What will finally cause California to decline significantly? (San Francisco, Fremont: dorms, wedding)

[gizmo980]

Please everyone, let's keep this debate civilized and not resort to personal attacks... thanks!

[ZhugeLiang]

Originally Posted by gizmo980

Please everyone, let's keep this debate civilized and not resort to personal attacks... thanks!

Does that include the Montclair and City Boy too?

[Darkonesun]

Originally Posted by UrbanQuest

Oh my blessed Bay Area. A very complex and confusing place for an outsider.
Bay Area liberals (white ones) treat immigrants (illegal as well) better than the established poor black population by a margin of 100/1. Case in point, while I lived in the Bay Area I resided in Montclair in Oakland (beautiful village in the hills) and after a few months I started to recognize faces in the village. I saw a black guy once heading in to a drug store and litteraly saw a group of women openly give him a disgusted look (never saw that anywhere I've lived across the country) and grabbed their purses so obvious it appeared intentional to send a message or something. I really felt sorry for that poor guy because when I went inside and just happened to be behind him in line at the cash register, he appeared shaken and his voice was cracking and his head down. On the way out one of the ladies was sitting and waiting for her prescription I guess and again she fired flamethrowers out of her eyes at him and grabbed her purse. I couldn't take it, I looked at her and told her to relax and does she realize she lives in Oakland for gods sake. She sneered at me and everyone in the store in earshot looked at me like I was some kind of rabblerouser. I honestly was like WTF!?!?!? Haldol anyone... Here's the funny part.

A month later at that same store I saw the same guy and different people in the store with us. He was wearing a shirt with JAMAICA on it and the lady behind him was clutching her purse of course (Montclair is purse clutching capital of the world imo). He half turned around and she saw his shirt, immeadiately smiled, stopped clutching her purse and greeted him and complimented him on his cool shirt and was he from there. Male, African-American non-immigrants who aren't millionaires are litteraly, in your face treated with massive hostility. Now these are people who voted for Obaba, support gay marriage, donate to charities to feed poor African children. If this is not hypocrisy and some sort of mass mental disorder they don't have name for yet, than I don't know what else it could be.

People like to say the Bay Area is elitest. I've walked through with black friends in some of the wealthiest areas of this country. (Worth ave Palm Beach, Madison Ave on the Upper East side, Miracle Mile Chicago, Walnut st Philadelphia, La Jolla, Beverly Hills, Laguna Beach, Bellevue Square in WA, Newburry st in Boston and Boca Raton and not even close did the nastiness come than what I saw in the East Bay. NOT EVEN CLOSE!!!

Wealthy Asians may be coming in, but all they contribute overall is their wealth and I don't know about the rest of you, that is not enough. They need to not only assimilate to "White America". They need to understand ALL of America and many of these are obvious to them but ignored. With this attitude they contribute to fragmentation of our society which has been trying so hard for the last 50 years to unite us. $$ steps forward and steps back.

Unless California comes to grips with this, it is a doomed state and all it needed was the spark of a great recession to ignite and burn down. I hope for the best though, but these people seem to not want to change. Is that liberal????

My man Urbanquest, laying down the truth as usual. You have been speaking the absolute truth about the Bay Area for quite some time bruh, and everything you said about it MIRRORS my and other black men's experiences to this DAY. Let's get something straight for everybody who is reading, what's happening out here, is ONLY happening to black American MEN. That's why no one else sees it--and they don't care either. If you are anything OTHER than a black American Male out here, you will be ACCEPTED; especially, these days. This place has a SERIOUS problem with black American males; especially POSITIVE ones.

Basically, black men are treated like ANIMALS out here. They can deny it all they want, but they know it's true. You aren't even SEEN as being a damn individual with hopes, dreams, and aspirations. You are just seen as a n***a; good, bad, nobody really cares. Black men are dehumanized out here.

It's the same now in 2009, as it was in 2004, as it was in 2001. The only time the bay was, somewhat, cool was the damn 90's.

Nothing has changed; except for that many black women have also hopped in on the anti-black male bandwagon these days. Since around 2002, many black women out here have been accepted, and in return, they go around hating on black men too. They try to turn up their noses at the black guys because they feel like they can date OTHER more openly now. So now, the black men out here are EXPERIENCING open hostility from EVERYONE; including them. As a result, many of the educated black men are LEAVING the bay area, as well as Cali altogether. These black women are really going to see later on when they don't even have educated black men to choose from out here AT ALL.

