What's the big city alternative to Santa Fe? (Albuquerque, Rio Rancho: transplants, credit)

[loborick]

Originally Posted by finmqa1

For me, I would rather endure another 30 minutes in drive time to ride the stress free train rather than navigate I-25. As long as the scheduling works, I see myself using the train more than my car. Besides that will give us a chance to read and relax on the way up.

I know many people that live in the ABQ/RR/Bernalillo Area that can't wait for the train. A half hour a day to save $75 a week in gas plus the wear and tear on your vehicle is very much worth it to many people. The trains are comfortable, bright and have wireless internet. I'm hoping they have trains from SF to ABQ that I can ride to shop or go to Lobo games.

[finmqa1]

Originally Posted by loborick

I know many people that live in the ABQ/RR/Bernalillo Area that can't wait for the train. A half hour a day to save $75 a week in gas plus the wear and tear on your vehicle is very much worth it to many people. The trains are comfortable, bright and have wireless internet. I'm hoping they have trains from SF to ABQ that I can ride to shop or go to Lobo games.

I find it amazing that people would choose to drive considering the stress free environment of the train. The only issue I can see, is the train schedule, and whether it will operate on weekends.

[trailtramp]

For someone in their 20's looking for a city in the west with character, stimulating & friendly people, outdoor activities, decent nightlife & JOBS....Portland, Ore; Denver, Austin, Tucson, Sacramento...Albq would be at the end only because good job opportunities are considerably lower.

[vegaspilgrim]

Originally Posted by trailtramp

For someone in their 20's looking for a city in the west with character, stimulating & friendly people, outdoor activities, decent nightlife & JOBS....Portland, Ore; Denver, Austin, Tucson, Sacramento...Albq would be at the end only because good job opportunities are considerably lower.

Tucson? I'll give you the character, friendly people, and outdoor activities parts-- but I think you're mistaken aboout the nightlife and JOBS. I think Albuquerque is an improvement over Tucson in both of those categories.

[trailtramp]

That may be true. All of those places are stronger in one category than another. For example, I live in San Diego and think it is an infinitely better place to live than LA, but that is because I could give a flying you know what about celebrities, silicon, Hollywood, fashion and that whole trip. SD is a great place if you like the beaches, surfing and the mild climate. Great for families with kids because there are alot of amusement parks and that sort of entertainment. Gaslamp night life is good if you're into that. Still, SoCal has nearly 20 million people and thats a huge drag!

Personally I think Portland is by far and away the best mid size city in the country. It has a killer downtown and inner city area, with small parks and squares every few blocks, a great transit system, clean, safe, verdant. Great size city and job market. Probably the most green conscious city in the west. Decent nightlife without being over the top. A wonderful walking city. No superficial CA feel there. The Oregon coast is an hour away, wineries nearby and I think the most beautiful coast in the west. A plethora of hiking, camping, fishing, etc. The weather is typical Nortwest though with georgous summers then damp overcast winters. No place can be perfect!

Albquerque is my second favorite mid size western city. Funky like Portland, but in a laid back 'manana' sort or way. Dusty western artsy I guess. But really not much more going on in Albuquerque than Santa Fe, its just bigger. The city of Abq is not as beautiful but the surround high desert and mountains are georgous. I prefer the drier weather of NM over that of Oregon.

My question is, since Denver was first on your list, but you like the feel of Santa Fe, either pick one or the other. Denver is great, and a nice big city if thats what you need. From there, a close fix for occasional small town character is Durango or Telluride, if you have not been there they are both stunningly beautiful and very charming. Otherwise, make the move to Santa Fe and see how if feels for a year or two. Remember Abuquerque is only 45 minutes away and an easy move!

[vegaspilgrim]

Some good points, trailtramp. Never been to Portland before. I think I'm more of a southwestern type than a northwestern type. I completely agree with you about San Diego vs LA, in fact San Diego is one of my favorite cities. Durango is another good one. But Santa Fe is just as close to Denver as Durango is. Right now I'm trying to sort out all the responses I've received in my brain.

