Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: Sarasota/ Bradenton - University Pkwy area
4,615 posts, read 7,537,235 times
Reputation: 6036
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpbarr2000
Under FL real estate law, a buyer can cancel a contract at any time up until they review the HOA disclosure and rules and regs. For a condo, there is a 3 day right of recission after receipt of the "condo docs". So this isn't something that "should be done". A good agent knows the law and makes sure the buyer has the necessary disclosures and documents.
The HOA Disclosure Addendum states that if the disclosure summary addendum was not provided to prospective purchaser before executing the contract, the buyer can void the contract within 3 days after receipt of the disclosure summary or prior to closing, whichever occurs first.
The document goes on to state that as buyer in this community they will be obligated to be a member of a HOA, obligated to pay assessments, may have a lien placed on their property for failure to pay assessments, and that there are restrictive covenants & as a purchaser you should refer to the covenants before purchasing property, documents are either public record or can be obtained from the developer if not recorded.
Nowhere do I find language stating the buyer can cancel the contract up until they review the rules and regs.
If the HOA disclosure addendum is included in the original purchase offer (and it should be if there's a mandatory HOA), then buyers no longer have an option out under the HOA addendum. So I stick by my advice that buyers should review the deed restrictions before signing a contract.
The HOA Disclosure Addendum states that if the disclosure summary addendum was not provided to prospective purchaser before executing the contract, the buyer can void the contract within 3 days after receipt of the disclosure summary or prior to closing, whichever occurs first.
The document goes on to state that as buyer in this community they will be obligated to be a member of a HOA, obligated to pay assessments, may have a lien placed on their property for failure to pay assessments, and that there are restrictive covenants & as a purchaser you should refer to the covenants before purchasing property, documents are either public record or can be obtained from the developer if not recorded.
Nowhere do I find language stating the buyer can cancel the contract up until they review the rules and regs.
If the HOA disclosure addendum is included in the original purchase offer (and it should be if there's a mandatory HOA), then buyers no longer have an option out under the HOA addendum. So I stick by my advice that buyers should review the deed restrictions before signing a contract.
Let me help you out here.
FL As-Is Sales Contract: page 4 paragraph G. The buyer should not execute the contract until they have RECEIVED AND READ a copy of the home owner's association rules and regulations.
The addendum says the same thing.
Your advice to buyers that they "SHOULD READ" the HOA disclosure goes against the language in the contract that the buyer SHOULD NOT execute the contract until they get the documents.
I stated that the buyer can cancel the contract any time if they have not received the HOA disclosure. Any experienced Realtor knows that this can be used by the buyer to cancel at any time.
Location: Sarasota/ Bradenton - University Pkwy area
4,615 posts, read 7,537,235 times
Reputation: 6036
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpbarr2000
Let me help you out here.
FL As-Is Sales Contract: page 4 paragraph G. The buyer should not execute the contract until they have RECEIVED AND READ a copy of the home owner's association rules and regulations.
The addendum says the same thing.
Your advice to buyers that they "SHOULD READ" the HOA disclosure goes against the language in the contract that the buyer SHOULD NOT execute the contract until they get the documents.
I stated that the buyer can cancel the contract any time if they have not received the HOA disclosure. Any experienced Realtor knows that this can be used by the buyer to cancel at any time.
Nice try, and fail.
Copied directly from the Far-Bar As Is Contract paragraph in question:
HOMEOWNERS’ ASSOCIATION/COMMUNITY DISCLOSURE: BUYER SHOULD NOT EXECUTE THIS
CONTRACT UNTIL BUYER HAS RECEIVED AND READ THE HOMEOWNERS’ ASSOCIATION/COMMUNITY DISCLOSURE, IF APPLICABLE.
Disclosure, not HOA rules and regulations as you state. The comprehensive contract rider commonly referred to as the HOA Addendum is titled "B. HOMEOWNER'S ASSOCIATION/COMMUNITY DISCLOSURE.
The paragraph on page 4, paragraph G, refers to the buyer receiving and reading THE ADDENDUM.
If you go back to my previous post I added a link to the actual addendum in question.
