Seattle vs. San Francisco (Kirkland, Olympia: sales, apartments, renting)

[rob1in]

To Symi81,

I'm not saying that liberals are not progressive, I for one am a liberal from New York City. All I am saying is that in N.Y.C. and San Fran the the liberals for the most part take care of them selves and look decent. Most N.Y. and San Fran intellectuals are super liberal, yet you don't have to look like crap while being it.(or smell bad). I am a liberal from New York City, but I sure as hell have enough respect for myself to look somewhat decent. Liberals are supposed to be progressive, the more intelligent ones, yet I look at these pictures and I can state that the whole rebellious teen side of liberalism just looks visually gross. I would feel the same way about a conservative in Arkansas driving around in a nasty sweatshirt and baseball cap with a wife beater underneith chewing tabacco. That's just as bad and it HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH INDIVIDUALISM. It just looks bad. So im my mind, the hippie in seattle is just as an eyesore are the redneck in Arkansas, since they both equally look like crap. Now your probably going to call me superficial and shallow but I am more of an intellectual. I don't like the whole L.A./Miami/Las Vegas superficial thing . I'm a New Yorker at heart and love New York City liberalism since not only is it mentally and emotionaly progressive, it is also visually and physically as well. The reason I started this thread was I was just curious on which city had more because I was debating with a friend about it and he said more were in San Fran and I said seattle. That's All.

[magrack]

You're cracking me up.

I lived for 28 years in the greater Puget sound area and recently retired to Arkansas.

I'm somewhat of a social liberal and a fiscal conservative, basically a Constitutionalist.

I'm a registered Independent but some friends think I'm more a Libertarian in some ways, which only demonstrates that people who live outside of NYC are more complex than you might realize

You've managed to stereotype the two places I've last lived in, with what I consider the stereotypical New Yawker attitude.

Since you've admitted to visiting Seattle, but not Arkansas, I'm going to assume that your view of Arkansas is based on what you've "heard" as opposed to what you've experienced.

Sure, I sometimes wear a dirty sweatshirt; it's kind of hard to keep up the property and not get dirty, and if I need to run down to the hardware store for something, I don't bother to change clothes, because it's not necessary (I'm just going to get dirty when I get back), and I don't chew tobacco, and more importantly, I don't judge those who do. It's their life, and as a social liberal, I would never attempt to change other people to fit my idea of what is or is not right for them, quite unlike some who "know" what's best for everyone else.

No wonder people look at New York City dwellers as lacking an understanding of flyover country.

Sophistication is not measured in where you live, what you eat, or what you've read, but in what you've experienced and how you treat those who are different from you.

Best you stay on the other side of the Hudson River; "here there be tygers". 8>)

[jwb123]

Those pictures only show the "street kids". Seattle, in the spring and summer, has an extremely high population of homeless street kids that come up for the good weather and festivals. They migrate to "wherever" when the few weeks of summer is over.

There are many progressive intelligent liberals who aren't dressed "dirty" and aren't street kids.

[pwright1]

My point was not to make fun of or call people dirty. Coming from D.C. you simply didn't see much of the so-called hippy whites with dreadlocks or even anything like Hempfest. Seattle Hempfest 2006

[jwb123]

Seattle has progressive liberals of all "looks", size, age, etc. Not just the dirty, "neo-hippies" or whatever label people want to use.

As I said, I am a liberal. I consider myself educated, and I am definitely not dirty. I have never even BEEN to hempfest, nor known anyone who has.

[SFExpat]

Seattleites think they're worldly and diverse. Having lived here for 3 years and having grown up in SF I can only say one thing: Seattle is the whitest city in America (look it up). If diversity means you're Irish and I'm German, then maybe Seattle is.

This city is full of a bunch of passive aggressive self-righteous (I'm going to drive 60 in the left lane because that's the speed limit dammit) people who don't realize this is not longer the quaint frontier town it once was (no public transport to speak of and 30 years of dickering whether to replace the seismically endangered viaduct and 520 bridge). Take me back to SF, where they KNOW rather than THINK they live in a world class city.

