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Old 05-08-2012, 11:50 AM
 
Location: California
2,777 posts, read 1,936,855 times
Reputation: 4951
Quote:
Originally Posted by BayAreaHillbilly View Post
The people who have the toughest time are not those with an "IT" background (which I define as generally software related or at best, systems administration / systems maintenance). It is the classic hardware / chip / computer engineering constellation who are struggling. Understanding why is not rocket science. Circa 1982 we had wafer fabs, surface mount lines, metal fab houses, injection molding firms, etc, etc, etc, all here in the Bay Area. Meanwhile, there were scads of places designing and building real stuff. Oh, and there were also significant software operations as well, from bit level to the ap layer. It was a highly complete and integrated ecosystem. Now, 30 years later, there are many software related firms, some chip places that use foundries located elsewhere, and a few remaining 800 Lb gorilla systems places. My, oh my, it is unrecognizable versus what I consider to be the real Silicon Valley. Today's version is senile remnant of what once was.
Well said! Thank you.

So there is no one answer about the Bay area being recession proof.
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Old 05-08-2012, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley
2,410 posts, read 4,001,776 times
Reputation: 1336
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatCurve View Post
Yes, they do get paid less than Americans with comparable education and experience. That's why companies love them. They are the "factory workers" of the 21st century.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ondys View Post
I can't speak for everyone, but from H1B holders I know, all of them were offered significantly more than $100k. I and my soon-to-be wife, both H1B holders, have started working recently, right after we finished our studies, and we were immediately offered jobs that easily qualify our household to top 1.5%.
I've had H1B visa holders working for me, and at my company, they are on the same pay scale as everyone else living in the same geographic region. At the time (I'm guessing around 2007), the targeted 50th percentile salary for mid-level software developers (BS degrees and 3-7 years experience) in the company was about $140k, not including profit sharing and bonuses, and I was paying my guy $137k. He actually wasn't very good (I inherited him from a group I absorbed), and I ended up firing him about 18 months later.

I'd be really interested in hearing from a manager who actually paid their H1B visa holders below market salaries.
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:40 PM
Status: "Juan Luis Guerra" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
3,762 posts, read 4,894,226 times
Reputation: 1434
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatCurve View Post
That's because the people you know are already employed. You don't see the unemployed people because where would you meet them? Just because you don't personally know them doesn't mean that they don't exist.
No it means that the job market is hot for those of us in this field. If it wasn't, people would hang on to their jobs, instead of quitting and moving around so much. I wouldn't be getting contacted by recruiters every week, even though I am not actively looking for another job.

Quote:
Yes, they do get paid less than Americans with comparable education and experience.
What basis do you have for saying this. Can you back it up with verifiable facts? I find it hard to believe. Here's why: India now has a very huge IT market. There are lots of jobs and the standard of living has gotten quite high. If these guys aren't getting paid well in the United States, they could simply return to India , get a well paying computer job there, and have a better standard of living than they would here.
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Old 05-08-2012, 04:09 PM
 
Location: Planet Earth
267 posts, read 255,751 times
Reputation: 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post
No it means that the job market is hot for those of us in this field. If it wasn't, people would hang on to their jobs, instead of quitting and moving around so much. I wouldn't be getting contacted by recruiters every week, even though I am not actively looking for another job.
Again, you are employed. That's why you get calls from recruiters. The people who quit their jobs to switch to another job were also employed, that's why they had to quit their previous jobs to move. Ask people who are currently unemployed how many calls they get from recruiters per week.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post
What basis do you have for saying this. Can you back it up with verifiable facts? I find it hard to believe. Here's why: India now has a very huge IT market. There are lots of jobs and the standard of living has gotten quite high. If these guys aren't getting paid well in the United States, they could simply return to India , get a well paying computer job there, and have a better standard of living than they would here.
From a few years ago:
Research finds US H1B visa holders paid less

Quote: "When you look at computer job titles by state, California has one of the biggest differentials between OES salaries and H-1B salaries. The average salary for a programmer in California is $73,960, according to the OES. The average salary paid to an H-1B visa worker for the same job is $53,387; a difference of $20,573."

Besides, the H1B workers still make more here than they can in India or China. And many come here not just for the job, but for the opportunity to live in the U.S., to have babies that automatically become U.S. citizens, and the possibility to reside in the U.S. permanently. The quality of life is much better here than it is in either India or China. That's why so many rich Chinese are buying houses here with cash, pushing prices up, because they hope to eventually immigrate here permanently.
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Old 05-08-2012, 05:15 PM
 
599 posts, read 456,806 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatCurve View Post
Again, you are employed. That's why you get calls from recruiters. The people who quit their jobs to switch to another job were also employed, that's why they had to quit their previous jobs to move. Ask people who are currently unemployed how many calls they get from recruiters per week.
Well I know I'm just one person, but I was unemployed from December through March, and I got lots of calls from recruiters throughout that period. That's one reason I was able to get a new job so fast.
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Old 05-08-2012, 05:58 PM
 
