Lake Merritt (Los Angeles, San Diego, San Francisco: sale, limousine, universities)

[l'étranger]

Dear Ultrarunner:

With all due respect, you have merely restated your anecdotal accounts, albeit it more insistently this time. We take it, then, that you are committing yourself to the proposition that the experience of your acquaintances is definitive, or at least supposed proof that "each successive Generation enjoys the opportunity of success the previous one could only imagine..."

Yet again, I must reiterate that as successful as your immigrant acquaintances are–––and as successful as the the very successful denizens of the very lovely Oakland Hills, Berkeley Hills, and tony suburbs of the East Bay are–––the overwhelming evidence, i.e., earning power of the middle-class, rates of upward mobility, etc.,––-simply do not support your thesis, i.e., "each successive Generation enjoys the opportunity of success the previous one could only imagine."

For the vast majority of (white) Americans, this egalitarian American Dream of which you evoke was available until the late 1960s. I strongly recommend Krugman's The Great Unravelling or Conscience of a Liberal. Malcolm Gladwell makes many of the same points in The Outliers, albeit through anecdotal stories about celebrated figures during the past century.

[l'étranger]

And yes, Lake Merritt rocks. I loved sailing sloops on the lake and then strolling to the Haddon Hill neighborhood on the northeast side of the lake, a gracious enclave of tree-lined streets and beautiful older large homes and mansions, before taking longer walks up through Crocker Highlands, bypassing Piedmont to reach the Montclair district. Beautiful views and homes for the senses.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by l'étranger

And yes, Lake Merritt rocks. I loved sailing sloops on the lake and then strolling to the Haddon Hill neighborhood on the northeast side of the lake, a gracious enclave of tree-lined streets and beautiful older large homes and mansions, before taking longer walks up through Crocker Highlands, bypassing Piedmont to reach the Montclair district. Beautiful views and homes for the senses.

Hmmm, that's right about where Santa Clara Avenue is right? That's the area I stay when I go up there.

[l'étranger]

Originally Posted by Gentoo

Hmmm, that's right about where Santa Clara Avenue is right? That's the area I stay when I go up there.

Dear Gentoo:

Actually, Santa Clara Avenue is off of Grand Avenue, but Haddon Hill (or Cleveland Heights, as it is designated on some maps) is just south of of the MacArthur freeway. I would get to Haddon Hill by walking up Wesley Ave, which would bring me to Haddon and Kenwyn Roads, right in the heart of the lovely enclave.

My longer walks would take me through Crocker Highlands (via Paramount, Underhills, Longridge), which would take me up through tree-lined streets of large, impressive homes (Tudor, Norman, French/Mediterranean)and estates to Park Blvd. I would avoid Piedmont, for while it is virtually indistinguishable architecturally from Oakland's Crocker Highlands that abuts it, the exclusionary, all-white ethos of Piedmont makes itself very clear. This type of atavistic animus, as a conservative here on the board said dismissively of one of Oakland's beautiful parks, is "just not my cup of tea."

Heading up the hills via Park Blvd., I would cut across to Estates Drive just at the point where it leaves Piedmont, reentering Oakland where the Montclair district begins. The walk would continue up Estates Drive to La Salle or Dawes, a course that would take me through one of Oakland's prime neighborhoods, one of striking hill panoramas, beautiful homes, and interesting architecture. On days in which I would have more time, I would continue the walk by crossing over to the village and then up Colton or Magellan in upper Montclair, which has steeper inclines, a more bosky, almost rural feel. This is a part of Montclair where by the more rugged, wooded terrain practically demands a more eclectic style of homes–––from cozy cottages to New Frontier-era expressions of Danish Modern stye, i.e. large homes of Redwood and sheets of glass clinging to the steepest hills. When these climbing, winding streets reach wooded plateaus, the mix of small cottages and large, precariously planted moderns give way to older grand, but still somehow quaint, Tudors and Mediterraneans. Nearing the crest of upper Montclair, the older large homes give way to newer behemoths, almost oppressively large but still striking homes that not just announce but practically advertise new infusions wealth and power.