I have already heard many black women ask where are all the educated black men? THEY ARE LEAVING. They are all leaving dude; all except the ones who found somebody here a while ago.

I can't even COUNT the number of times many black women try to get in your face when they are out with their white or non-black guy, trying to hurt you, but when they are ALONE, it's cell-phone time; dig in my purse time, lower their eyes to the point where they can't even look you in the eye time, constant avoidance time, and all types of mess. The women out here are BUGGED; and they always think some black man is AFTER them; even ones who have never been approached by a black man before in their damn lives.

Then they make these fantastic lies about all the black men dating white women, but they do nothing but pre-emptively REJECT every black man around...Stuff is for comic books bruh.

They make me SICK out here. And don't even let me get on the RACIST non-black women of EVERY group who practically make ANIMALISTIC facial expressions every time their eyes even meet that of a young black male. I just don't see how any black man can like this place. I really don't. It has gotten REALLY bad as time went on. It wasn't even this bad when I first came out here in the 90's. However, it has gotten MARKEDLY worse. I don't recommend it for any SANE black man. It's just not worth it. You will just end up angry, and frustrated. The thing about it, it will seem cool at first, but as time goes on, you will begin to notice more and more ****.

You will see TONS of, seemingly, gay black men out here, and it is for a REASON. The reason is that if you are a black man who SHOWS any signs of MANHOOD, the type a woman might actually want, you are treated with OPEN hostility from women as well as other men. If you walk like a man, you will be subjected to a bunch of subliminal **** that will cause you to become emasculated if you aren't strong enough to DEAL. I sit back, and I observe, and what I notice is that only black men out here women will even talk to are always GAY. They avoid straight black men LIKE the PLAGUE. They will ONLY come around you if you are SOMEBODY that they want to DATE. That's it. If you aren't, you are treated like a damn MONSTER; no other race of man has to go through that type of crap out here; whether the women want them or not. You can't even FORM platonic relationships with women AT ALL out here. Most won't even CONSORT with a black man at all.

I have nothing against gay people, but it's true. People don't even want to come around a black man who seems MASCULINE.

I am almost close to graduating, and I am just praying to God that I can hold up long enough to get my black ass out of this racist place. I have been here for years, and I AM STILL talking about this place. I cannot WAIT 'til I am ready to leave.

I am just going to say it, the Bay Area is the most RACIST place a black man could live in. And if you are thinking about having some sort of dating life out here, you may as well forget it. Maybe it's just me, I don't know, maybe I am unattractive, I don't know. However, from what I have OBSERVED, the only black men who are even able to do so, are the uber-professionals, or the THUGS.

If you are a black man who falls in between--which, the majority of the decent black men do, and if you look as if you don't fit stereotypes--nobody wants anything to do with your ass out here. Nobody out here wants a regular black American man. If you are a black man, you have to either be a damn superstar, or be from somewhere else; like JAMAICA...LOL!!

I had a 'patna' in college who changed his major three damn times to get his black ass out of this place for the reasons that I mentioned. He changed his major from pre-med, to computer science, to math, all because of the stuff You and I have talked about. He finally graduated, and I haven't heard from him since.

It was so bad for me, that I had to talk to somebody 3000 miles away because of the attitudes of the women out here towards black men. I have never seen black men receive so much hatred from women like they do out here. The crazy thing about it, is that these same women will hate your ass to death, but will turn RIGHT around and date a non-black man who ACTS just like a black man.

Something OMINOUS is going on out here.

And don't even get me started on the way people out here will BLURT out insults at your black ass. People out here won't even LEAVE you alone to do your thing. If you are a black man that tries, you have to endure isolation, alienation, and just flat out HUMILIATION; especially if you go and try to strike up a conversation with other people. You never know what the hell to expect from people.