Location: Planet Earth
267 posts, read 255,751 times
Reputation: 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdJS View Post
Well I know I'm just one person, but I was unemployed from December through March, and I got lots of calls from recruiters throughout that period. That's one reason I was able to get a new job so fast.
Yes, but you probably contacted them first to let them know you were looking for a new job, right? I was referring to recruiters calling people out of the blue without first putting it out there that you are in the market for a new job, like the calls gainfully employed people receive at work all the time.
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:42 PM
Status: "Moving to Downtown San Jose" (set 10 days ago)
 
Location: San Jose, CA
927 posts, read 1,509,068 times
Reputation: 499
There was a lot more manufacturing here 30 years ago, one obvious sign that there used to be a lot of manufacturing here are the large number of superfund, and former superfund sites around here. It seems that a lot of people didn't care what chemicals they leeched into the ground when they were making electronics back then. I for one I'm certainly glad we don't manufacture these products here anymore. Right now the areas that have the most growth are internet services and mobile applications. But we certainly still have large enterprise software companies here, as well as the headquarters for AMD and Intel, as well as Nvidia. This is definitely a boom period, but we are not recession proof, if you had been around in 2009 there were few companies hiring and there were a lot of stores closing shop, if you walked around downtown San Mateo, San Carlos, or Mountain View it wasn't rare to see a shuttered restaurant every 2 or so blocks, most of those places didn't become occupied until late 2010 or early 2011, last year hiring really took off in this area, so a lot of people have been moving here and rents have gone up a lot. That is nothing compared to 2001/2002 recession though. It seems like every 10 years something else becomes the big technology, and hiring takes off in that area. Semiconductor circuits, personal computers, computer software, internet services, mobile apps, there have been many booms and busts around here. For now companies like Facebook are making a ton of money advertising to people on that site, and Apple keeps making more and more money as the smartphone market grows, nowadays they are making about $40B in profit a year. A lot of tech companies are making money selling things worldwide since the developing economies are still growing during this time period.

So for the time being companies are going to "make hay while the sun shines" and hire people to make more products to sell or apps for people to use.
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Old 05-09-2012, 09:35 AM
Status: "Juan Luis Guerra" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
3,762 posts, read 4,894,226 times
Reputation: 1434
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatCurve View Post
Yes, but you probably contacted them first to let them know you were looking for a new job, right? I was referring to recruiters calling people out of the blue without first putting it out there that you are in the market for a new job,

LOL.... so your gauge of a healthy economy is when psychic recruiters contact anonymous unemployed people who have not posted any resume or online profile ...
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Old 05-09-2012, 12:42 PM
 
599 posts, read 456,806 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGreatCurve View Post
Yes, but you probably contacted them first to let them know you were looking for a new job, right? I was referring to recruiters calling people out of the blue without first putting it out there that you are in the market for a new job, like the calls gainfully employed people receive at work all the time.
No, actually I didn't contact them, except in the sense that I changed my status on my Linked In page.
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Old 05-09-2012, 01:05 PM
 
Location: In them thar hills
7,826 posts, read 9,278,201 times
Reputation: 3959
Quote:
Originally Posted by cardinal2007 View Post
There was a lot more manufacturing here 30 years ago, one obvious sign that there used to be a lot of manufacturing here are the large number of superfund, and former superfund sites around here. It seems that a lot of people didn't care what chemicals they leeched into the ground when they were making electronics back then. I for one I'm certainly glad we don't manufacture these products here anymore. Right now the areas that have the most growth are internet services and mobile applications. But we certainly still have large enterprise software companies here, as well as the headquarters for AMD and Intel, as well as Nvidia. This is definitely a boom period, but we are not recession proof, if you had been around in 2009 there were few companies hiring and there were a lot of stores closing shop, if you walked around downtown San Mateo, San Carlos, or Mountain View it wasn't rare to see a shuttered restaurant every 2 or so blocks, most of those places didn't become occupied until late 2010 or early 2011, last year hiring really took off in this area, so a lot of people have been moving here and rents have gone up a lot. That is nothing compared to 2001/2002 recession though. It seems like every 10 years something else becomes the big technology, and hiring takes off in that area. Semiconductor circuits, personal computers, computer software, internet services, mobile apps, there have been many booms and busts around here. For now companies like Facebook are making a ton of money advertising to people on that site, and Apple keeps making more and more money as the smartphone market grows, nowadays they are making about $40B in profit a year. A lot of tech companies are making money selling things worldwide since the developing economies are still growing during this time period.

So for the time being companies are going to "make hay while the sun shines" and hire people to make more products to sell or apps for people to use.
A lot of those Superfund sites date from activities during the 1960s and early to mid 70s. Practices put in place after that prevent additional contamination. Even as early as the mid 80s wafer fabs were recycling all their waste.
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