55,000$ for two in Sarasota? (University: credit, student loans, house)

[Shabotnik]

"(Property taxes provide the state with the money that comes from income taxes in other states, so as a renter, you are off the hook on taxes)."

The idea that renters don't pay real estate taxes is nonsense. No, they don't pay directly, but real estate taxes are part of the cost of doing business as a landlord and are built into his expenses. Any landlord that doesn't calculate real estate taxes doesn't have a clue what his costs are and without knowing his costs can't know if he's making a wise investment or not.

And he ain't payin' 'em. The tenants are.

[beninfl]

Originally Posted by Shabotnik

"(Property taxes provide the state with the money that comes from income taxes in other states, so as a renter, you are off the hook on taxes)."

The idea that renters don't pay real estate taxes is nonsense. No, they don't pay directly, but real estate taxes are part of the cost of doing business as a landlord and are built into his expenses. Any landlord that doesn't calculate real estate taxes doesn't have a clue what his costs are and without knowing his costs can't know if he's making a wise investment or not.

And he ain't payin' 'em. The tenants are.

Bingo. That's why a mortgage is $1000 and rent is $2000.

There's no free lunch in society! (Science friends will instantly laugh, because I tell them that the Universe is the ultimate free lunch, but that's a quantum mechanical story for another subforum not for here )

[Cardiff by the Sea]

Originally Posted by Shabotnik

"(Property taxes provide the state with the money that comes from income taxes in other states, so as a renter, you are off the hook on taxes)."

The idea that renters don't pay real estate taxes is nonsense. No, they don't pay directly, but real estate taxes are part of the cost of doing business as a landlord and are built into his expenses. Any landlord that doesn't calculate real estate taxes doesn't have a clue what his costs are and without knowing his costs can't know if he's making a wise investment or not.

And he ain't payin' 'em. The tenants are.

Thank you for reminding me of why I have pretty much stopped posting here.


I believe I understand a landlords costs. My husband and I are professional landlords. The property taxes on our 24 unit building went from $19,000 last year to $26,000 this year. That is more than a 33% increase. We did not pass all of that cost on to our tenants. Normally we would raise rent $25 a month. This year we are going to raise it $35. So yes the tenants are paying property tax increase but not the bulk of it.


Typically the cost of renting and buying are comparable, excluding the tax saving of being an owner. If your theory were correct, the cost of renting would be the cost of buying plus the property taxes the tenant is paying for the landlord.

Florida is not a landlord friendly state in terms of profitability. In California we were able to buy at at the same price point, rent for about 20% more, and our property taxes were only about 20% of what they are here. Incomes are so low here that there is a lid on rent. Your contention seems to have an implicit belief that owning rental property is equally profitable across the United States and that landlords can pass all costs on to renters. If rents get too high, tenants move and you have turnover costs. Yes, landlords determine whether the aftertax cash flow makes an investment worthwhile, but the landlords cut is just lower in Florida. The Sunshine tax applies to landlords as well. We as landlords were willing to get a lower return on investment here than California because we wanted certain quality of life factors we could get here.

I stand by my contention that in Florida it is better to be a renter than an owner and that renters pay lower housing costs than owners if you take property taxes into consideration. You contention that renters pay the property taxes is technically correct but does not result in higher housing costs than owners have. The original poster is only concerned about her affordability and her cash flow/not the landlords.

[macrodome2]

Originally Posted by Cardiff by the Sea

I believe I understand a landlords costs. My husband and I are professional landlords. The property taxes on our 24 unit building went from $19,000 last year to $26,000 this year. That is more than a 33% increase. We did not pass all of that cost on to our tenants. Normally we would raise rent $25 a month. This year we are going to raise it $35. So yes the tenants are paying property tax increase but not the bulk of it.

Amazes me that the county/local government can raise taxes by that percentage then turn around and cry that there is no affordable housing. How would they expect builders to build affordable housing when they can turn around and raise taxes by that percentage?

And if I remember correctly, the Herald Tribune had an article about Sarasota letting Benderson out of their affordable house commitment for building that mall. Followed by another article that since Sarasota County has not been holding the builders to the quotas needed for affordable housing, they just lowered the quota.