However, people feel as if you should talk to them anytime they feel like it. They can come up and talk to you, but you can't talk to them, they can come behind you, but you can't come behind them. ****'s crazy bruh.
The Bay Area, is a place FILLED with racist, white-worshiping immigrant groups who all seem to hold some sort of prejudice towards blacks. I am totally against any further immigration. Whites, and particularly white men, could care LESS. The only thing these white-worshiping immigrant women mean to them is more interracial ass. These people hold no hostility towards white people, but they hold a TON of it towards blacks, and especially black men.

It's total irony, black Americans are some of the most American people around, and yet, we are the most hated things walking on two-legs in this country. In my class, my teacher asked everybody in the class who was a damn American citizen, and what was shocking, was only 3 people, in a class of 36 people, were American citizens; and I was one of them. yet, black American men are the most hated beings out here.

Like I said bruh, stuff is for comic books. I hope that all other places are better than here, because I can't take it out here anymore. I am surprised that I have made it this long without going crazy, or giving up.

Later,

[Ultrarunner]

Wow is all I can say... I truly hope you find what you are looking for.

You're right... I just don't see it.

The Mayor of my city is black as is the the Branch Manager were I Bank and the president of the PTA... all the male teachers are black except for one Asian... I work with black Engineers, Lawyers and Doctors... and recently attended the funeral for a collegue that was the former president of the California Medical Association... the funeral was standing room only and he was born and raised in Louisiana to black parents... a cook and a seamstress... several in his family commented in the Eulogy that California, especially the Bay Area was the promised land...

The Bay Area is one of the most Diverse Regions in the United States... over 150 languages are spoken just in my City of Oakland.

[BayAreaHillbilly]

Darkonesun was mostly alluding to the dating experience. Sure, that was a bit melodramatic, but the points are well taken. I can positively confirm that some (maybe even most) of the current high volume immigrant groups here are pretty darned racist toward African Americans (especially men) - I've heard the racist utterances from them directly (they assume I'm pure white or white with some Asian or Latin blood, this latter true but not the whole story - I look mostly white, so they let 'er rip). It saddens my heart.

BTW - the net outflow of African Americans from the inner Bay Area has been going on now for over 40 years. It's starting to even impact Oakland, Richmond and some of the far East Bay communities. EPA (and adjacent East Menlo) was done for years ago and is now a largely Latino / Pacific Islander / modest white place. We all know what happened to the Western Addition and is proceeding apace in Bayview / Hunter's Point / Visitacion Valley / etc. Meanwhile, large metro areas in Dixie (and DC on the edge of Dixie) are increasingly meccas for African Americans.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly

Darkonesun was mostly alluding to the dating experience. Sure, that was a bit melodramatic, but the points are well taken. I can positively confirm that some (maybe even most) of the current high volume immigrant groups here are pretty darned racist toward African Americans (especially men) - I've heard the racist utterances from them directly (they assume I'm pure white or white with some Asian or Latin blood, this latter true but not the whole story - I look mostly white, so they let 'er rip). It saddens my heart.

BTW - the net outflow of African Americans from the inner Bay Area has been going on now for over 40 years. It's starting to even impact Oakland, Richmond and some of the far East Bay communities. EPA (and adjacent East Menlo) was done for years ago and is now a largely Latino / Pacific Islander / modest white place. We all know what happened to the Western Addition and is proceeding apace in Bayview / Hunter's Point / Visitacion Valley / etc. Meanwhile, large metro areas in Dixie (and DC on the edge of Dixie) are increasingly meccas for African Americans.

Very true...

I managed a Duplex where both units were rented to African Americans... when one unit became available I showed to a family originally from Vietnam...

The family from Vietnam said they would not rent if there were too many Blacks and the African American family told me they would move if I rented to Asians

Lots of the families in one predominantly half white and half black black neighborhood sold to Hispanic Families from 2003 to 2008 every home sold went to a Hispanic Family and sadly many of these new homeowners lost these homes in the last year...

The White families were long term residents that passed away or moved to retirement homes... the African American Families moved to new homes as far away as Stockton and Tracy with a fair number moving to Antioch, Brentwood Oakley...

[BayDude]

Originally Posted by Ultrarunner

Wow is all I can say... I truly hope you find what you are looking for.

You're right... I just don't see it.

