to others. Am I saying that racism or discrimination doesn’t exist? Of course not, that would be a ridiculous statement. The severity of these instances also varies greatly depending on where in the country you live.

It most certainly is a part of the equation. Due to the prevalence of discrimination of this type, your mother, being white, would likely have been welcomed in any number of communities here with a predominance of white people. Same could not have been said of a black mother in the same situation, immigrant or not. Point is, settling in the ghetto among minorities was her choice. And aside from being white, your mother certainly had an economic leg up on most single mothers (of any race) here. To be able to relocate to one of the most (if not the most) expensive regions in the country all the way from Russia with two kids in tow in the first place is nothing short of exceptional. Most single mothers in West Oakland probably can't even afford a Greyhound ticket to L.A. for the weekend. With that said, the Bay Area was a good move culturally, despite whatever "mistreatment" you might have had to endure from a couple of knuckleheads from the 'hood.

The Bay Area is a great place to be a minority and anyone willing to try hard enough can succeed. The other (larger) portion of people who give up, take a government check and sit on their bottoms while complaining about inequalities and injustice instead of working towards something better are just lazy. I've cited my personal example, and I know many Asian and Indian families who also came here dirt poor and built something good for themselves. My mother just bought a beautiful place in the Oakland hills and our neighbors on both sides are black. They worked hard and got somewhere.

It's not just about "working hard" for some. It's about working smart. I know plenty of Mexican immigrants who are very hard workers, but still live at (or just above) poverty level even after years on the job. Mentioning the success of a couple of Asian and Indian families lends little to the point. Most Asians who come here tend to be better off than most of their compatriots back home who aren't lucky enough to make it here. An Asian man who has put everything on the line to relocate his family here has a hell of a lot more at stake than a black man from the ghetto who has already experienced by virtue of birth the worst this country has to offer. Their pathways to success are going to be very different. The Asian works hard, motivated by both the passion to succeed here (he really has no choice), and the psychosocial support of the greater community (as a "model minority", his intelligence, work ethic, and character will likely never come into question), and he is good to go. The black man starts from a very different plane. He can't pull himself up by the bootstraps until he finds some boots. And when he does, he has to chart a very specific course to success unique to his own struggles as a black man, factoring in all the land mines and impediments that are sure to fall his way during his (very uphill) journey to a respectable place in a society where even the poorest of immigrants have the nerve to look down on him.