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Old 05-01-2009, 02:46 AM
 
Location: kcmo
713 posts, read 1,797,657 times
Reputation: 364

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I thought of this fun scenario.. while driving around niagara falls today..

so here's the premise

For whatever reason.. 99.9% of the population on the planet has just disappeared and it's your mission to re-start society with say a handhold of 10,000 americans or so.. unlucky for you from all walks of life.. taxi drivers and moms mostly

(in small part I stole this plot from a sci-fi book I read.. which’s name I can’t remember)

The idea.. is what city would choose to inhabit to re-start once you got all these people together and maybe got them to get along?? where and why??

Why I came up with this scenario is a I realized power/electricity would be a critical issue and power from dams might be the best way to go about it.. assuming you could get yourself either enough decent people to keep the damn running/maintained..

So in the spirit of shows like.. "life after people"
scenario rules..

1. Name your city
2. Name a basic timetable (remember for example that new york subways would be flooded without daily maintenance and if 10,000 people exist it's not all going to be in new york )
3. Name your rebuilding of infrastructure.. power/electricity, oil? and food/farms.. etc.
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Old 05-01-2009, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Somewhere in northern Alabama
15,598 posts, read 47,192,788 times
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"For whatever reason.. 99.9% of the population on the planet has just disappeared and it's your mission to re-start society with say a handhold of 10,000 americans or so.. unlucky for you from all walks of life.. taxi drivers and moms mostly"

Depends. Would those be Jewish mothers? If so, nothing you could do would be right.

There would be little cohesiveness to the group. The stores of canned and preserved food would be good for at least a few years, and the supplies of gas and power would serve such a small population base for a long time. That would mean a natural dispersion, which would thwart any great plan that didn't involve force. That small a population sample would create some genetic risks that most sci-fi doesn't address. Other than that, tightly knit religious groups would stand a better chance of survival and growth.
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Old 05-03-2009, 12:54 PM
 
Location: kcmo
713 posts, read 1,797,657 times
Reputation: 364
Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
There would be little cohesiveness to the group. The stores of canned and preserved food would be good for at least a few years, and the supplies of gas and power would serve such a small population base for a long time. That would mean a natural dispersion, which would thwart any great plan that didn't involve force. That small a population sample would create some genetic risks that most sci-fi doesn't address. Other than that, tightly knit religious groups would stand a better chance of survival and growth.
Yah, but the problem is if you go the "mad max/postman" route.. your doomed to have those supplies run out.. without the infastructure.. so you didn't name the key name.. what city?
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Old 05-03-2009, 03:08 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
79 posts, read 181,420 times
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Everyone would relocate to the Hoover Dam and surrounding area (just need to make sure to keep the underwater vents clear of mollusks). We would integrate the availability of electricity with a neo-primitive lifestyle. It would be used for basic amenities such as cooking, cleaning & keeping warm in the winter but many of the 'creature comforts' of our previous lives would more than likely hold no meaning in the current scenario seeing as we would need to grow our own food, make our own clothes & maintain our own quality of life. There would be no gender roles, so if a woman wants to go out and hunt for food while a man stays behind and washes clothes, that's fine.

As with all civilizations, however, over time it would probably evolve from a tribal culture to something more modern, though how long that would be I don't know.
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Old 05-03-2009, 10:04 PM
 
Location: kcmo
713 posts, read 1,797,657 times
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You really think modern people would make a leap backwards over time?

Hmm.. you'd be a good sci-fi writer

I disagree on that one point.. your other statements sound good.. except.. I think the hoover damn is mainly desert.. not the best place to start over again?

In fact your scenario brings up more questions than answers.. for example.. using electric heating elements for cooking/heating.. well these would wear out over time?? so that means you'd need infastructure of mines, metal working too boot.. it's interesting how you peer down the rabbit hole on this one and it get's deeper and deeper..

I guess I should point rule 4.. it's like a automatic for me but..

4. long term thinking
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Old 05-03-2009, 10:10 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
79 posts, read 181,420 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themaster View Post
You really think modern people would make a leap backwards?

Hmm.. you'd be a good sci-fi writer

I disagree on that one point.. your other statements sound good.. except.. I think the hoover damn is mainly desert.. not the best place to start over again?
I don't think people would have a choice, the only ones unwilling to make a leap backwards would die from starvation and/or exposure to the elements. Not to mention the more lavishly we live, the more attention we draw to ourselves from the outside (which might not necessarily be a good thing).

Also, the desert would make a prime spot for survival. Food can be found but it would also be a deterrant to other human societies with invasion on their mind; plus water would be one of the most prized commodities in that time period, of which we would have a near limitless supply.