Although these neighborhoods are segregated by class, Haddon Hill, Crocker Highlands, and Montclair boasted a more diverse group of residents in terms of race and ethnicity than their counterpart neighborhoods in Piedmont, the Berkeley Hills, not to mention the tonier suburbs farther east.

This mix of relative diversity and outright affluence in Oakland's more gracious neighborhoods is one of the traits that makes the city stand out in ways that belie the conservatives' bigoted calumnies.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by l'étranger

Dear Gentoo:

Actually, Santa Clara Avenue is off of Grand Avenue, but Haddon Hill (or Cleveland Heights, as it is designated on some maps) is just south of of the MacArthur freeway. I would get to Haddon Hill by walking up Wesley Ave, which would bring me to Haddon and Kenwyn Roads, right in the heart of the lovely enclave.

My longer walks would take me through Crocker Highlands (via Paramount, Underhills, Longridge), which would take me up through tree-lined streets of large, impressive homes (Tudor, Norman, French/Mediterranean)and estates to Park Blvd. I would avoid Piedmont, for while it is virtually indistinguishable architecturally from Oakland's Crocker Highlands that abuts it, the exclusionary, all-white ethos of Piedmont makes itself very clear. This type of atavistic animus, as a conservative here on the board said dismissively of one of Oakland's beautiful parks, is "just not my cup of tea."

Heading up the hills via Park Blvd., I would cut across to Estates Drive just at the point where it leaves Piedmont, reentering Oakland where the Montclair district begins. The walk would continue up Estates Drive to La Salle or Dawes, a course that would take me through one of Oakland's prime neighborhoods, one of striking hill panoramas, beautiful homes, and interesting architecture. On days in which I would have more time, I would continue the walk by crossing over to the village and then up Colton or Magellan in upper Montclair, which has steeper inclines, a more bosky, almost rural feel. This is a part of Montclair where by the more rugged, wooded terrain practically demands a more eclectic style of homes–––from cozy cottages to New Frontier-era expressions of Danish Modern stye, i.e. large homes of Redwood and sheets of glass clinging to the steepest hills. When these climbing, winding streets reach wooded plateaus, the mix of small cottages and large, precariously planted moderns give way to older grand, but still somehow quaint, Tudors and Mediterraneans. Nearing the crest of upper Montclair, the older large homes give way to newer behemoths, almost oppressively large but still striking homes that not just announce but practically advertise new infusions wealth and power.

Although these neighborhoods are segregated by class, Haddon Hill, Crocker Highlands, and Montclair boasted a more diverse group of residents in terms of race and ethnicity than their counterpart neighborhoods in Piedmont, the Berkeley Hills, not to mention the tonier suburbs farther east.

This mix of relative diversity and outright affluence in Oakland's more gracious neighborhoods is one of the traits that makes the city stand out in ways that belie the conservatives' bigoted calumnies.

Santa Clara was the general direction of where I stay. I didn't want to mention the actual street.

I know where you're talking about for the most part. I very rarely venture in that direction but know where it is. The last time I decided to go into Piedmont, I did so going up Grand Avenue. I cannot remember the names of the streets I then took but I wandered around for a long time. Up and down hills (I tend to memorize landmarks and have a good sense of direction so I don't always pay attention to street names like I should). I ended up at that small shopping center that used to be dominated by a Payless which was then a Thrifty. Not sure what it is now. It's by that deep rocky gorge with the green water in it. It's on College Av. and something. I used to go there all the time as a kid. From here I just followed College Av into Berkeley

[l'étranger]

Dear Gentoo:

Hmmm...it seems as if you made your way into Piedmont via Grand Lake, turned left at some point and headed north, which brought you back to Oakland's northwestern edge of Montclair and then into the Rockridge area. The green lake in the deep gorge? My guess is that you are referring to the reservoir, which rests on the southern tip of the Claremont Country Club and the Pleasant Valley district, in close proximity to the Rockridge Shopping Center, not to be confused with the Rockridge area of niche boutiques and gourmet restaurants (Oliveto's, Le Citron, etc.) on College Avenue, as Rockridge Shopping Center is another one of the shopping centres/malls that the conservative BayDude claims Oakland doesn't have.

