Why are some people here afraid to travel in the US? (Seattle: insurance, violent crime)

[shoegal111]

Originally Posted by Radnor

Blame Ted Bundy I guess!

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Don't forget about the Green River killer, then there was the guy who was targeting tourists on the Ferries. If I remember correctly, befriended them, asked for a ride somewhere and killed them and then there is the left foot mystery of Puget Sound. Still seems a bit off that this is not being treated as suspicious.

[shoegal111]

Originally Posted by jenlion

I keep running into something around here and I'm wondering what the deal is.

I mention plans to go camping. People say, "Is that safe?!" Simple, campground, here's-your-tent-pad-here's-your-fireplace-here's-your-picnic-table kind of car camping. And they think it's not safe? I got the third degree: you sleep in a TENT? Around other people in TENTS? They just have zippers? how do you know the other people are safe? etc.

Or, I'm going to take a trip to Glacier National Park this summer (finally!) and people say oh, that'd be so nice, but so dangerous. Huh? So long as your car is reliable, it's not dangerous in the least. Don't wear huckleberry-scented sunblock and go for long walks alone in the woods. But they're convinced it's not safe to go there.

Some of it seems to be cultural; I'm hearing this mostly from people from India and Egypt and elsewhere (but I don't know where it comes from exactly. Isn't traveling within India, for example, relatively safe for an Indian of relative status? Or no?). But even local people seem to be doing it too. Maybe I spent too many years in Texas, but it's really weird to me to hear people talk about being afraid of taking well-trodden paths in the US.

My son's daycare teacher actually asked if she and her husband could come along on our trip to Glacier, because they really want to see it, but don't want to go "alone", not safe.

Huh????

Oh yeah, I also forgot to mention that the whole "us v. them"/Seattle Freeze thing probably is somewhat in play here. In other words, we want to go but we don't want to have to deal with anybody that isn't a Seattlite.

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by jenlion

Certainly I can understand leisure-travel isn't a good choice if you're barely scraping by. But the "fear" I'm seeing is with folks who have the ability and means to travel. Two that I saw in the same day: Couple from India, he works at Microsoft, she works at a daycare, no kids, one car, like to see places and do things, not struggling, just literally afraid to point the car at the mountains and go for a long drive. And hikes, even on popular trails, but going as a couple alone? Not a chance. They would only do it in a caravan. Too dangerous. I'm missing something there, I don't understand why that would be seen as dangerous. I'm assuming there's something I just don't know about worldview, and I'm trying to understand it. Another was a couple of other daycare-employees with employed SOs, no kids/grown kids, who grew UP here, one in college now, seem middle to upper-middle class, and they are afraid of camping. I can understand, say, a distaste for it - beds are generally more comfortable, and if campfires and stars and the breeze in the trees don't do it for you, then why bother - but they are *afraid* to sleep in a tent where the bogeyman might come get them. It's not money, it's fear of something happening to them! As though a rapist that lives in the trees has been waiting for them to arrive and will prey as soon as they fall asleep! Seriously? I can think of a FEW well-publicized cases where people have come to serious harm on the trail or while camping. Like, four. In my entire LIFE. Out of the thousands of campgrounds filled to the brim all the time. (I'm sure more people have been harmed; I'm thinking of what I know hits the news). They say they'd like to try it, but it just doesn't seem "safe". And everyone around is just nodding in agreement. Seriously? You think you're safe in a house with glass windows, all alone, but not in a campground full of people that can HEAR you scream? Boggles my mind. It makes NO sense to me.

Last year two Seattle women were murdered on a trail in the Seattle area. The killer was never caught. Some people are very sensitive to and anxious about such stories. It would make me think twice about hiking in this area alone.

[W & C]

Originally Posted by Jennibc

Last year two Seattle women were murdered on a trail in the Seattle area. The killer was never caught. Some people are very sensitive to and anxious about such stories. It would make me think twice about hiking in this area alone.

It was 2006, actually.

Another case in Oregon woods , exactly four years ago, there was a story about on CNN.com today.