[EnjoyEP]

Hi vegas (if you are still checking in on this one) -

I was thinking a bit more about this the other day and had a couple of other thoughts for you on the whole "uniqueness" topic beyond my blatherings a while back in this thread...

Originally Posted by vegaspilgrim

This I should probably save for the Albuquerque forum rather than this forum (but honestly I don't think a Santa Fe forum can be 100% distinct from Albuquerque issues, especially with these whole ABQ-SF "megapolitan" thing going on; it's obvious to me that ABQ and SF, as different as they are, have somewhat of a symbiotic relationship and are not actually 100% self sufficient cities from one another, but I digress), but this claim of the essential uniqueness of Albuquerque absolutely fascinates me. You're not the first person to have said this on these forums; it's a common trend I keep noticing from the Albuquerque posters on city-data over and over again. Many forums have their boosters (see the Omaha and Scranton posters on the General US forum... and the Houston boosters, St Louis people, and LA boosters), but the claim of Albuquerque residents that their city is one of the most unique in the US is quite possibly the boldest claim I've heard of any big, regional US city. About the only other comparable city that really claims this is New Orleans. I look at this like an investigator trying to solve a mystery. I neither buy this claim nor disbelieve it. But I'm dying to know more.

This is not an abstract philosophical question. This actually goes to the heart of why I may be interested in living in Albuquerque (or Santa Fe, but let's leave that out of the picture just for one moment)-- or on the other hand why while I feel some feelings towards ABQ I haven't yet been sold on the idea to say I WANT to move to Albuquerque, with a statement of confidence. With a strictly investigative attitude, not intending to sound one bit condescending or cocky: what exactly is it that according to you and many other ABQ posters on this board, makes ABQ so different? ABQ has most of the same chains that everywhere else in the country has, does it not? ABQ has great Mexican food, but so does pretty much every other city in the southwest (including your favorite, El Paso), and arguably LA has some of the best, the most authentic, and the most diverse regional styles of Mexican (and central and south American) food in the US. I won't deny that Albuquerque may very well be a significant food city in its own right, but a whole slew of other cities also have characteristic local cuisine and innovative local restaurants and local chains. Nob Hill? An eclectic and happening area, no doubt which ABQ should be proud to have. But Nob Hill is nothing that LA or Berkeley or Brooklyn doesn't have. Architecture? Different, without a doubt. But Tucson is just as uniquely southwestern, stylistically, as Albuquerque.

Weather? No other city has weather exactly like Albuquerque. But if you've seen Denver in all its seasons, you've seen Phoenix in all its seasons, you've seen Tucson in all its seasons, there is pretty much nothing about Albuquerque's weather that is new or unfamiliar to the experience. (more on this later) The Sandia Mountains? Absolutely gorgeous, without a doubt in my mind, and one of the top reasons to live in Albuquerque. But (and I might take some heat for saying this, I know), pound for pound, Tucson's mountains, particularly the Catalina Mtns north of the city, but also the Rincons to the east, are every bit as beautiful as the Sandias. Although the way Albuquerque is shaped, more of Albuquerque has a mountain view than in Tucson. But pound for pound, the Catalina mountains are every bit as majestic.

***Now, obviously my prior nearly-Bible-length post on the "uniqueness" topic hit on most of the major "unique" points I was trying to hit on.

However, I just was struck on the head again this AM of why ABQ was so unique...

Take New Orleans. You cite that as another large US city that maybe comes close / 2nd to ABQ in the amount of times someone cites it as being such a unique US city.

I think that is probably a fair and an accurate observation. And I am guessing - educated guessing here - that New Orleans IS a very unique and distinct US city...I wouldn't know for certain as I have never been to NO. Yet, through reading, observation, conversation, etc., I have no doubt that NO is fairly unique compared to so many big US cities.