From there it seems you hit the aforementioned College Ave and followed it until you hit Berkeley. Splendid walk, that one. I would suggest that the next time you head north on College Ave, take a left and just keep on walking due east toward the hills you will see, the one with the grand homes. A ten or fifteen minute walk will bring you to Oakland's Upper Rockridge/Claremont Pines, a truly beautiful neighborhood of old grand Maybeck and Morgan mansions and newer, post-1991 fire creations (some bordering on monstrosities), lush lawns, tree-lined streets, and stupendous, absolutely breath-taking views of Oakland, San Francisco Bay, and San Francisco in the distance.

Then, if you have a good credit card or a wad of dosh(money), please drop in by Oliveto's or Le Citron or A Coté, or any of the newer gourmet hubs in Oakland's Rockridge district and have a delicious lunch and coffee for me.

[Gentoo]

Originally Posted by l'étranger

Dear Gentoo:

Hmmm...it seems as if you made your way into Piedmont via Grand Lake, turned left at some point and headed north, which brought you back to Oakland's northwestern edge of Montclair and then into the Rockridge area. The green lake in the deep gorge? My guess is that you are referring to the reservoir, which rests on the southern tip of the Claremont Country Club and the Pleasant Valley district, in close proximity to the Rockridge Shopping Center, not to be confused with the Rockridge area of niche boutiques and gourmet restaurants (Oliveto's, Le Citron, etc.) on College Avenue, as Rockridge Shopping Center is another one of the shopping centres/malls that the conservative BayDude claims Oakland doesn't have.

From there it seems you hit the aforementioned College Ave and followed it until you hit Berkeley. Splendid walk, that one. I would suggest that the next time you head north on College Ave, take a left and just keep on walking due east toward the hills you will see, the one with the grand homes. A ten or fifteen minute walk will bring you to Oakland's Upper Rockridge/Claremont Pines, a truly beautiful neighborhood of old grand Maybeck and Morgan mansions and newer, post-1991 fire creations (some bordering on monstrosities), lush lawns, tree-lined streets, and stupendous, absolutely breath-taking views of Oakland, San Francisco Bay, and San Francisco in the distance.

Then, if you have a good credit card or a wad of dosh(money), please drop in by Oliveto's or Le Citron or A Coté, or any of the newer gourmet hubs in Oakland's Rockridge district and have a delicious lunch and coffee for me.

Pleasant Valley rd. that's it! Yeah I think we're talking about that same water. I'ts always been in a steep rocky gorge.

That is a good walk and that was the first time I had done it in well over a decade as I now live in San Diego. There are no walks quite like that in most of SD that's for sure. There's nothing like the Oakland and Berkeley hills.

[l'étranger]

Dear Gentoo:

I live in Manhattan, but I surely miss sailing on Lake Merritt (when I first came to New York, I called the parks department and asked if there was a lake in the city at which I could rent a sloop. Basically, the response was laughter and the phone click). I also miss the walking through Crocker Highlands, Montclair, and Claremont Pines and dining on Piedmont Ave, Montclair Village, and without doubt Rockridge's College Ave. This says quite a lot, given that New York is one of the great restaurant towns in the world.

I wish someone would post more photos of Lake Merritt–––with the sloops in full sail–––or some more shots of Crocker Highlands, upper Montclair (those wooded hills, unique homes, and bay views), not to mention Claremont Pines. You are right. There is nothing quite like the Oakland, or Berkeley, hills.

[WesternGulf]

Originally Posted by l'étranger

Dear Gentoo:
This type of atavistic animus, as a conservative here on the board said dismissively of one of Oakland's beautiful parks, is "just not my cup of tea."

From the surface maybe you can say this about Piedmont but I would not really consider the area conservative.

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by WesternGulf

From the surface maybe you can say this about Piedmont but I would not really consider the area conservative.

Piedmont has more than 75% Registered Democrats vs 23% Republican... I never thought of Piedmont being Conservative either...


Piedmont is extremely pro-active when it comes to the community... many residential streets have 15 mph speed limits and Piedmont Officer told me he can jail speeders going more than 30 in a 15 zone because it's double the speed limit... they also are very strict if you've got a tail light out or similar...

Did you know that if you do any business in Piedmont you pay business tax... this includes all home based business or if you are a contractor fixing a sticking door... makes no difference...