Couple, loyal dog shot to death on camping trip - CNN.com

I still think the possibility of it happening is pretty remote, but these two cases make you think twice

[nutleynut]

Originally Posted by jenlion

Certainly I can understand leisure-travel isn't a good choice if you're barely scraping by. But the "fear" I'm seeing is with folks who have the ability and means to travel. Two that I saw in the same day: Couple from India, he works at Microsoft, she works at a daycare, no kids, one car, like to see places and do things, not struggling, just literally afraid to point the car at the mountains and go for a long drive. And hikes, even on popular trails, but going as a couple alone? Not a chance. They would only do it in a caravan. Too dangerous. I'm missing something there, I don't understand why that would be seen as dangerous. I'm assuming there's something I just don't know about worldview, and I'm trying to understand it. Another was a couple of other daycare-employees with employed SOs, no kids/grown kids, who grew UP here, one in college now, seem middle to upper-middle class, and they are afraid of camping. I can understand, say, a distaste for it - beds are generally more comfortable, and if campfires and stars and the breeze in the trees don't do it for you, then why bother - but they are *afraid* to sleep in a tent where the bogeyman might come get them. It's not money, it's fear of something happening to them! As though a rapist that lives in the trees has been waiting for them to arrive and will prey as soon as they fall asleep! Seriously? I can think of a FEW well-publicized cases where people have come to serious harm on the trail or while camping. Like, four. In my entire LIFE. Out of the thousands of campgrounds filled to the brim all the time. (I'm sure more people have been harmed; I'm thinking of what I know hits the news). They say they'd like to try it, but it just doesn't seem "safe". And everyone around is just nodding in agreement. Seriously? You think you're safe in a house with glass windows, all alone, but not in a campground full of people that can HEAR you scream? Boggles my mind. It makes NO sense to me.

That Indian couple may have a residual fear because of where the lived in India or because they are just not adventurous people.
The fear I was speaking of comes from the ignorance poverty inflicts upon the people in that situation.
Having also lived in large cities where people never travel more than 20 miles for anything and that is a chore. It is hard to travel distance in a population center I can see how going somewhere completely unfamiliar might seem just too far.

I haven't said but I do know the sorts of fearful people that you speak of and they are not limited to the State of Washington.
I think maybe you are just noticing this aspect/outlook for the first time. There are an awful lot of people who do not do things out of fear. I didn't meet people like yourself until I was in my thirties, until then I only ever knew fearful people and thought that it was normal to be that way.

BTW the best sleep I've ever gotten has always been under the stars and on the ground.

[seattlerain]

Originally Posted by shoegal111

Oh yeah, I also forgot to mention that the whole "us v. them"/Seattle Freeze thing probably is somewhat in play here. In other words, we want to go but we don't want to have to deal with anybody that isn't a Seattlite.

I highly doubt that the alleged Seattle Freeze has anything to do with this situation.

[Jennibc]

Originally Posted by W & C

It was 2006, actually.

Another case in Oregon woods , exactly four years ago, there was a story about on CNN.com today.

Couple, loyal dog shot to death on camping trip - CNN.com

I still think the possibility of it happening is pretty remote, but these two cases make you think twice

Man, am I ever getting old - three years seeming like just a year ago. Sorry for the factual misrepresentation.

[seattlerain]

Originally Posted by Jennibc

Man, am I ever getting old - three years seeming like just a year ago. Sorry for the factual misrepresentation.

Don't feel bad...I was 20 years old in the summer of 1974 when Ted Bundy kidnapped those two women at Lake Sammamish, and it feels like last year too!

[obsidian97]

Originally Posted by Jennibc

Last year two Seattle women were murdered on a trail in the Seattle area. The killer was never caught. Some people are very sensitive to and anxious about such stories. It would make me think twice about hiking in this area alone.

Originally Posted by seattlerain

Don't feel bad...I was 20 years old in the summer of 1974 when Ted Bundy kidnapped those two women at Lake Sammamish, and it feels like last year too!

Ted Bundy was the first person aside from the construction crews to take SR-20 through the North Cascades NP (he was the driver of the limo carrying the governor).

If you were out in the park hiking you were safer than if you were on SR-20 at the time in terms of proximity to a madman. It's all relative.

Besides, it seems like more people easily die each year in the local rivers than you hear about getting into trouble in the backwoods with a stranger. Heck, US-2 is more dangerous.

[jenlion]

OK, this is weird.

The story about the couple and the dog in Oregon is currently front-page cnn: "After 4 years, death of couple and dog a mystery"