The Mayor of my city is black as is the the Branch Manager were I Bank and the president of the PTA... all the male teachers are black except for one Asian... I work with black Engineers, Lawyers and Doctors... and recently attended the funeral for a collegue that was the former president of the California Medical Association... the funeral was standing room only and he was born and raised in Louisiana to black parents... a cook and a seamstress... several in his family commented in the Eulogy that California, especially the Bay Area was the promised land...

The Bay Area is one of the most Diverse Regions in the United States... over 150 languages are spoken just in my City of Oakland.

Your talking about Oakland.

Anyways I see exactly what he's talking a about. True maybe he was being a little over-dramatic about it but I see what he's saying.

Truth is lots of folks here are confused and hyprocritical. Typical Bay Area liberalism. The liberals here except for the ones in Oakland or other relatively high black population cities like Hayward, have a quiet, passive aggressive disdain for blacks, especially black males. He's not being paranoid there is palpable hate towards certain blacks especially.

BTW why do people keep repeating "diversity" over and over again like it changes anything? "Diversity" does'nt mean an absense of racism at all.

If your black, middle class, male "normal", conservative etc its tough going. The Bay Area has really changed significantly since my childhood years in the late 80s and early 90's I'll agree. So I can definitely empathize with dude.

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by BayDude

Your talking about Oakland.

Anyways I see exactly what he's talking a about. True maybe he was being a little over-dramatic about it but I see what he's saying.

Truth is lots of folks here are confused and hyprocritical. Typical Bay Area liberalism. The liberals here except for the ones in Oakland or other relatively high black population cities like Hayward, have a quiet, passive aggressive disdain for blacks, especially black males. He's not being paranoid there is palpable hate towards certain blacks especially.

BTW why do people keep repeating "diversity" over and over again like it changes anything? "Diversity" does'nt mean an absense of racism at all.

If your black, middle class, male "normal", conservative etc its tough going. The Bay Area has really changed significantly since my childhood years in the late 80s and early 90's I'll agree. So I can definitely empathize with dude.

Yeah and white conservatives are so open and understanding to Blacks.

[Darkonesun]

Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly

Darkonesun was mostly alluding to the dating experience. Sure, that was a bit melodramatic, but the points are well taken. I can positively confirm that some (maybe even most) of the current high volume immigrant groups here are pretty darned racist toward African Americans (especially men) - I've heard the racist utterances from them directly (they assume I'm pure white or white with some Asian or Latin blood, this latter true but not the whole story - I look mostly white, so they let 'er rip). It saddens my heart.

BTW - the net outflow of African Americans from the inner Bay Area has been going on now for over 40 years. It's starting to even impact Oakland, Richmond and some of the far East Bay communities. EPA (and adjacent East Menlo) was done for years ago and is now a largely Latino / Pacific Islander / modest white place. We all know what happened to the Western Addition and is proceeding apace in Bayview / Hunter's Point / Visitacion Valley / etc. Meanwhile, large metro areas in Dixie (and DC on the edge of Dixie) are increasingly meccas for African Americans.

Thanks for backing me up on this. It's true. I have go to school every day with these racist immigrant groups. I also have to go to school with many whites who ALSO have crappy views about black American men. After awhile, the s**t gets to be too much to deal with; and it's a total WASTE because the Bay Area is one of the most beautiful places in the country. It's a damn shame that black American MEN are left out from enjoying it while everyone else can. The only black men that are left alone out here are old black men who NO WOMAN wants. Black men that are HOMELESS, gay black men, or some other type of disqualified black man.

The young ones are attacked INCESSANTLY out here from EVERY angle until they either become emasculated, become isolated, and alienated, turn gay, give up, go thug, or God knows what else. The black women don't give a damn about black men out here as long as they can date a white or non-black man, and as long as THEY are left alone. From what I have seen from today's current crop of black women, they will even JOIN IN on mistreating black men badly just to FIT IN. They are GONE in the head out here; no consciousness whatsoever.

They don't care about what black men go through out here--unless you are the particular one that they want to date...LOL!! Or unless some non-black man treats them badly. Then they go on with this pro-black spiel--which is fake; knowing good and well they never cared about black men one way or the other.