Here is a summary of the items pertaining to HOA documents:
Item (a) states buyers will be obligated to be members of a HOA
Item (b) states there are or will be recorded covenants governing the use of properties in this community
Item (g) states the developer may have the right to amend the restrictive covenants without approval of the association members
Item (h) states the statements here are only summary in nature and buyers should refer to the covenants & governing documents before purchasing property
Item (i) states the documents are either public record or can be obtained from the developer
Any experienced Realtor should know that if there is a mandatory HOA, this addendum is required to be included in the contract. If the addendum was provided to the buyer BEFORE executing the contract, which should have been done, then the buyer does NOT have an option out after signing the contract based on getting and reading the HOA docs later.
Seller’s Delivery of HOA Governing Documents. Many realtors are under the mistaken impression that the statute requires the seller to deliver to a purchaser copies of the association’s articles, by-laws or the community’s rules and regulations, financials or declaration of restrictive covenants. The seller is not required to deliver these documents under the statute. It is the purchaser’s responsibility, unless the parties contractually agree otherwise.
I don't know how clearer I can explain the definition of "is" to you.
You are really off on a tangent. I never stated that it was the seller's responsibility to provide documents.
You are completely wrong about being able to cancel the contract.. If the buyer signs a contract and it is fully executed BEFORE the buyer has received and read the HOA rules and regs, the buyer can cancel without reason.
Location: Sarasota/ Bradenton - University Pkwy area
4,615 posts, read 7,537,235 times
Reputation: 6036
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpbarr2000
You are really off on a tangent. I never stated that it was the seller's responsibility to provide documents.
You are completely wrong about being able to cancel the contract.. If the buyer signs a contract and it is fully executed BEFORE the buyer has received and read the HOA rules and regs, the buyer can cancel without reason.
Your statement is incorrect.
Neither the Far-Bar contract paragraph nor the HOA Addendum gives the buyer the right to cancel the contract after reading the HOA rules & regs.
READ the paragraph from the contract -- it only states the buyer should not sign the contract until they have read the HOA addendum that is titled Homeowners Association/Community Disclosure. Nothing about buyer being able to cancel the contract after reading the HOA docs.
READ the actual addendum. The HOA Disclosure Addendum states that if the disclosure summary addendum was not provided to prospective purchaser before executing the contract, the buyer can void the contract within 3 days after receipt of the disclosure summary or prior to closing, whichever occurs first. Nowhere does it state the buyer can cancel after reading the HOA docs.
I've posted the exact language of the contract paragraph in question and a link to the full HOA addendum on this thread. Neither state what you claim they do. I have no clue how you read into either document what you claim exists there.
I suggest that perhaps you should take this discussion up with your current broker and have the broker explain it to you so that you comprehend the correct interpretation before you get yourself and your broker into a legal dilemma over your refusal to accept the irrefutable facts.
Our agent was adamant that we read the Rotonda West HOA Deed Restrictions and "laws" beFORE signing the contract. She even printed them out and gave them to us. I just "assumed" all agents did that. If not, they should... at least as far as I'm concerned.
Our agent was adamant that we read the Rotonda West HOA Deed Restrictions and "laws" beFORE signing the contract. She even printed them out and gave them to us. I just "assumed" all agents did that. If not, they should... at least as far as I'm concerned.
They should if they don't want a buyer who gets cold feet to cancel with no reason, because they did not review the HOA rules prior to signing the contract.
Neither the Far-Bar contract paragraph nor the HOA Addendum gives the buyer the right to cancel the contract after reading the HOA rules & regs.
READ the paragraph from the contract -- it only states the buyer should not sign the contract until they have read the HOA addendum that is titled Homeowners Association/Community Disclosure. Nothing about buyer being able to cancel the contract after reading the HOA docs.
READ the actual addendum. The HOA Disclosure Addendum states that if the disclosure summary addendum was not provided to prospective purchaser before executing the contract, the buyer can void the contract within 3 days after receipt of the disclosure summary or prior to closing, whichever occurs first. Nowhere does it state the buyer can cancel after reading the HOA docs.
I've posted the exact language of the contract paragraph in question and a link to the full HOA addendum on this thread. Neither state what you claim they do. I have no clue how you read into either document what you claim exists there.
I suggest that perhaps you should take this discussion up with your current broker and have the broker explain it to you so that you comprehend the correct interpretation before you get yourself and your broker into a legal dilemma over your refusal to accept the irrefutable facts.
I suggest you call the FAR legal hotline. They will give you the same answer I provided you. Your attempt at obfuscating with long winded replies actually is showing that I was right and you're trying to save face.