Wildlife at Hoover Dam

Also, when speaking of amenities, we're not talking stoves and microwaves and refridgerators. I mean, things like hotplates, toaster ovens... small, easily replaceable items. With so many deserted towns/cities there would be no short supply of reusable items. Things like fuel would have to be closely monitored, probably have some kind of motor pool for going out and scavenging.

Last edited by Digital Entropy; 05-03-2009 at 10:20 PM..
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Old 05-03-2009, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Lemon Grove, CA USA
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With populations that small many will die from the spread of disease and sudden rampage of scavengers and other wild animals. You couldn't move into a large city... it would be too hard to clean up and there is no way such a small population could maintain it.

My route would be a whole new start. Find a river as far upstream as possible. Probably something at the base of a mountain in a wildlife preserve. There are already tons of examples of green living and even more primitive living to model your town after. Scavenging would be easy. At that level of population you would have all the building materials, resources and other materials you would ever need to build a self sustaining community. Hunting and gardening would be plenty to start (supplementing the goods gathered from nearby towns) but that would expand into farming and ranching as the populations grew.

From the start the intent would have to be self sustainability. Sure you can stockpile enough to keep the town supplied for years (canned goods, refer trucks, fuel trucks, guns, ammo, building materials, etc) but you would have to start day one with the intent of sustainability.

I doubt there would be a significant loss of technology in the long term but on the short term there will be no need or ability to sustain things like clean rooms, chip fabs, NASA, etc. The thing is the technology and books/knowledge will still be there even if it isn't used for the next few decades.

Just think about it. Gas stations and refineries full of fuel, groceries stores and warehouses full of canned goods and other staples, hardware stores full of well.. hardware. That coupled with all the tanker trucks, refer trucks, construction equipment, etc you could ever want. Strip the solar panels from existing homes or raid warehouses, same for windmills and other sustainable power sources and you could build an awesome town.
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Old 05-04-2009, 12:55 AM
 
Location: kcmo
713 posts, read 1,797,657 times
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Yah, but you see I've seen a few sci-fi's and at least one of those "life after people"

And the theory is.. that a lot of it would burn down or be gobbled by nature.. your right to say you could scavenge some.. but not all.. movies I can think off.. that reference disasters somewhat the right way..

- Day of the Triffids (both)
- 28 Days\Weeks Later
And as mentioned earlier the postman.. not necessarily "the road warrior" would I befit as a realistic scenario for life as proposed above.. (actually I can name a few more but this should do.. )

I think your wrong on trusting the technology to be there.. the world could flood over or something on top of it.. a backup plan would be to keep a copy of books and or quite a few internet servers/digital libraries at your proposed based..

You also asking 10k people to learn new things they don't know like construction, sewage.. power.. farming.. (obviously in our proposed scenario you will have random experts all over the place.. well hopefully ) that isn't a bad thing.. but that sounds hard, massively complicated.. and maybe a moral problem or worse..

The only problem I have with your plan Digital is that your plan involves going backwards.. at some point if people go backwards like you say.. they won't even be at hoover any more.. they'll scatter like the wind or like the indians did.. and form up new tribes as you say.. so I think the point of gathering at the hoover would fail.. I mean if they’re going tribal anyway.. they’re not going to maintain the hoover what it will collapse in 30 years anyway right?

Thanks for the posts guys.. we might well be writing a sci-fi novel.. you have some nice imaginations
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Old 05-04-2009, 01:07 AM
 
Location: New Jersey
79 posts, read 181,420 times
Reputation: 47
Actually, in the original Life After People special, the Hoover dam was the last man-made structure to crumble something like 500 years after people. It's pretty much set to run on it's own with minimal maintenance (the mollusk problem I referenced earlier for example as well as maintaining structural integrity but hey, plenty of shellfish to live off of!).

I also think the people can learn, it's part of the tenacity of the human spirit. Yes there will be quite a bit of dissension to start but I think there will be a lot more people willing to do what it takes to survive than those who would live in denial about the state of things.

Remember too, water is the source of life and having such easy access to it would certainly quell a lot of potential future problems. I think to leave that kind of safety would be a death sentence only the most reckless would consider.
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Maryland not Murlin
8,153 posts, read 20,734,915 times
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10,000 Americans? Why Americans? That's pretty centric, isn't it? Seeing as how most Americans don't seem to care for formal education (just read the Education forums on CD), nor do they seem to have the hunting skills necessary to survive because everybody got lazy, doesn't want to learn or do anything for themselves, I'd say, we'd be doomed.

I would round-up everyone that knows how to use a gun, hunt, fish, trap, and anyone else with a useful skill or brain-power, scour the city for ammunition and weapons, move into a rural community, and to hell with everyone else. Anyone who is too ignorant to exists now without all of the conveniences and entitlement, are worthless as far as I am concerned. Children, elderly, and disabled excluded.
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