I also notice that many white women out here in the Bay are VERY racist too. I have came across my fair share of racist white women out here. In fact, I will go on to say that many of them out here are more racist than white men are outwardly; particularly towards black men; almost like they are trying to make a statement. I guess I will start dealing with that white male racism when I get into corporate America...As of right now, I don't get too much crap from white males socially though. They really don't bother me much at all.

And I am not even talking about in relationships, or who they choose to date. I am not tripping off whether they like black men or not. I am just talking about basic, casual, day-to-day interaction. These white women out here are just HATEFUL. I know one thing, whoever called white women the most liberal lied their asses off. Many of them don't seem too liberal to me.

Alot of them act like even consorting with a black man out here brings down their class status. They are VERY racist out here; far worse than anything I encountered in the South.

I am surprised to hear a white dude even admit the things that you said; that's when you KNOW it's a problem. And it will only get worse unless people curb the damn immigration of these RACIST immigrants coming from Asia, Mexico, the Middle-East, and Africa too; unfortunately. They are all joining together to OPPRESS black Americans in their own country. Ironically, the only cool immigrants that I have met, so far, are from EASTERN EUROPE. I haven't really come across too many total *******s with them yet, but I am just holding my breath, I guess. It's like the other ones feel like they don't have to RESPECT black American men AT ALL.

Out here, black men are viewed as nothing but an AMORPHOUS glob who nobody sees positively or individually; and sooner or later, black American men simply won't be in the Bay Area anymore..AT ALL. People think that I am kidding when I say that many American-born, black men are leaving the Bay; they ARE. Look at UrbanQuest? He left, and I know many more who have left too; and I am following right behind them as soon as I can do so. What's sad is these are the EDUCATED black men that are leaving.

I talk to them all the time, and many black American men are NOT happy here because of the RAMPANT bigotry from the whites and these other IMMIGRANT groups. The Bay Area is going to be nothing but Whites, Asians, and Mexicans, and I guess black women too; since they don't seem to care too much about black men either. If that's what everybody wants then keep up the hatred towards black American men then. They will end up losing a big part of Bay Area culture. I wonder who will be next to get hated on once black men leave out of here.

San Francisco are losing their blacks at a record pace every year.

People see it as a step down to even be caught talking to a black American male IN THE PUBLIC. This place isn't liberal at all.

People are on some Class-caste s**t out here; especially these immigrant--and whites too. I am like, this is 2000freaking9!! What is up with this Bombay caste bulls**t in the Bay? You still have people acting like it's a freaking revolutionary thing to talk to a damn black man in the public and s**t. I am from the South, and I never had this problem; in spite of the RACISM from white people. I still came across a fair share of whites that I could chop it up with. Out here, it's been the same for YEARS.

And don't even let me get on the women out here...Good LORD. Every group of women out here, including black women, treat being with a white man is the same as spending a night with Bruce Springsteen or some s**t. I have NEVER seen so much white-worship in my ENTIRE life. Truth be told, I wouldn't even care so much about that if people didn't have black male hatred on the other half of the damn coin.

Hell, if black men were left alone and ALLOWED to be able to live and let live without dealing with animalistic facial expressions, hateful, racist slurs, constant avoidance, and were able to socialize FREELY with everyone else without the worry of someone taking everything you do the wrong way--especially women--I wouldn't even be complaining; because there would be nothing to complain about. Basically, if every black man was taken as a damn individual, and given common courtesy that people have NO problem giving to anyone else, I wouldn't be complaining.

Later,

[City Boy]

Originally Posted by Darkonesun

Hell, if black men were left alone and ALLOWED to be able to live and let live without dealing with animalistic facial expressions, hateful, racist slurs, constant avoidance, and were able to socialize FREELY with everyone else without the worry of someone taking everything you do the wrong way--especially women--I wouldn't even be complaining; because there would be nothing to complain about. Basically, if every black man was taken as a damn individual, and given common courtesy that people have NO problem giving to anyone else, I wouldn't be complaining.

Later,

The white man is god basically everywhere, you can thank the media and history for that. Which is why you see so many Asian women dating nothing but white men even over their own men, especially in San Francisco.

Black men, Black Females and Asian men have always been deemed as undesirable, black men are usually seen as sex addicts that want to rape you. But the white knight will rescue all women, so women are brainwashed to think if you marry white or date white you'll get ahead in life. Black is a no no.