FL As-Is Sales Contract: page 4 paragraph G. The buyer should not execute the contract until they have RECEIVED AND READ a copy of the home owner's association rules and regulations.
The addendum says the same thing.
This is wrong. The As Is contract page 4 paragraph G states only:
(g) HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION/COMMUNITY DISCLOSURE: BUYER SHOULD NOT EXECUTE THIS CONTRACT UNTIL BUYER HAS RECEIVED AND READ THE HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION/COMMUNITY DISCLOSURE, IF APPLICABLE.
The addendum states:
B. HOMEOWNERS' ASSOCIATION/COMMUNITY DISCLOSURE
IF THE DISCLOSURE SUMMARY REQUIRED BY SECTION 720.401, FLORIDA STATUTES, HAS NOT BEEN PROVIDED TO THE PROSPECTIVE PURCHASER BEFORE EXECUTING THIS CONTRACT FOR SALE, THIS CONTRACT IS VOIDABLE BY BUYER BY DELIVERING TO SELLER OR SELLER'S AGENT OR REPRESENTATIVE WRITTEN NOTICE OF THE BUYER'S INTENTION TO CANCEL WITHIN 3 DAYS AFTER RECEIPT OF THE DISCLOSURE SUMMARY OR PRIOR TO CLOSING, WHICHEVER OCCURS FIRST. ANY PURPORTED WAIVER OF THIS VOIDABILITY RIGHT HAS NO EFFECT. BUYER'S RIGHT TO VOID THIS CONTRACT SHALL TERMINATE AT CLOSING.
BUYER SHOULD NOT EXECUTE THIS CONTRACT UNTIL BUYER HAS RECEIVED AND READ THIS DISCLOSURE.
There is nothing there about reading, accepting, or otherwise considering the documents. It is all about the disclosure itself. If the disclosure that there is an HOA is not made before the contract is executed, then the buyer can void the contract anytime within 3 days after receiving the disclosure (not the docs) but no later than the closing which only makes sense.
That's the way I read it, anyway. If a buyer has concerns re: the meaning of the wording, he or she should consult an attorney.
Q: My buyer submitted an offer on a house, and the seller accepted it yesterday. The buyer has changed his mind, and feels that because the house is in a mandatory homeowners’ association that there is a three-day rescission period in which he can cancel without incurring liability. The seller provided the buyer with the “Disclosure Summary” pursuant to Section 720.401, Florida Statutes and the contract also complies with Section 720.401 requirements. Does the buyer have a three-day right to cancel?
A: No. Unless the contract includes a provision giving the buyer three days to cancel, the buyer would not have such a right.
The HOA / Community Disclosure is basically a heads up to buyers warning them about what is involved in purchasing where there's a mandatory HOA with powers to impose liens for nonpayments of fees. The "warning" is mandatory, but not any sort of review period of HOA documents. If it were, the terms for the HOA documents review period would be specifically spelled out in the contract addendum, as they are for condo purchases.
Buyers, always read each page of the contract, addendums and any other disclosures you are required to sign when making an offer BEFORE you actually sign them, because should there be problems later on, the lawyers will look at what you actually signed vs what you THOUGHT you signed. If in doubt, consult a local real estate attorney for further guidance. A consultation fee up front will be a lot less expensive than attorney fees for settling a dispute over terms after a contract is executed.
PS: I emailed a local, very well respected real estate attorney today regarding this thread and the he said/she said points of view. This is the reply I received this evening:
Diane,
You are correct in saying:
"The HOA Disclosure Addendum states that if the disclosure summary addendum was not provided to prospective purchaser before executing the contract, the buyer can void the contract within 3 days after receipt of the disclosure summary or prior to closing, whichever occurs first. Nowhere does it state the buyer can cancel after reading the HOA docs."
If a Buyer has not seen the recorded HOA docs prior to making an offer, we recommend making the contract contingent on the buyer obtaining and reviewing the recorded docs. Otherwise, you are right on base that the buyer does not have the right to cancel under the HOA Addendum.
So there's the answer from the attorney -- if you want the right to review the recorded HOA documents, make the contract contingent on it. Otherwise you do not have a right to cancel under the HOA addendum if you later read the HOA docs and don't like what you've read.
Last edited by Sunshine Rules; 08-28-2015 at 06:26 PM..
Reason: Added response from lawyer.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