Having said that...New Orleans attracts non-New Orleans residents in DROVES! An NBA All Star game was recently held there, which attracted tons of tourists. Every year (outside of obviously the Katrina close-times), typical partiers have flocked upon NO for Mardi Gras and the related merriment. NO had hosted Final Fours and many a Super Bowl. Quite simply, NO - while surely in many ways unique - positioned itself quite successfully as one of the top tourist destinations in terms of pure numbers nearly every year; kind of a "party Vegas east" type of thing. While tourists don't define a city of course, such a steady and hearty dose sure does. Just like Vegas cannot be defined without considering the tourists and the strip, etc., you really can't consider the unique attributes of NO without factoring in the millions that have embarked on the city annually with their West Palm Beach / Las Vegas party aspirations.

I am not saying this is a BAD thing...I am just saying it is what it is. It surely takes much credence out of being an extremely unique city. Again, ABQ's uniqueness isn't necessarily a great thing...it is just a thing.

Most of the other towns you cited: Denver, LA, Brooklyn, Berkeley, etc. - so many people venture annually to them, know about them so well and tourist to them, I think that adds to the takeaway of intense uniqueness.

I guess the way I am thinking about it - and this is a loose and non-perfect comparison so bear with me - to me, if you want a unique Mexican city experience, you would be more needing to go to Chihuahua City or Monterrey instead of Cabo San Lucas or Tijuana or Cancun. All of those cities are truly Mexican too of course, but the ones with much less "tourism" factor certainly give you a distinct flavor from those that have so much tourism. Again, not a perfect example and my US cities comparison isn't equal to this one, but it somewhat exemplifies my point.

The one city that I would most tend to agree with you on...and I have always thought this...would be Tucson. I agree that Tucson does have much claim to being one of the more unique big cities in the US. I will fully cede that. For that reason, I actually really like Tucson.

Frankly, Tucson in many ways (in layout of the city, proximity to mountains, etc.), reminds me of ABQ.

I guess to me - and of course I have never lived in Tucson - Tucson still doesn't have that hundreds-of-years-old distinct ABQ and NM culture that still permeates through ABQ living so distinctly today...even to the most gringo of gringo and the most transplant of transplant. Tucson also seems to have just gotten bit by a fairly moderate dosage of "Phoenix bleed over" to where many parts of Tucson start to very closely take under by the folks that have moved from Phoenix (and likely originally from elsewhere). There seems to be more of an affluent snowbird presence in Tucson...again, nothing wrong with that...but just somewhat a place for folks that would've snowbirded to Phoenix but they wanted to be "unique" so their alternative was Tucson; problem is that it isn't terribly unique anymore with so many others doing the same.

I don't know. Again, I love Tucson and agree with you largely. I could easily live there. I prefer ABQ's temps, but whatever. Tucson is a great place to me. But in terms of uniqueness, while somewhat comparable, it just seems more bland/vanilla/culturally non-significant in many spots (not all of Tucson for sure) almost more comparable to a mini-Phoenix than an ABQ.

[ziaAirmac]

Great post as always, EnjoyEP. This thought struck me as being particularly sublime:

Originally Posted by EnjoyEP

...Frankly, Tucson in many ways (in layout of the city, proximity to mountains, etc.), reminds me of Tucson. ...

Hey, if you can't have fun with friends, who can you have fun with?

[EnjoyEP]

Originally Posted by ziaAirmac

Great post as always, EnjoyEP. This thought struck me as being particularly sublime:





Hey, if you can't have fun with friends, who can you have fun with?

Awwww...you caught my idiocy there!!

Thanks to the "magical powers of being a prestigious CD Mod", I was able to go back and edit "Tucson to Tucson" to "Tucson to ABQ"...although darnit all, those mountains in Tucson DO remind me of Tucson!!!

[domino]

I find that El Paso is actually much more unique than Albuquerque . . . in both good and bad ways. If not for the Rio Grande, it would be hard to tell where the border is.