[scirocco22]

Originally Posted by SFExpat

Seattleites think they're worldly and diverse. Having lived here for 3 years and having grown up in SF I can only say one thing: Seattle is the whitest city in America (look it up). If diversity means you're Irish and I'm German, then maybe Seattle is.

This city is full of a bunch of passive aggressive self-righteous (I'm going to drive 60 in the left lane because that's the speed limit dammit) people who don't realize this is not longer the quaint frontier town it once was (no public transport to speak of and 30 years of dickering whether to replace the seismically endangered viaduct and 520 bridge). Take me back to SF, where they KNOW rather than THINK they live in a world class city.

I've tried to look that up many times in many places and I can never get a straight or definitive answer. All that I know is that I've never seen Seattle at the top of that list.

I've heard it being Portland a lot of times. And places like Livonia. And Scranton. And Warren. But never Seattle.

Here's one listing from several years ago which lists four major metro areas ahead of Seattle in terms of "whiteness" but it also puts some qualifications on their study (I believe he's taking the statistics from the 2000 census):

http://everything2.com/index.pl?node...&lastnode_id=0

Can you provide me with an accurate reference? I'm curious about it. I'd like to see some stats from a reliable source. I hope I'm not sounding like I'm necessarily challenging you on this but, as I say, I'm curious and would like to get an accurate reference on it.

Thanks.

--'rocco

[Embraer]

Actually the "whitest"-that term is subjective-city in American with a pop of over 200k is Scottsdale, Arizona from a percentage stand point.

Like rocco said Livonia and Portland are pretty high ranked as well. On a state level the whitest would be Maine.

I also have never seen Seattle in any kind of study or statistic being mentioned as the whitest city in America.

[cmurray]

Originally Posted by rob1in

To Symi81,

I'm not saying that liberals are not progressive, I for one am a liberal from New York City. All I am saying is that in N.Y.C. and San Fran the the liberals for the most part take care of them selves and look decent. Most N.Y. and San Fran intellectuals are super liberal, yet you don't have to look like crap while being it.(or smell bad). I am a liberal from New York City, but I sure as hell have enough respect for myself to look somewhat decent. Liberals are supposed to be progressive, the more intelligent ones, yet I look at these pictures and I can state that the whole rebellious teen side of liberalism just looks visually gross. I would feel the same way about a conservative in Arkansas driving around in a nasty sweatshirt and baseball cap with a wife beater underneith chewing tabacco. That's just as bad and it HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH INDIVIDUALISM. It just looks bad. So im my mind, the hippie in seattle is just as an eyesore are the redneck in Arkansas, since they both equally look like crap. Now your probably going to call me superficial and shallow but I am more of an intellectual. I don't like the whole L.A./Miami/Las Vegas superficial thing . I'm a New Yorker at heart and love New York City liberalism since not only is it mentally and emotionaly progressive, it is also visually and physically as well. The reason I started this thread was I was just curious on which city had more because I was debating with a friend about it and he said more were in San Fran and I said seattle. That's All.

First, let me say that I'm a social moderate and fiscal conservative, so in no way am I biased toward liberals...but could it be that liberal is not the correct term for this group of people? No doubt they ARE liberal - but I think the thing that defines them is that they are often teenagers and college students who think that in order to do important things, one must be radical and one must be noticable. If that means not bathing or brushing their hair, well its a small price to pay for being "important". I've found that most of these "types" eventually outgrow such childish behavior.

Perhaps the reason New York has fewer of these "types" is because it is a social climate that by nature is more formal. Seattle has long been known for being laid-back. I suspect this attitude is attractive to students trying to "find themselves".

[41Willys]

SFO houses are 3-4X more expensive then Seattle homes. Hippies or no hippies!