Editorial: Broken promise on affordable housing | HeraldTribune.com

[gypsychic]

Unfortunately, Sarasota has always been one of those cities with a lack of "affordable" housing. It has been that way as long as I can remember (going back to the 70s) and probably always will be. It is supply and demand, and there are enough wealthy people here who can afford the high prices that there is no motivation for builders and investors to create affordable places to live (as evidenced by Cardiff's post).

It is like this in wealthy cities across America. Sarasota is really out of control with their taxes, fees, etc. I am glad I live in Manatee County. It's a bit better here at least.

[beninfl]

I'm against "affordable housing". If you want slums to live in, move to another area. Thank you for keeping ours nice and clean. Keep your section 8 and government owned housing projects elsewhere. And for gods sake, if you cant afford your dream house, get a job so you can. McDonalds is not a $15/hr job and never should be. It's for a teenage boy to work at. Not middle aged men/women.

[twamu]

Originally Posted by beninfl

I'm against "affordable housing". If you want slums to live in, move to another area. Thank you for keeping ours nice and clean. Keep your section 8 and government owned housing projects elsewhere. And for gods sake, if you cant afford your dream house, get a job so you can. McDonalds is not a $15/hr job and never should be. It's for a teenage boy to work at. Not middle aged men/women.

This might be who it's intended for, but it isn't reality.

I easily could've had an anazing, profitable career in the industry my PhD is in. But I didn't, and it's because I chose to spend ~20 years raising my kids instead. There's a lot of reasons why an adult might need to work a minimum wage job, and they deserve to live off of it.

I didn't spend all that time doing nothing, but it's not exactly stuff I can put on a resume. I'm lucky I that I also maintained a full-time job, so I can hopefully get something similar on Sarasota. I don't want to live in the slums. I want to live somewhere with air conditioning and pipes that don't leak. Sorry if you don't think I don't deserve it.

[Cardiff by the Sea]

Originally Posted by beninfl

I'm against "affordable housing". If you want slums to live in, move to another area. Thank you for keeping ours nice and clean. Keep your section 8 and government owned housing projects elsewhere. And for gods sake, if you cant afford your dream house, get a job so you can. McDonalds is not a $15/hr job and never should be. It's for a teenage boy to work at. Not middle aged men/women.

Only 2.6% of workers work in minimum wage jobs. These are not people seeking their dream home.

Affordable housing is not a synonym for government supported housing. Affordable housing is not a synonym for slum.

HUD's definition of AFFORDABLE HOUSING: In general, housing for which the occupant(s) is/are paying no more than 30 percent of his or her income for gross housing costs, including utilities. So Ben, what you are saying is you are opposed to people being able to rent places that cost less than 30% of their incomes. Is that really what you mean?

The reason there is a shortage of affordable housing in Sarasota is that incomes are lower here. The median household income nationwide is $53,000, whereas in Sarasota it is $49,000.

It is not just minimum wage people who are having trouble finding affordable housing. A recent study of housing in Sarasota found that lack of affordable housing was a chief concern for young professional.

Study says not enough affordable housing in Sarasota County - Sarasota News | Mysuncoast.com and ABC 7: News

[Chester Burnett]

Originally Posted by twamu

This might be who it's intended for, but it isn't reality.

I easily could've had an anazing, profitable career in the industry my PhD is in. But I didn't, and it's because I chose to spend ~20 years raising my kids instead. There's a lot of reasons why an adult might need to work a minimum wage job, and they deserve to live off of it.

I didn't spend all that time doing nothing, but it's not exactly stuff I can put on a resume. I'm lucky I that I also maintained a full-time job, so I can hopefully get something similar on Sarasota. I don't want to live in the slums. I want to live somewhere with air conditioning and pipes that don't leak. Sorry if you don't think I don't deserve it.

You should do some research on jobs in your field in this area if you haven't already done so. Jobs in Sarasota are much, much harder to find than they are up north and pay significantly less. I know that was said elsewhere in this thread but it bears repeating. I wouldn't recommend moving here unless you already have work lined up and you have at enough savings to last at least 12 months.

[Harbor Hopper]

Originally Posted by beninfl

pre-tax? Tight. post-tax? You'll be fine.

My thoughts exactly